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Rossi cold fusion device appearing less and less like a scam....

Discussion in 'Home Power and Microgeneration' started by sno, Jul 30, 2011.

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  1. sno

    sno Guest

    Article and interview 21 July 2011:

    Check it out:

    http://pesn.com/2011/07/21/9501874_Rossis_Self_Sustaining_One_Megawatt_Reactor

    I have been following this for about a year, appears to be a very simple
    device, table top size.

    Stainless steel pipe packed with granulated nickle (initially claimed
    nickle needed to be mixed with proprietary catalyst, claims has
    determined optimum nickle granular size)

    Water jacket surrounding pipe, with insulation.

    Hydrogen pumped through nickle packed pipe.

    Two pumps, one for hydrogen one for water.

    Water converted to steam (is a steam generator)

    Initial energy input needed to heat nickle/hydrogen and trigger reaction.

    Reaction is self sustaining after initial trigger.

    Had problem with thermal run away causing explosions, which he thinks
    have been solved (steam/hydrogen explosion....??)

    Has a hypothesis of how it works using conventional physics, basically
    fusion of nickle/hydrogen producing copper. (copper has been found in
    nickle after running)

    Claims has had a generator running for over a year.

    Gamma radiation detected while running, no radiation detected after 20
    minutes being turned off.

    Has been examined by reputable physicists and no external energy inputs
    discovered, except for initial trigger energy/pumps (three hundred watt
    constant input, kw's in thermal energy, constant output).

    Another company has claimed they have built their own (different....???)
    device using nickle/hydrogen, seems to verify rossi's claims.

    have fun.....sno














    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  2. Tom Potter

    Tom Potter Guest

    As you can see from the interview,
    Rossi states that a one kilowatt generator would cost $1000.00 to $2000.00,
    and that it produces a kilowatt hour for about one cent.

    Assuming that he is low balling and the cost of a one kilowatt generator is
    $5000.00,
    at the current cost of about ten cents per kilowatt hour,
    it would take 50,000 hours to pay for the generator.

    As there are 8760 hours in a year,
    it would take about six years to pay for the generator,
    assuming no maintainance or operating costs.

    http://pesn.com/2011/07/14/9501869_EV-World_Interviews_Andrea_Rossi/

    "H - Exactly. You brought up the issue of... I know people who are in the
    energy business will want to add or want to know.. do you have a sense of
    what the kilowatt hour cost of a facility will be?

    A - One cent.

    H - That is not kilowatt hours, that is kilowatts.

    A - That is... sorry.. let me correct you. The energy is kilowatts. Kilowatt
    is power, so one plant that has a power of one kilowatt is a plant that can
    produce up to one kilowatt hour per hour.

    H - So typically, when they talk about construction cost of a power plant
    they talk about...

    A - I said kilowatt. Okay.. so you want to know price per kilowatt. The
    price per kilowatt can be one thousand to two thousand dollars."

    I wouldn't buy one at that price.

    --
    Tom Potter
    -----------------
    http://www.prioritize.biz/
    http://voices.yuku.com/forums/66
    http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com/siteindex.zhtml
    http://184.105.237.216/~tompotte/
    http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com
     
  3. Jim Wilkins

    Jim Wilkins Guest

    If this is true maybe someday one of the Nickel Hydride batteries in your
    Prius will go critical.
     
  4. sno

    sno Guest

    I agree....however a power company...or a plant that uses steam may
    think differently....

    Also if steam is run through a turbine, to produce electricity, there
    will be about a 50 percent energy loss....which will raise the cost....
    however this is a prototype...and there is no telling what other devices
    using this principle will cost.....I would guess his guesstimate is high
    since he would want to get the most he can from the original devices.....

    have fun.....sno

    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  5. Mho

    Mho Guest

    Mention of anything "Bedini" on this website tells me it is a scam, and a
    boring old one at that.

    Go away with the fantasy from this scam site.

    ==============

    "sno" wrote in message


    Article and interview 21 July 2011:
    <theoretical garbage snipped>

    have fun.....sno
     
  6. sno

    sno Guest

    You my have not noticed the Bedini speculation was from the writer of
    the article....and not from anyone connected with the device...

    have fun....sno

    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  7. sno

    sno Guest

    If this is not a scam then it is more likely people will try to build
    one at home, stumble on the correct proportion of hydrogen to nickle
    grains causing steam explosions leading to deaths and horrible burns....

    (some people probably are already trying)

    I wonder if this device is proven, if it will have to be licensed by the
    NRC, if it does could be kept out of private individuals hands...as
    other nuclear devices are.....

    have fun....sno

    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  8. sno

    sno Guest

    Morris....thanks for the laugh....I needed one....

    have fun....sno

    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  9. Jim Wilkins

    Jim Wilkins Guest

    Glad I have a separate keyboard and don't have to clean the coffee out of
    the laptop.

    jsw
     
  10. sno

    sno Guest

    I also am imagining what it could lead to.....since steam can produce
    heat - air conditioning - refrigeration - cooking....all power you would
    need for house is for pumps - led lights....and for computer....
    Would not need a lot of solar power for that....

    (am thinking would be better if not converting steam to
    electricity...keep thinking of the loss)....unless your mhd comes along...

    anyway....have my fingers crossed....for people everywhere...

    If is true could really be a world changer....just like start of
    mechanical revolution...

    Am trying not to be to enthused....I have been following peoples cold
    fusion ideas/devices for years......this is the first one have seen get
    this far....most the inventors fooled themselves...or were outright scams...

    have fun....sno









    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  11. Jim Wilkins

    Jim Wilkins Guest

    At night the ground radiates away the day's heat into space until the air
    temperature nears the dew point and the latent heat of condensation slows
    the drop. A clear dry night can easily radiate away 50F.

    http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_climate_of_the_Sahara_desert_at_night

    jsw
     
  12. Winston

    Winston Guest

    One of the projects in my Bucket List is to make a
    dew condenser that harvests water at night, using
    zero power. Another is the 'deep space ice' experiment.

    So many projects, so little time.

    --Winston
     
  13. Tom Potter

    Tom Potter Guest

    ( Maintenance and operating costs would increase the pay out period. )
    I suggest to my pal colin.watters
    that before he makes an investment
    he should do a discounted rate of return calculation

    and if he can do better by investing his money
    in securities, real estate, etc.
    that he should do so.

    To compare investing in a new furnace,
    one must consider the savings compounded
    over the investment period,
    and compare this to other investments available to him.

    --
    Tom Potter
    -----------------
    http://www.prioritize.biz/
    http://voices.yuku.com/forums/66
    http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com/siteindex.zhtml
    http://184.105.237.216/~tompotte/
    http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com
     
  14. Bob F

    Bob F Guest

    Right! Real estate and stocks are guaranteed investments you can count on? Some
    investments are more solid than others. Some are less so.
     
  15. Jim Wilkins

    Jim Wilkins Guest

    I facetiously suggested that NiMH batteries could go critical because they
    are essentially what you propose. Nickel powder has been used as a
    high-pressure hydrogenation catalyst for a very long time, so it's strange
    that no one else noticed this.
    http://www.chemguide.co.uk/physical/catalysis/introduction.html
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raney_nickel
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mond_process

    BTW nickel and iron are the MOST stable nuclei, the final end result of both
    fusion and fission chains.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_peak

    Some nickel ore contains copper that isn't easily removed, the metal in
    coins for example. Finding copper in nickel is no surprise.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monel

    This reminds me of Donovan's Electric Banana prank of the 60's that came out
    shortly after the discovery that banana peels contain a fire retardant. You
    can't dry and smoke them because they don't burn.

    jsw
     
  16. sno

    sno Guest

    I can't believe I missed the wikipedia article....thanks much for the
    link......have fun...sno

    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  17. Jim Wilkins

    Jim Wilkins Guest

    If I was hired to fake the Feb 2011 demo I'd swap the faucet handles and
    draw the "cooling" water from the hot tap, being careful to measure the
    input temperature from cold water initially in the pipe, then quickly
    switching the display to the output side. The apparatus itself would
    withstand close examination afterwards, but the sink wouldn't.

    Chemistry and magic tricks became very close friends thousands of years ago.
    http://chemistry.about.com/od/chemistrymagic/Chemistry_Magic_Tricks.htm

    Electrical Banana at 2:28 was taken to mean smoking banana peels by the
    Beatles hidden-message crowd, despite what he really meant.

    I sort of slid into the 1960's art & theatre culture in college after being
    asked to build animation equipment for a filmmaker. As his technical
    assistant I learned a lot about special effects and illusions.

    jsw
     
  18. Jim Wilkins

    Jim Wilkins Guest

    plethora of tests point to the impossibility that his demos were
    scams. 30cc reactor producing 3W of output for hours... Impossible for
    non fusion means.
    Marcelo Pacheco - Not a Physicist - Not a scientist

    By that logic the plethora of magicians who can pull a coin out of your ear
    proves the supernatural.

    I don't know if Rossi is real or fake. I merely pointed out that the demo is
    extremely easy to rig, by swapping the hot and cold water lines (under the
    sink?) so the audience assumes that the reactor heated the water, which
    actually was already hot when it entered.

    jsw
     
  19. sno

    sno Guest

    Morris.....do not understand the copper plating of the reactor tube....???

    good luck....have fun.....sno


    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
  20. sno

    sno Guest

    got it....thanks...makes sense....have fun.....sno


    --
    Correct Scientific Terminology:
    Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
    Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    to be generally assumed to be true.
    Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
    in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
    Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.
     
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