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Planned Obselescence....A Good Thing?

C

Chris Jones

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ignoramus16071 said:
If they know what happens with their product -- and they do -- then it
IS intentional.

If I set a fire on my kitchen floor, hoping to cook a pig that would
not fit in a stove, knowing that my house would burn down, and the
house burns down, the result is intentional -- even though the fire
was started to cook a pig. Same here -- if they try to save 2 cents
and make products that they KNOW do not perform their intended
purpose, then making substandard products is intentional on their
part.

That's why I do not patronize cutthroat retailers such as Walmart.
Because they are looking to screw ME by selling products that do not
perform their intended purpose (and by forcing manufacturers to make
such via abusive methods). I do not like such capitalists and to not
want to give them any of my business. I would rather pay 3x more to
businesses such as McMaster-Carr, or Bosch, etc, to get a product that
actually works.

My experience with Harbor Freight has been spotty, but most of the
products that I bought from them, do work as advertised.

i

I just recently bought a hand-held spothight with a 6V valve-regulated
lead-acid battery. (bought at Lidl in the UK.) It is Osram brand but who
knows who actually designed or made it. Out of curiosity I opened it up
and measured the voltage as it was charging the battery. The 6V (3 cell)
battery gets charged to about 8.5V with the supplied charger so that would
kill the battery pretty quickly. The proper charging voltage is even
marked clearly on the Chinese-made battery. The charger is basically just
a resistor and an unregulated power supply. I know that say a LM317 would
be too expensive for these guys but there would surely be a cheaper circuit
e.g. with a zener diode and a transistor that could clamp the charging
voltage to a sensible limit, for 10c or less. In my own case, I will
charge it with a regulated power supply instead, but it makes me sad to
think that the rest of these things will be destroyed quite soon by
overcharging, and since the battery is not easily removable from the casing
of the torch, I guess that approximately none of them will be recycled when
they stop working. Even if they were "recycled", I have heard some bad
things about the way lead-acid battery recycling is done these days, so it
would be much better if someone had at least been able to use it for a few
years first.

That is one good thing about lithium batteries, the appliance manufacturers
are so shit-scared of abusing the batteries, causing a fire and getting
sued that they usually do put a half-decent charger in the products, even
if that does cost them the extra 10c.

Chris
 
D

Don K

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ignoramus16071 said:
Another example, I received a KMart wallet as a gift and it is
unusable -- the credit card pockets are too tight and it is generally
too tight for money also(I like to carry a few hundred $$ in cash etc,
which does not affect credit card pockets). Again, at the cost of
perhaps 10 cents per wallet, it could have been made into a better
wallet.

Obviously you got the wallet intended for tightwads. :)

I got a new wallet for Christmas wherer some compartments were
a bit too tight when I loaded them with the various assorted plastic
cards, ATM, credit, membership, insurance, driver's license, etc.

I ended up trimming some of the cards with scissors.
Now they fit ok. No harm done to the cards.
If anyone has suggestions for a really good three section leather
wallet, I will appreciate.

There's your problem! A single-fold wallet is a lot less bulky.
I had a 3-section wallet and hated it. It felt like I was carrying
a baseball in my pocket.

Don
 
R

Rod Speed

Jan 1, 1970
0
Some stupid wog claiming to be
just the puerile shit you'd expect from a stupid wog.
 
L

lsmartino

Jan 1, 1970
0
It has been found that the subject under study, in this case Rod Speed
has a compulsion to answer to anything, even to himself :-D


Rod Speed ha escrito:
Some stupid wog claiming to be
just the puerile shit you'd expect from a stupid wog.

Says SFA about your pathetically childish remark. (R. Speed trademark
quote)




See you never, loser... hehehehehehehehe!
 
Yes, if you _only_ do short distances, you build up moisture in the oil
system which doesn't get vaporized by engine heat. But short trips with
occasional longer trips and freeway driving gets rid of that moisture.

All the experts agree that 3000 mile oil changes are almost always
unnecessary for normal service.
Oh sure. They all agree.

Except for my owner's manual.

Alan

==

It's not that I think stupidity should be punishable by death.
I just think we should take the warning labels off of everything
and let the problem take care of itself.

--------------------------------------------------------
 
R

Rod Speed

Jan 1, 1970
0
Some stupid wog claiming to be
just the puerile shit you'd expect from a stupid wog.
 
A

Andrew VK3BFA

Jan 1, 1970
0
lsmartino said:
It has been found that the subject under study, in this case Rod Speed
has a compulsion to answer to anything, even to himself :-D


I am starting to wonder about this - remember the "Turing Test" for AI
- you have a conversation, via a teleprinter, with the "robot" in
another room. If you cant distinguish the reply from that of a person,
then it passes the Turing Test.

Your testing seems to show that Rod might, indeed, be a robot. A bloody
good one - had me fooled for along time.

But the inability, or unwillingness, to answer ANY direct questions
seems to suggest it is an AI program. Probably someones thesis, and
they are keeping track of how much "conversation" Rod manages to
continue.

If its a good one, it should have some sort of adaptive learning
algorithm built in......

Interesting.

Andrew VK3BFA.
 
R

Rod Speed

Jan 1, 1970
0
Some gutless fuckwit desperately cowering behind
Andrew VK3BFA <[email protected]> desperately
attempted to bullshit its way out of its predicament and
fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.

No surprise that it got the bums rush, right out the door.

Even Telecom had noticed what a completely unemployable dud it was.
 
S

SMS

Jan 1, 1970
0
Alan said:
Oh sure. They all agree.

Except for my owner's manual.

LOL.

"Especially since normal city driving is, according to your
owner's manual "extreme service" and they recommend you
change your oil every 3,000 miles. . . ."

At least you no longer believe that everyone else's owner's manual is
like yours.

So what kind of vehicle do you have, and/or what does your owner's
manual say? I've never seen an owner's manual that defined severe
service as any service that included short trips, unless there were
never any longer trips (which heat up the engine and oil hot enough to
vaporize the moisture).

Toyota:
------
"Repeated short trips (less than 8 km) in freezing conditions."

Nissan:
------
"Repeatedly driving short distances."

Honda:
-----
"Driving less than 5 miles (8 km) per trip or in freezing temperatures."


Don't fall for the oil industry's attempt to redefine "severe" service
to fit their own agenda.
 
E

Eregon

Jan 1, 1970
0
But the inability, or unwillingness, to answer ANY direct questions
seems to suggest it is an AI program.

Isn't "AI" the acronym for "Annoying Idiot"? <grin>
 
J

jakdedert

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rick Brandt wrote:

[Extraneous, excessive crosspost groups snipped]My opinion as well.

I firmly believe this is--in fact--true.
Only if the same company sells me the replacement. For the theory to work
entire industries would need to collude on this. I don't buy it.
Many of the 'companies' don't really exist. They are merely resellers
which brand products mostly made by a handful of OEM manufacturers. The
chances of buying from the same manufacturer are pretty significant
despite the product having a different brand name...especially the lower
on the totem pole one shops.

This is especially true of major appliances. If that Kenmore craps on
you and you decide to get a Fridgidaire or GE dryer the next time; you
may well find that you bought the same product in a different package.
In fact, many, if not most, of the parts will likely be interchangable.
Nah, cooking the books maybe, but not making design decisions.
Voting with their dollars....

The bean counters make sure that absolutely nothing gets made beyond the
lowest common denominator.
Your tax dollars at work....
Actually newer laws are holding manufacturers accountable for any "special"
disposal costs required of their products. That could put a whole new spin on
this topic.
That's almost a pipe dream on this side of the pond. It could happen,
but I'm not holding my breath.

jak
 
J

jakdedert

Jan 1, 1970
0
James said:
Rather than planned obsolescence, it's normally more a case of how many
cost reducing corners can they cut and still have it last "long enough".
It's hard to blame the manufactures, they're supplying what the average
consumer is demanding.




There's been various attempts over the years at marketing easily
upgradeable computers, but invariably by the time you were ready to
upgrade, the cost of a new CPU module was a sizable portion of the cost
of a whole new PC, as well as the rest of the major components were
showing their age.

Not to mention, the fact that by the time you decide to upgrade, the
architecture has changed. You decide to upgrade your processor: new
processor won't fit in the old socket. Same with memory and
peripherals. I've got a few series port products that won't even work
on newer computers, a pile of 30 and 72 pin SIMM ram sticks...floppy
drives, who wants 'em?

Anybody want a couple of AT power supplies?

jak
 
M

Mark Rand

Jan 1, 1970
0
But the inability, or unwillingness, to answer ANY direct questions
seems to suggest it is an AI program. Probably someones thesis, and
they are keeping track of how much "conversation" Rod manages to
continue.

If its a good one, it should have some sort of adaptive learning
algorithm built in......

Interesting.

Andrew VK3BFA.


That particular trait is shown by politicians as well :)



Mark Rand
RTFM
 
V

Vic Smith

Jan 1, 1970
0
They're not my stories. There are regularly warnings by automotive
columnists and mechanics to avoid the quick-change oil change places
like the plague, as well as the horror stories of customers that have
had their vehicles damaged by these places.
Sure, they're your stories. You believe them and apparently are
affected by them. I believe the horror stories, but also believe them
be merely anecdotal warnings that "shit happens."
In fact, my son the professional mechanic, last year called me from
the road asking to bring him oil and a drain plug. He had just been
working in my garage putting an intake manifold and a bunch of other
stuff on his car, and changed the oil while he was at it. Didn't
tighten the drain plug and it shook out. He saw the stream in his
mirror when it came loose, pulled over and shut it down, so no harm
was done except 4 quarts of Mobile 1 on the street. This is a kid who
is truly mechanically gifted, but doesn't specialize in changing oil.
I have *never* hand tightened an oil drain plug, always wrenching it
when it goes in, and I'm sure he won't make that mistake again. But
he can do 10 things at once, and I can do only 1.
Point is, the quick lube places specialize in this simple stuff,
sometimes with drill instructer-like shouts of "Plug in!!!, "Plug
torqued to 20 foot pounds!!!" Sort of funny, but good practice.
OTOH, I've heard the same type of oil plug horror stories about dealer
service bays, and independents. Shit happens.
The only effect these stories have had on me is to make me pull over
after *anybody* changes my oil and make sure nothing is screwed up.
Since I don't crawl under the car, even that won't help with a
hand-tightened plug, which is a time bomb.
The only way to be absolutely confident that things are done as you
would do them is to do them yourself. Of, course then when you screw
something up, you can't whine and carry on about it.
Though I usually change my own oil, I've been to quick lube places
many, many times and *never* had an issue. Those are my stories.
BTW, I'm more particular about who does other types of auto
maintenance on my cars.
I'm not risking my vehicle to a place like that. I'll bring it to a
reputable independent mechanic, do it myself, or go to the dealer if
they have a good price. Usually the Toyota dealer has an oil change deal
that is cheaper than Jiffy Lube, plus they are using better quality
filters, and more experienced mechanics.

Good for you. Sounds as if you have your own stories of success.
You're happy with your stories, and I with mine.

--Vic
 
L

lsmartino

Jan 1, 1970
0
Andrew VK3BFA ha escrito:
I am starting to wonder about this - remember the "Turing Test" for AI
- you have a conversation, via a teleprinter, with the "robot" in
another room. If you cant distinguish the reply from that of a person,
then it passes the Turing Test.

Your testing seems to show that Rod might, indeed, be a robot. A bloody
good one - had me fooled for along time.

But the inability, or unwillingness, to answer ANY direct questions
seems to suggest it is an AI program. Probably someones thesis, and
they are keeping track of how much "conversation" Rod manages to
continue.

If its a good one, it should have some sort of adaptive learning
algorithm built in......

If Rod is a robot, it is probably still in development. Please notice
the fact that as soon it reachs the end of its script, or possible
answers, it has the tendency to repeat the same answer over and over,
in an endless loop. This seems to me like a software bug, but surely
the AI programmers behind the Rod project are working hard to correct
it. Probably they didn´t knew about this bug, because our testing made
it surface. Maybe they will incorpore some sort of adaptive learning
algorithm into the robot, as we clearly demonstrated that the Rod
project is laking one badly, or has a non functional one. :)

Have fun!
 
R

Rod Speed

Jan 1, 1970
0
Some stupid wog claiming to be
just the puerile shit you'd expect from a stupid wog.
 
L

lsmartino

Jan 1, 1970
0
Message to Rod Speed developers:

This is the bug that must be solved
Some stupid wog claiming to be
just the puerile shit you'd expect from a stupid wog.

Three times the same answer in a row. Remember to solve that before you
finish the project. Otherwise the project could be considered a total
failure. ;-)

Ah... and I think a personality change would be fine too. It would make
the final product more appaling to the end user.
 
W

William Souden

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rod said:
Some stupid wog claiming to be
just the puerile shit you'd expect from a stupid wog.

Off your meds again, welfare boy?
 
R

Rod Speed

Jan 1, 1970
0
Some stupid wog claiming to be
just the puerile shit you'd expect from a stupid wog.
 
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