Sony Wega horizontal position

[David Jordan]

Hello all,

I'm trying to set the geometry on a Sony KV32DX20U. I've got a problem
with the 'Horizontal Position' setting, I adjusted the value down to
zero when trying to center the picture and it's now stuck there. When
I try to increase the value from 0 the picture flicks slightly to the
left and then back again and the setting doesn't change.

I've powered down the set but it didn't help.

The picture is now much too far to the right. Can anybody help?


Thanks,
Dave.

 

[David]

Have the service manual?
Sony has specific warnings not to set certain service mode values to ZERO as
it can damage the components in the tv set. I would have to check to be
sure if that was one of the no-no zero parameters. But it might be time to
call a Sony trained service out for a look at the set.

David

 

[Jerry G.]

In the service mode, it is possible to over set some of the ranges and do
damage to the respective circuits. You will have to get the service manual,
and go through the control circuits to troubleshoot what was damaged if this
is the case. Without going through the set myself, there is no point to
guess at this.

In some parts of the service set-ups, if the values are put out of range,
the software will run away on itself, and may not cause damage. In this
case, if the bad settings were saved, the uPC would have to be changed in
order to bring back its operation. In this case, a complete factory type
alignment of the set would be required. Only the well equipped service shops
for the Sony products would be able to do this type of work for you.

You will require the proper tools, test and calibration equipment, and
service manuals to properly service your set, if there is a complex fault,
or calibration required. At this point, you may be best off take the set
over to the Sony authorized service centre, and let them fix it.

The only thing I can suggest is that if you did not save your damage, you
can unplug the set from the mains for about 20 seconds. Plug it back in,
and the settings you messed up may have not been written permanently. If
you saved the damage, you will have to contact a service shop that can do
this level of required work on your set.

Never put ranges of any adjustments to the end, when in the service menu,
unless it is specified to do so in the service manual, or you definitely
know you can do it.

If you have to change things in the set-up of the set and it was working
before, this is the wrong way to fix the set. If the performance of the set
changed by itself, there are failed components, and these should be changed
to fix the set.

--

Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg GLG Technologies GLG
=========================================
WebPage http://www.zoom-one.com
Electronics http://www.zoom-one.com/electron.htm
=========================================


Hello all,

I'm trying to set the geometry on a Sony KV32DX20U. I've got a problem
with the 'Horizontal Position' setting, I adjusted the value down to
zero when trying to center the picture and it's now stuck there. When
I try to increase the value from 0 the picture flicks slightly to the
left and then back again and the setting doesn't change.

I've powered down the set but it didn't help.

The picture is now much too far to the right. Can anybody help?


Thanks,
Dave.

 

[David Jordan]

Have the service manual?
Sony has specific warnings not to set certain service mode values to ZERO as
it can damage the components in the tv set. I would have to check to be
sure if that was one of the no-no zero parameters. But it might be time to
call a Sony trained service out for a look at the set.

Nope, no service manual.

What kind of damage could it cause? It seems unlikely any has been
done as all of the other modes are still correct, it is only the
"Wide" mode that is affected.

It seems odd for this to be a hardware fault, if it were wouldn't the
picture remain where it was, whatever the setting in the menu? This is
an inability to change the setting in the menu which seem like more of
a software fault/feature.

I would appreciate the info from the service manual, it would be nice
to know one way or the other.


Thanks,
Dave

 

[Leonard Caillouet]

Your assumptions about what you can and cannot do have gotten you into this
mess, so you might want to consider taking the good advice given before
making any more. Hopefully you recorded exactly everything that you
adjusted so someone who is familiar with these sets can sort out the
problem. It might take a system reset and realignment or perhaps component
replacement. Don't proceed without at least getting the service and
training manuals.

Leonard Caillouet

 

[David Jordan]

Your assumptions about what you can and cannot do have gotten you into this
mess, so you might want to consider taking the good advice given before

I'm not sure in what spirit you meant this.

Isn't an assumption an educated guess based on previous experience,
observations, knowledge of similar devices... How can you ever fix
anything, or even USE anything without making basic assumptions about
it.

When I use a toaster I ASSUME it's not going to melt through the floor
in a thermite like blob or explode like a lump of C4 destroying most
of the house.

When I fix, say, a camera out of an SM placement machine. I ASSUME
it's going to have (several) power supplies, data lines for
controlling focus/exposure etc, either composite video or video with
separate syncs - PROBABLY 50/60Hz vertical and around 15kHz horizontal
or it may be some freaky digital interface that MIGHT still have
obvious sync information.

It's NICE to have full service manuals, schematics, hotline to the
engineers in the company who designed the thing... but it's not always
possible.

That said, I ALWAYS appreciate GOOD advice from any source.

making any more. Hopefully you recorded exactly everything that you
adjusted so someone who is familiar with these sets can sort out the

Don't *ASSUME* people are stupid. I *KNOW* there are "dangerous"
options in the menu, I am only interested in geometry adjustments.

All I want to do is improve the annoying pincushion distortion, center
the picture and MAYBE change that very dark grey background into
black.

I'm sure you've seen these menus, they're very friendly. Proper mixed
case english descriptions, no obscure abbreviations. Anybody who
understands the concepts of pincushion, trapezoid etc. adjustments
(anybody who has fiddled with a newish monitor) would have no problem
understanding it.

Maybe we need a secret handshake of the "I can talk about bandgaps,
potential wells and quantum tunnelling without my head exploding.
Shame about anybody listening" kind.

problem. It might take a system reset and realignment or perhaps component

But how do you find someone who's GOOD at doing that?

replacement. Don't proceed without at least getting the service and
training manuals.

It's not always that easy...


Anyway, I took another look at it today to clarify the fault (always
handy when trying to fix something or seek correct help).

With an RGB input, it is possible to adjust the horizontal position.
This is now correct and the picture is centered and square.

With a broadcast DTV signal any attempt to adjust the horizontal
position causes the setting to jump to zero (from where it was set
while in RGB mode) and stick there.

With the picture centered in RGB mode the DTV signal displays around
15mm too far right. It would be nice if there is an adjustable offset
between DTV and RGB but if not I'll leave the RGB input centered as
this is used far more for DVD/DVR/Satellite.

I've read brief suggestions about the grey/black thing but nothing
concrete.

All of these problems are with the "Wide" mode. "Smart" mode is good
enough and I'll leave realigning the 4:3 and 14:9 modes for now as
these are rarely used and I wouldn't want to make any unnecessary
adjustments


Dave.

 

[psuedonym]

there may have been some hope, before you monkeyed with the controls.
You picked the worst one to change.

I gaurantee you have more bad parts now than when you started.


If the set stopped doing something it was supposed to, or started
doing something it wasn't supposed to, there is a failure.

All the peaking and tweaking in the world won't fix it.

Why do you people always think that you can fix it with a "golden
screwdriver", (onscreen, in this case)_ even though you have _NO IDEA_
what you are doing?

By the time you're done, what you will have is a 32 inch boat anchor...

 

[Art]

AS SUGGESTED get your set to a SONY Repair Facility. Tell them what you did
so they don't spend a lot of time looking for something other than your
FUBAR! The bite the bullet and pay for the repair. No: we are not trying to
say you are an idiot for doing this, just for not listening to the very good
advice that has been posted by others trying to actually assist you. IMHO

 

[Leonard Caillouet]

I'm not sure in what spirit you meant this.

In the spirit of best solving your problem without wasting more time and
effort.

Isn't an assumption an educated guess based on previous experience,
observations, knowledge of similar devices... How can you ever fix
anything, or even USE anything without making basic assumptions about
it.

Educated is the key word. You asumed that you could tweak harmlessly in the
service parameters...you were obviously wrong. My point is simply to either
do your homework before making the assumptions needed to fix your set or
take it to someone who has the experience to sort it out.

When I use a toaster I ASSUME it's not going to melt through the floor
in a thermite like blob or explode like a lump of C4 destroying most
of the house.

You are not working on a toaster. This is a problem with TV service.
People assume it is like working with toasters...

When I fix, say, a camera out of an SM placement machine. I ASSUME
it's going to have (several) power supplies, data lines for
controlling focus/exposure etc, either composite video or video with
separate syncs - PROBABLY 50/60Hz vertical and around 15kHz horizontal
or it may be some freaky digital interface that MIGHT still have
obvious sync information.

Do you make assumptions about what might be travelling on that interface and
the effects dicking with it might have? Without checking first? Do you
make changes to operating frequencies and phase without knowing the
potential effects?

It's NICE to have full service manuals, schematics, hotline to the
engineers in the company who designed the thing... but it's not always
possible.

You takes your chances if you don't wnat to invest in the documentation and
training...

That said, I ALWAYS appreciate GOOD advice from any source.


Don't *ASSUME* people are stupid. I *KNOW* there are "dangerous"
options in the menu, I am only interested in geometry adjustments.

Didn't intend to indicate that you are stupid, just that you made some bad
assumptions. If you knew enough to adjust the geometry on a set like this
effectively, you would know enough to be careful about the rfange of certain
settings. Not stupid, necessarily, but uninformed.

All I want to do is improve the annoying pincushion distortion, center
the picture and MAYBE change that very dark grey background into
black.

With a direct view set these may not be easily corrected. There are
potentially mechanical, magnetic, and electronic adjustments that can effect
geometry changes and the three can interact in a messy way sometimes.
Knowing the specific model well helps because you are more likely to make
corect assumptions about what can and cannot likely be corrected.

I'm sure you've seen these menus, they're very friendly. Proper mixed
case english descriptions, no obscure abbreviations. Anybody who
understands the concepts of pincushion, trapezoid etc. adjustments
(anybody who has fiddled with a newish monitor) would have no problem
understanding it.

That does not mean that you can solve the problem easily...

Maybe we need a secret handshake of the "I can talk about bandgaps,
potential wells and quantum tunnelling without my head exploding.
Shame about anybody listening" kind.

Maybe you jsut need some experience or to do some homework and get the
training manual and service manuals, proper test equipment, and experience
to do the job, or take it to someone that has such. Maybe you should start
by reading the online info that is free that discusses the matter.

component

But how do you find someone who's GOOD at doing that?

Talk to the local techs about the problem. Any that will not discuss it
specifically and talk in very vague and general terms don't likely have the
experience. Any that tell you anything that does not include a warning that
only so much correction is likely posssible is full of crap. Post your
location and ask for recommendations in your area. Be a smart consumer...

It's not always that easy...

The experience doesn't come easily with respect to geometry on CRTs. The
manuals are not that hard to come by.

Anyway, I took another look at it today to clarify the fault (always
handy when trying to fix something or seek correct help).

With an RGB input, it is possible to adjust the horizontal position.
This is now correct and the picture is centered and square.

With a broadcast DTV signal any attempt to adjust the horizontal
position causes the setting to jump to zero (from where it was set
while in RGB mode) and stick there.

My guess is that you did no harm to any hardware but have a parameter
combination that the micro doesn't like. I'd recommend buying or fishing
around for the documentation and maybe doing a reset after recording the
existing parameter values.

With the picture centered in RGB mode the DTV signal displays around
15mm too far right. It would be nice if there is an adjustable offset
between DTV and RGB but if not I'll leave the RGB input centered as
this is used far more for DVD/DVR/Satellite.

Not sure on this model about these adjustments. I'd have to do some
homework.

I've read brief suggestions about the grey/black thing but nothing
concrete.

Look in AVS forum. There is likely something there.

All of these problems are with the "Wide" mode. "Smart" mode is good
enough and I'll leave realigning the 4:3 and 14:9 modes for now as
these are rarely used and I wouldn't want to make any unnecessary
adjustments

Leonard Caillouet (to email me drop the NOSPAM)

 

[Leonard Caillouet]

there may have been some hope, before you monkeyed with the controls.
You picked the worst one to change.

I gaurantee you have more bad parts now than when you started.

One of those assumptions that I was talking about...

If the set stopped doing something it was supposed to, or started
doing something it wasn't supposed to, there is a failure.

Do you have some specific reason to make this assumption or are you just
blowing smoke? Techs who jump to conclusions like this without actually
checking anything out are as bad as consumers who screw with things that
they should not. Worse, actually, because you should know better.

All the peaking and tweaking in the world won't fix it.

Why do you people always think that you can fix it with a "golden
screwdriver", (onscreen, in this case)_ even though you have _NO IDEA_
what you are doing?

By the time you're done, what you will have is a 32 inch boat anchor...

Maybe, but more likely will have just wasted some time and maybe some money.
the guy is obviously not completely naive, just operating on weak
information and no experience.

Leonard Caillouet

 

[David Jordan]

Educated is the key word. You asumed that you could tweak harmlessly in the
service parameters...you were obviously wrong. My point is simply to either

It's not the first time, anybody who's fixed UPSs gets to know what
the inside of FETs look like

do your homework before making the assumptions needed to fix your set or
take it to someone who has the experience to sort it out.

Good advice. I spent a lot of time on the net trying to find info
about this, there's plenty for NTSC FX60s but these seem to have very
different menus to the DXs. And who decided that a simple thing like
TT settings should be different on EVERY SINGLE SET?

You are not working on a toaster. This is a problem with TV service.
People assume it is like working with toasters...

Tell me about it... Anything they don't understand has to be simple.
Do salespeople get bonuses depending on how many rules of physics they
break?

With a direct view set these may not be easily corrected. There are
potentially mechanical, magnetic, and electronic adjustments that can effect


Talk to the local techs about the problem. Any that will not discuss it
specifically and talk in very vague and general terms don't likely have the
experience. Any that tell you anything that does not include a warning that
only so much correction is likely posssible is full of crap. Post your
location and ask for recommendations in your area. Be a smart consumer...

I appreciate there's only so much improvement that can be made. Large
screens must be harder than smaller screens and very flat ones like
Wegas can't make the job any easier... though they do mean you can
hold a ruler up to the screen to make sure the edges are square

The experience doesn't come easily with respect to geometry on CRTs. The
manuals are not that hard to come by.

The info is hard to come by online. I had a shock when I got a 2nd
hand TDS scope and found the service manual with schematics and setup
info on Tek's web site. We need more companies like that...


Dave.