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Sony Wega horizontal position

Discussion in 'Electronic Repair' started by David Jordan, Dec 27, 2003.

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  1. David Jordan

    David Jordan Guest

    Hello all,

    I'm trying to set the geometry on a Sony KV32DX20U. I've got a problem
    with the 'Horizontal Position' setting, I adjusted the value down to
    zero when trying to center the picture and it's now stuck there. When
    I try to increase the value from 0 the picture flicks slightly to the
    left and then back again and the setting doesn't change.

    I've powered down the set but it didn't help.

    The picture is now much too far to the right. Can anybody help?


    Thanks,
    Dave.
     
  2. David

    David Guest

    Have the service manual?
    Sony has specific warnings not to set certain service mode values to ZERO as
    it can damage the components in the tv set. I would have to check to be
    sure if that was one of the no-no zero parameters. But it might be time to
    call a Sony trained service out for a look at the set.

    David
     
  3. Jerry G.

    Jerry G. Guest

    In the service mode, it is possible to over set some of the ranges and do
    damage to the respective circuits. You will have to get the service manual,
    and go through the control circuits to troubleshoot what was damaged if this
    is the case. Without going through the set myself, there is no point to
    guess at this.

    In some parts of the service set-ups, if the values are put out of range,
    the software will run away on itself, and may not cause damage. In this
    case, if the bad settings were saved, the uPC would have to be changed in
    order to bring back its operation. In this case, a complete factory type
    alignment of the set would be required. Only the well equipped service shops
    for the Sony products would be able to do this type of work for you.

    You will require the proper tools, test and calibration equipment, and
    service manuals to properly service your set, if there is a complex fault,
    or calibration required. At this point, you may be best off take the set
    over to the Sony authorized service centre, and let them fix it.

    The only thing I can suggest is that if you did not save your damage, you
    can unplug the set from the mains for about 20 seconds. Plug it back in,
    and the settings you messed up may have not been written permanently. If
    you saved the damage, you will have to contact a service shop that can do
    this level of required work on your set.

    Never put ranges of any adjustments to the end, when in the service menu,
    unless it is specified to do so in the service manual, or you definitely
    know you can do it.

    If you have to change things in the set-up of the set and it was working
    before, this is the wrong way to fix the set. If the performance of the set
    changed by itself, there are failed components, and these should be changed
    to fix the set.

    --

    Greetings,

    Jerry Greenberg GLG Technologies GLG
    =========================================
    WebPage http://www.zoom-one.com
    Electronics http://www.zoom-one.com/electron.htm
    =========================================


    Hello all,

    I'm trying to set the geometry on a Sony KV32DX20U. I've got a problem
    with the 'Horizontal Position' setting, I adjusted the value down to
    zero when trying to center the picture and it's now stuck there. When
    I try to increase the value from 0 the picture flicks slightly to the
    left and then back again and the setting doesn't change.

    I've powered down the set but it didn't help.

    The picture is now much too far to the right. Can anybody help?


    Thanks,
    Dave.
     
  4. David Jordan

    David Jordan Guest

    Nope, no service manual.

    What kind of damage could it cause? It seems unlikely any has been
    done as all of the other modes are still correct, it is only the
    "Wide" mode that is affected.

    It seems odd for this to be a hardware fault, if it were wouldn't the
    picture remain where it was, whatever the setting in the menu? This is
    an inability to change the setting in the menu which seem like more of
    a software fault/feature.

    I would appreciate the info from the service manual, it would be nice
    to know one way or the other.


    Thanks,
    Dave
     
  5. Your assumptions about what you can and cannot do have gotten you into this
    mess, so you might want to consider taking the good advice given before
    making any more. Hopefully you recorded exactly everything that you
    adjusted so someone who is familiar with these sets can sort out the
    problem. It might take a system reset and realignment or perhaps component
    replacement. Don't proceed without at least getting the service and
    training manuals.

    Leonard Caillouet
     
  6. David Jordan

    David Jordan Guest

    I'm not sure in what spirit you meant this.

    Isn't an assumption an educated guess based on previous experience,
    observations, knowledge of similar devices... How can you ever fix
    anything, or even USE anything without making basic assumptions about
    it.

    When I use a toaster I ASSUME it's not going to melt through the floor
    in a thermite like blob or explode like a lump of C4 destroying most
    of the house.

    When I fix, say, a camera out of an SM placement machine. I ASSUME
    it's going to have (several) power supplies, data lines for
    controlling focus/exposure etc, either composite video or video with
    separate syncs - PROBABLY 50/60Hz vertical and around 15kHz horizontal
    or it may be some freaky digital interface that MIGHT still have
    obvious sync information.

    It's NICE to have full service manuals, schematics, hotline to the
    engineers in the company who designed the thing... but it's not always
    possible.

    That said, I ALWAYS appreciate GOOD advice from any source.
    Don't *ASSUME* people are stupid. I *KNOW* there are "dangerous"
    options in the menu, I am only interested in geometry adjustments.

    All I want to do is improve the annoying pincushion distortion, center
    the picture and MAYBE change that very dark grey background into
    black.

    I'm sure you've seen these menus, they're very friendly. Proper mixed
    case english descriptions, no obscure abbreviations. Anybody who
    understands the concepts of pincushion, trapezoid etc. adjustments
    (anybody who has fiddled with a newish monitor) would have no problem
    understanding it.

    Maybe we need a secret handshake of the "I can talk about bandgaps,
    potential wells and quantum tunnelling without my head exploding.
    Shame about anybody listening" kind.
    But how do you find someone who's GOOD at doing that?
    It's not always that easy...


    Anyway, I took another look at it today to clarify the fault (always
    handy when trying to fix something or seek correct help).

    With an RGB input, it is possible to adjust the horizontal position.
    This is now correct and the picture is centered and square.

    With a broadcast DTV signal any attempt to adjust the horizontal
    position causes the setting to jump to zero (from where it was set
    while in RGB mode) and stick there.

    With the picture centered in RGB mode the DTV signal displays around
    15mm too far right. It would be nice if there is an adjustable offset
    between DTV and RGB but if not I'll leave the RGB input centered as
    this is used far more for DVD/DVR/Satellite.

    I've read brief suggestions about the grey/black thing but nothing
    concrete.

    All of these problems are with the "Wide" mode. "Smart" mode is good
    enough and I'll leave realigning the 4:3 and 14:9 modes for now as
    these are rarely used and I wouldn't want to make any unnecessary
    adjustments ;)


    Dave.
     
  7. psuedonym

    psuedonym Guest

    there may have been some hope, before you monkeyed with the controls.
    You picked the worst one to change.

    I gaurantee you have more bad parts now than when you started.


    If the set stopped doing something it was supposed to, or started
    doing something it wasn't supposed to, there is a failure.

    All the peaking and tweaking in the world won't fix it.

    Why do you people always think that you can fix it with a "golden
    screwdriver", (onscreen, in this case)_ even though you have _NO IDEA_
    what you are doing?

    By the time you're done, what you will have is a 32 inch boat anchor...
     
  8. Art

    Art Guest

    AS SUGGESTED get your set to a SONY Repair Facility. Tell them what you did
    so they don't spend a lot of time looking for something other than your
    FUBAR! The bite the bullet and pay for the repair. No: we are not trying to
    say you are an idiot for doing this, just for not listening to the very good
    advice that has been posted by others trying to actually assist you. IMHO
     
  9. In the spirit of best solving your problem without wasting more time and
    effort.
    Educated is the key word. You asumed that you could tweak harmlessly in the
    service parameters...you were obviously wrong. My point is simply to either
    do your homework before making the assumptions needed to fix your set or
    take it to someone who has the experience to sort it out.
    You are not working on a toaster. This is a problem with TV service.
    People assume it is like working with toasters...
    Do you make assumptions about what might be travelling on that interface and
    the effects dicking with it might have? Without checking first? Do you
    make changes to operating frequencies and phase without knowing the
    potential effects?
    You takes your chances if you don't wnat to invest in the documentation and
    training...
    Didn't intend to indicate that you are stupid, just that you made some bad
    assumptions. If you knew enough to adjust the geometry on a set like this
    effectively, you would know enough to be careful about the rfange of certain
    settings. Not stupid, necessarily, but uninformed.
    With a direct view set these may not be easily corrected. There are
    potentially mechanical, magnetic, and electronic adjustments that can effect
    geometry changes and the three can interact in a messy way sometimes.
    Knowing the specific model well helps because you are more likely to make
    corect assumptions about what can and cannot likely be corrected.
    That does not mean that you can solve the problem easily...
    Maybe you jsut need some experience or to do some homework and get the
    training manual and service manuals, proper test equipment, and experience
    to do the job, or take it to someone that has such. Maybe you should start
    by reading the online info that is free that discusses the matter.
    Talk to the local techs about the problem. Any that will not discuss it
    specifically and talk in very vague and general terms don't likely have the
    experience. Any that tell you anything that does not include a warning that
    only so much correction is likely posssible is full of crap. Post your
    location and ask for recommendations in your area. Be a smart consumer...
    The experience doesn't come easily with respect to geometry on CRTs. The
    manuals are not that hard to come by.
    My guess is that you did no harm to any hardware but have a parameter
    combination that the micro doesn't like. I'd recommend buying or fishing
    around for the documentation and maybe doing a reset after recording the
    existing parameter values.
    Not sure on this model about these adjustments. I'd have to do some
    homework.
    Look in AVS forum. There is likely something there.
    Leonard Caillouet (to email me drop the NOSPAM)
     
  10. One of those assumptions that I was talking about...
    Do you have some specific reason to make this assumption or are you just
    blowing smoke? Techs who jump to conclusions like this without actually
    checking anything out are as bad as consumers who screw with things that
    they should not. Worse, actually, because you should know better.
    Maybe, but more likely will have just wasted some time and maybe some money.
    the guy is obviously not completely naive, just operating on weak
    information and no experience.

    Leonard Caillouet
     
  11. David Jordan

    David Jordan Guest

    It's not the first time, anybody who's fixed UPSs gets to know what
    the inside of FETs look like :)
    Good advice. I spent a lot of time on the net trying to find info
    about this, there's plenty for NTSC FX60s but these seem to have very
    different menus to the DXs. And who decided that a simple thing like
    TT settings should be different on EVERY SINGLE SET?
    Tell me about it... Anything they don't understand has to be simple.
    Do salespeople get bonuses depending on how many rules of physics they
    break?
    I appreciate there's only so much improvement that can be made. Large
    screens must be harder than smaller screens and very flat ones like
    Wegas can't make the job any easier... though they do mean you can
    hold a ruler up to the screen to make sure the edges are square :)
    The info is hard to come by online. I had a shock when I got a 2nd
    hand TDS scope and found the service manual with schematics and setup
    info on Tek's web site. We need more companies like that...


    Dave.
     
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