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Discussion in 'General Electronics Discussion' started by psunlock, Aug 19, 2013.

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  1. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
    please enlighten me and pardon my silly questions thanks


    1: how can i produce a 3.30 mhz rf carrier signal with modulation of 8,020 hz

    2: can a normal signal generator be used in conjuction with an rf amplifier to produce
    harmonic sound on 767,035 hz , how can it be heard with just an aerial?

    3: which type of aerial could i use to produce 767,035 hz with an amplification of 150 to 200 watts

    excuse my ignorance i am 2 days old in this field


    the 3.30 Megahertz RF harmonic carrier frequency and the audio frequencies are combined or modulated together they will produce many harmonic sideband frequencies
    i want to know how i can acheive this cheaply and then how to amplifiy its output by 100 to 200 watts legally of course i am in a country that has no law on these matters
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2013
  2. (*steve*)

    (*steve*) ¡sǝpodᴉʇuɐ ǝɥʇ ɹɐǝɥd Moderator

    25,490
    2,831
    Jan 21, 2010
    Perhaps it might be worthwhile knowing exactly what you intend to do.

    Some of what you ask is confused (e.g. amplification is not measured in watts, aerials don't amplify, you can't hear things with an aerial, etc...)
     
  3. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
    thanks for replying i am trying to build one of these

    http://www.rifevideos.com/aubrey_scoons_1939_rife_beam_ray.html

    i have found so much disinfo on net its almost unbeleiveable but i strongly beleive that this tech works and is simple its just a question of power and rf carrier waves

    any help would be loved also i would want real free thinkers help not help that you found posted by trolls or gremlins

    thanks
     
  4. BobK

    BobK

    7,682
    1,688
    Jan 5, 2010
    Time for the woo-woo label:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Rife

    Bob
     
  5. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
    ok i asked for that haha

    but i have seen this tech working so i just want to clarify what is possible and what isnt in the electronic side of things


    i want to produce an rf signal from 20 hz to 200 khz with a output power of at least 100 watts

    i want it to be varible so maybe some sort of signal gen?

    i found this scheme of an amp http://www.rifevideos.com/images/Chapter 11-2/booster.jpg

    can anyone enlighten me on how powerfull it is and if it can be amplified further

    thanks again
     
  6. BobK

    BobK

    7,682
    1,688
    Jan 5, 2010
    That is a class AB audio amp, and I don't see how it could possibly work since the gain of the voltage amplifier is only a little over 1, and it claims to output 66V p-p from a 2V p-p input.

    I suggest that you read the Wiki article. People have died by using useless Rife machines instead of treatments that actually work.

    Bob
     
  7. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
    correct me if i am wrong but isnt that the signal input ?

    the power input is 230 volts at top left ?
     
  8. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
    such glorious disscussion and advice truely inspireing a post from wikipedia and some bull and lifes good again huh ?

    forums dont grow on these principles but on free exspression and thinking

    reasearch who plato and aristotle are they started the forum for alike minded philoposhy

    i am very disapointed so far

    and yes i know i mispell words .....
     
  9. BobK

    BobK

    7,682
    1,688
    Jan 5, 2010
    Yes, the power input is 230 volts, but that has nothing to do with what I said. If the signal input is 2V p-p and the output is 66 V p-p there must be a voltage gain of 33. But this amplifier has practically no voltage gain as drawn. Put a bypass capacitor on the emitter resistor and it might work.

    In any case, it will not help you with amplifying RF frequencies.

    Bob
     
  10. davenn

    davenn Moderator

    13,812
    1,945
    Sep 5, 2009
    forums like this and other electronics related ones, grow on good information and correct physics.
    There's very little that you have given do far that falls into either of those 2 catagories

    since you are an admitted newbie in electronics, it would be really wise for you to start doing some electronics and physics tutorials and learn correctly the way things work in the real world. Diving deep into high power transmitter projects IS NOT the way to start into electronics. Learn to walk before you try and run :)

    this comment from you is just totally irresponsible....
    I dont care what regulations your country has ... but power levels of 100 - 200 W at 3MHz is going to go world wide and your activities would upset many many people far beyond your country's borders

    Again your lack of basic knowledge stops you from seeing the problems
    if you want to do it legally ... join an amateur radio club, learn the electronics and get your licence :)


    Dave
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2013
  11. (*steve*)

    (*steve*) ¡sǝpodᴉʇuɐ ǝɥʇ ɹɐǝɥd Moderator

    25,490
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    Jan 21, 2010
    One of the tubes used there looks a bit like an x-ray tube, but the internal discharge suggests it has gas in it.

    So it probably produces UV and maybe x-rays.

    I wouldn't want to be within coo-ee of it when it was operating.

    Simply as a safety matter, I'd recommend you not try to create one of these. Similarly, in the interests of safety, you're not going to get much help. As mentioned elsewhere there are other concerns too.
     
  12. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
    ok well thanks for warnings and such

    lets talk theoretical for now

    can you tell me why 300wats 3mhz would be seen worldwide>?


    thanks
     
  13. (*steve*)

    (*steve*) ¡sǝpodᴉʇuɐ ǝɥʇ ɹɐǝɥd Moderator

    25,490
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    Jan 21, 2010
    Because that amount of RF at that frequency if coupled to a reasonable antenna could propagate a very long way.

    It is also in a range of frequencies used for serious purposes and where the legitimate users would probably track you down and have (at the very least) some stern words with you.
     
  14. davenn

    davenn Moderator

    13,812
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    Sep 5, 2009
    The fact that even have to ask that question confirms you have no idea of what you are trying to do and the intereference you would cause.

    3MHz will propagate worldwide with as little as a few watts. There's a whole group of amateur radio operaters that specialise in what's called QRP operation. They work the world on 5 Watts or less. So imagine the impact you would have with 100 - 200 Watts !!!

    The rest of us amateur radio operators believe life is too short for QRP only operation and we will pretty must, most of the time, us the maximum power levels we are allowed to according to our licence rules. In Australia, where I am, I'm allowed 400W PEP maximum ( PEP = Peak Envelope Power). But usually I use the maximum out of the radio ( without an external amplifier) which for most HF radios is 100 Watts.

    The HF radio frequencies ... 1 MHz to 30 MHz are used for world wide propagation by commercial and amateur radio stations. These frequencies get the long distance because they reflect very well off the ionospheric layers that surround the earth high up in the atmosphere.

    cheers
    Dave
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2013
  15. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
    fantastic info so far and yes you keep poitning out that i dunno what i am talking about but its a field i got into recently so bear with me

    my other question is if i have a signal generator which gens a signal varibly from 0.01 hz to 8mhz and it has 2 channels is it possible to mix the channel output ?

    like for example one channel produces a carrier wave and the other produces a piggyback signal ??


    i suppose what i am getting at is can i bypass a radio oscilator and connect the signal gen directly to my homemade rf amp

    thanks again

    p.s the aerial i would have used would be localized somehow ;)
     
  16. Harald Kapp

    Harald Kapp Moderator Moderator

    11,443
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    Nov 17, 2011
    8mHz = 8 millihertz - certainly not what you mean. 8 Megahertz is abbreviated 8 MHz. Take care to use the the right capitalization to ensure common understanding.

    On top of this I doubt that you will find a generator that goes from 0.01Hz to 8MHz.
     
  17. psunlock

    psunlock

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    Aug 19, 2013
  18. davenn

    davenn Moderator

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    Sep 5, 2009
    if you mix 2 signals, 5MHZ and 3MHz, then you will have the 2 sums of those 2 frequencies ... that is 2 output signals
    5+3 = 8MHz and you will also have the sum of 5-3 = 2MHz

    there will also be harmonics present.
    In a radio receiver or transmitter we will decide which of the 2 output signals it is that we want and we will filter out the other one. We will also have a low pass filter that will filter out the harmonics that occur at intervals up the radio bands ( spectrum).

    The last thing we want is a "dirty" transmitter that is spewing out signal all over the spectrum as well as the one frequency we want to use

    At 3 MHz, a tuned antenna is large ... even just a basic wire antenna. extremely difficult to make any sort of antenna that would have only localised coverage

    Dave
     
  19. psunlock

    psunlock

    18
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    Aug 19, 2013
    0.01Hz - 10MHz(UDB1210)
    Resolution 0.01Hz(10mHz)
    Frequency Stability +/-1x10-6
    Frequency accuracy +/-5x0-6
    Sine wave distortion <=0.8%(reference frequency is 1kHz)
    Trinagle linearity >=98%(0.01Hz-10kHz)
    Rise and fall time of square wave <=100ns
    Square Wave Duty range 1%-99%(digital control mode)
     
  20. davenn

    davenn Moderator

    13,812
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    Sep 5, 2009
    that's not a real problem these days Harald :) tho it would be unnecessary in most situations .... 10kHz and up is more common and more useable

    that's a nice little DDS synth :)
    DDS = Direct Digital Synthesis synthesiser

    my main signal generator in my shack goes from 10kHz to 8.4 GHz
    gets used for a lot of my microwave experiments and tuning up of gear

    Dave
     
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