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Chinese "nightlight" !!

T

TKM

Jan 1, 1970
0
Don Klipstein said:
Ï "Victor Roberts" <[email protected]> Ýãñáøå óôï ìÞíõìá
[snip]
I've lost track of the design features of this other lamp.
If it has an inductive ballast, it is always possible for a
turn-to-turn short to develop, but those are unusual. If the
output of an inductive ballast becomes shorted, it will draw
more current than when it is operating a lamp and that could
cause overheating.

The circuit we were discussing earlier in this thread uses a
capacitor ballast if I remember correctly. It is possible
for a capacitor to develop an internal short, but that is
unlikely with a new capacitor. If the output of the
capacitor ballast is shorted the capacitor should not
overheat.

There were also a few resistors in the power circuit posted.
Any of them could have overheated.

The problem with low cost electronics is often not the
components but the construction. Poor solder joints that can
overheat, thin circuit board traces that can overheat, or
traces placed too close to each other on the circuit board
that can cause flash-over shorts which can cause other parts
to overheat.

Ok, thanks. But on the circuit we are discussing, this is still a low
pressure mercury vapor lamp, which still has a negative resistance
characteristic. So, if, just if, for some obscure reason, the circuit gets
mangled (due to a short or some other reason) and the lamp faces the full
voltage of the wall outlet (because of a short in the circuit), then it
will
probably blow up.

I think that the lamp will survive faults well enough to force faulty
ballasts to act as fuses unless the short is severe enough to blow an
actual fuse or trip a breaker.
And if the fault causes the lamp current to be a few times what it
should be, I expect that in many cases the lamp will survive long enough
to cause the malfunctioning ballast to overheat enough to further fail and
maybe do so quite spectacularly (and possibly pouring or spitting drops of
molten copper, of temperature a little under 1100 degrees C).
High pressure sodium may usually be either more forgiving or drag things
out farther, by having an overpowered lamp vaporize excessive sodium, and
once the arc voltage reaches about 76-80% or so of the ballast output open
circuit voltage, the "negative resistance" of the arc typically outweighs
the output impedance of the ballast in some way to make the arc unstable
upon decrease of current - and the next downward fluctuation of arc
current during the next half-cycle puts the arc in a decreasing-current
tailspin, and the lamp goes out. You get something similar to
"end-of-life cycling", only you hope the lamp spends enough time being
"off" or gets worse fast enough to not let the ballast overheat enough to
make things worse.
This particular tube has no safety molybdenum end seals which could
prevent
the more dire consequences of a direct short, so giving it a 220V
unrestricted, will most likely cause it to "flash" causing its end points
to
at least melt in the best possible case, or explode in the worst possible
case.

Am I not right?

I think that some few ballast failures resulting in lamp current a few
times that of "normal" could result in lamp current that does not make the
lamp "act as a fuse", but merely ages the lamp badly, and the lamp may
"keep on ticking" long enough for the ballast to get worse - and maybe in
especially bad cases put on a fireworks show or put out molten copper.
I do admit that this is an extreme case, but falling a little short of
this is still an obvious fire hazard. If the ballast windings overheat
enough to produce a flammable concentration of vapors of insulating
materials and then a wire shorts or breaks with a spark, at that point you
could have a fire. This is still a very rare event, but this is something
that I think should be planned around (for adequate avoidance and/or
survival) in order to receive a UL or CSA or CE sticker.

- Don Klipstein ([email protected])

The National Electric Code requirement to use Arc Fault Current Interrupter
(AFCI) devices to protect residential bedroom circuits is a step in the
direction that Don describes. An electric arc generates a "signature" which
is sensed by the device whch then shuts the circuit off. The trick is to
design the AFCI so that it shuts off when needed but not when a ceiling fan
is switched or an incandescent lamp arcs as the filament comes apart. We'll
know later this year if there are proposals to require the use of AFCIs on
other household circuits.

Terry McGowan
 
I

Ioannis

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ï "Ioannis said:
My mother bought this at a supermarket. It's a "nightlight" that plugs
directly against a wall outlet.

It has no country markings, just "1W", "AC220", "50/60Hz and "CE".
The "CE" is probably bogus. It is probably of Chinese origin.
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/nitelite1.jpg

Well, so much for the little nightlite. I tried to turn it on today to
measure its strobo frequency, only to find that it has been burned. It has
been on for exactly three full nights.

On startup now, I detect a very faint argon glow between the main and
auxiliary electrodes on both ends, and the Lambertian diffuser on top of it
is slightly melted exactly where it touches the inner tube's side, above the
electrode.

The tube is probably intact. What seems to have failed is the circuit.

[snip]
 
S

Simon Waldman

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ioannis said:
Well, so much for the little nightlite. I tried to turn it on today to
measure its strobo frequency, only to find that it has been burned. It has
been on for exactly three full nights.

If you want a replacement, Osram sell what looks like a nice little unit
(at least in the UK). I haven't tried it, but it seems to consist of a
photocell and a low-powered white LED, all built into the back of a UK
mains plug.

Ikea have something very similar-looking. So similar-looking that it may
be a licensed version...

--
The United States, I believe, are under the impression that they
are twenty years in advance of this country [Britain]; whilst,
as a matter of actual verifiable fact, of course, they are just
about six hours behind it.
-Harold Hobson
 
I

Ioannis

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ï "Simon Waldman" <[email protected]> Ýãñáøå óôï ìÞíõìá
[snip]

Ikea have something very similar-looking. So similar-looking that it may
be a licensed version...

Simon,

Do you by any chance have a URL handy? I'd like to check that out.

Meanwhile, I got a replacement and I checked its strobo frequency. It's
exactly 50Hz. It flickers in unison with a regular fluorescent on my
mother's cupboard. Vic, take note.
 
V

Victor Roberts

Jan 1, 1970
0
My mother bought this at a supermarket. It's a "nightlight" that plugs
directly against a wall outlet.

It has no country markings, just "1W", "AC220", "50/60Hz and "CE".
The "CE" is probably bogus. It is probably of Chinese origin.
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/nitelite1.jpg

I opened it and it contains a small low pressure mercury lamp, which
contains 3 electrodes on each end. I suspect the third electrode is an
auxiliary one, to initiate the discharge. You can discern the switch and the
integrated circuit which plugs directly on the wall outlet.
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/nitelite2.jpg

It's also problematic: Although it starts nicely and its glow looks like
that of a miniature fluorescent the first 3-4 seconds, after 4-5 seconds,
the auxiliary electrodes kick in again and it produces a purple glow around
the electrodes which flickers on and off, similar to the starting argon glow
on the discharge tube of a high pressure lamp.

This leads me to believe that the circuitry is all faulty. It's probably
supposed to be cutting off the current to the auxiliary electrodes, but
instead the current through them continues, causing auxiliary discharges
which keep going and going, causing argon flicker.

Here's a picture of it being lit:
http://users.forthnet.gr/ath/jgal/nitelite3.jpg

The auxiliary discharges don't show on this pic.

I was wondering how safe this thingy is. My impression is that leaving this
thing unattended through the night, one risks the danger of fire. Opinions?

I received two e-mails from a Bart Lederman who says he can
read but not post to this group. He sent me some information
about this topic that I have appended below. Bert's e-mail
is lederman at pirulo dot zko dot dec dot com if you would
like to respond to him via e-mail. This is the second of his
two messages and contains all the technical info from the
first plus some additions.

Note that the diagrams will look very strange unless you use
a fixed width font.

***Begin included text***

I tried posting something from my new location, but in case
it doesn't get out to the community I'm taking the liberty
of sending you a copy. It has some changes from what I sent
you before, now that I've found some of my old materials.

Bart.

--------------------------------------------------

I sent some mail to Victor Roberts to pass on to the
group
yesterday, working from memory.

Last night I dug through my 'stuff' and found some
lamps,
one test jig, some notes, a catalog from 1988; but for some
reason, not the original spec. sheet with their circuit
diagrams. Since I'm also missing the BLB lamp, I'm sure I
still
have some more data somewhere and will keep looking for it.
What I have now indicates I need to update some of the
information I sent out yesterday.

Quite some time ago, JKL Lamps used to sell short cold
cathode lamps which look like the ones in the "Chinese
Nightlight" being discussed. They had one large electrode
at
each end, plus a smaller starter electrode at each end.

I believe they were intended to run on D.C. There were
several models, the smallest of which is about 65 mm long
overall and 6.5 mm in diameter (except for the 'black
light'
model which had a filter over it increasing it's diameter
to
9mm). Turn on voltage is rated at 340 V (not sure if that's
with or without the use of the starting electrode, but I
think
it's without). Maintaining voltage is 185 V, recommended
current is 4 mA, maximum current is 10 mA.

The circuit I have in my notes, which is also still
wired
up in a test jig is: [you will need a monospaced font like
Courier]


----------------------------
| | |
| ----------- | |
| | | | |
| | | | |
| / --- |
C1 | \ | | /
|| | / R1 | L | \
----||-----------| \ | A | / R2
|| | / | M | \
| \ | P | /
--- | | | \
/\ | | | |
120 / \ | | | |
VAX ---- | --- |
| | | | |
| | | ------
| | |
R3 | | |
--\/\/\/-------------------------------


This is very much like the diagram someone else posted,
except with a diode instead of an SCR. R1 and R2 are the
ballasts for the starter electrodes, and I have 47k
resistors
in my test jig. My notes show values up to 220k. R3 is 1500
ohms, and C1 is 1 microFarad (I'm using a non-polarized
film
capacitor). This arraingement works something like a
voltage
doubler, with the capacitor being chared on one half cycle,
and
then it's in series with the line voltage to trigger the
lamp.
With good quality components, it should run a long time.

I haven't spent much time looking at the other circuit
diagram to figure out what the SCR gains you.

It's also possible to run the lamp with only one
starter
electrode: both electrodes at the 'positive end' (on my
lamps,
that's where the evacuation tube is) are connected
together.



Ballast Starter

+
----/\/\/\/\/\/---------/\/\/\/\--
|| |
|| |
|| |
--- |
| | |
| L | |
| A | |
| M | |
| P | |
| | |
| | |
| | |
--- |
| | |
| ------------
|
|
---------------------
-

I did some experimentation and decided I could come up
with
something more efficient. So I did a variation on the
classic
"half wave" voltage doubler:


-----------------------------
| | || |
| | || |
--- | || |
/\ | || |
/ \ | + --- |
C1 ---- ----- | | /
|| | ----- | L | \
----||-----------| | C2 | A | / R1
|| | | | M | \
| | | P | /
--- | | | \
/\ | | | |
120 / \ | | | |
VAX ---- | --- |
| | | | |
| | | -------
| | |
| | |
---------------------------------------

The "trick" here is that while C2 has a relatively
large
value to smooth the output, C1 has a much smaller value
than
would normally be used in a power supply. Before the lamp
fires
the circuit will charge C2 up to 300 volts, which could be
enough to fire the lamps I was using without having to use
the
trigger electrode. After the lamp begins to conduct, C1
acts as
the ballast. I'm working from memory and some notes here,
and
haven't found this test jig yet (if I still have it), but I
think it was possible to eliminate R1 altogether. If not,
my
notes indicate that something like 220k should work. If I
can't find my old jig I may try rigging up a new one this
weekend.

With no resistors, there are no resistive losses
(except
for a little in the diodes, but that will be small), and
the
ballast is reactive. Power factor isn't going to be 1.0,
but
since most loads are inductive I don't think the power
company
will complain about a capacitive load (insert "smiley"
here).
As I recall, I used a 1 micro-Farad non-polarized film
capacitor for C1. I don't remember the value of C2, but it
shouldn't have to be too large (perhaps around 10
micro-Farads). It's mostly to reduce fliker.

Again, use good components and you shouldn't have to
worry
about the unit bursting into flames when unattended.

It's unfortunate that JKL stopped importing these
lamps,
but apparently there wasn't a demand for them in the 1980s.
I
think it's unfortunate because I can think of several
applications for a small flourescent lamp that can run
directly
off of 120 VAC using just diodes and capacitors (and maybe
a
resistor) and not requiring any transformers, coils, or
other
wound components, and no semiconductors other than diodes.
The
lamps were available in a number of colors (some just with
the
phosphor, some also had a colored envalope), and even a
'black
light' version. I could see quite a bit of use for a short
wave
germicidal lamp as well. I don't know if JKL would be
interested in re-introducing this product line, but it
might be
worth talking to them. Perhaps they still have the original
circuit diagrams if I can'f find my copy.

Bart.


*** End Included Text***

--
Vic Roberts
http://www.RobertsResearchInc.com
To reply via e-mail:
replace xxx with vdr in the Reply to: address
or use e-mail address listed at the Web site.

This information is provided for educational purposes only.
It may not be used in any publication or posted on any Web
site without written permission.
 
V

Victor Roberts

Jan 1, 1970
0
Took a little bit of hunting, but here we go:

http://www.osram.com/products/luminaires/special/lunetta_led.html

That looks like a US version - I hope that's what you need...

Nice product, but this link shows a product that uses the
type of plug I have seen in France, Germany and Hungary and
probably used in other European countries. And, the PDF spec
sheet says "220 - 250 volts at 50 Hz: :)

--
Vic Roberts
http://www.RobertsResearchInc.com
To reply via e-mail:
replace xxx with vdr in the Reply to: address
or use e-mail address listed at the Web site.

This information is provided for educational purposes only.
It may not be used in any publication or posted on any Web
site without written permission.
 
S

Simon Waldman

Jan 1, 1970
0
Victor said:
On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 22:38:57 +0100, Simon Waldman



Nice product, but this link shows a product that uses the
type of plug I have seen in France, Germany and Hungary and
probably used in other European countries. And, the PDF spec
sheet says "220 - 250 volts at 50 Hz: :)

Ah, yes, that might have been a giveaway if my brain had been in gear!
 
J

Jeff Waymouth

Jan 1, 1970
0
Plus the only products in the uS that use the brand name OSRAM are our
Display Optics (we used to call them Photo Optics) Group. Standard LED
products carry the SYLVANIA braqnd except for OSRAM OPTO (confusing
isn't it?)

Jeff Waymouth
 
V

Victor Roberts

Jan 1, 1970
0
Plus the only products in the uS that use the brand name OSRAM are our
Display Optics (we used to call them Photo Optics) Group. Standard LED
products carry the SYLVANIA braqnd except for OSRAM OPTO (confusing
isn't it?)

Jeff Waymouth

Yes! :)
 
S

Simon Waldman

Jan 1, 1970
0
Jeff said:
Plus the only products in the uS that use the brand name OSRAM are our
Display Optics (we used to call them Photo Optics) Group. Standard LED
products carry the SYLVANIA braqnd except for OSRAM OPTO (confusing
isn't it?)

Even more confusing when you consider that in the UK, Sylvania is a
seperate brand to Osram, apparently competing with them in the lamp
market! (whether this is actual competition, or whether they are the
same company over here, I do not know. But they do have a different
product range.)

Jeff, sorry, I emailed this to you by mistake...

--
"When we are born God places us on the starting line and gives
us a gentle push and says go... But what we don't know is that
thirty seconds later he places a slavering, grinning horrid
monster on that same starting line and points to us and says
"Go!" to that monster, too. All our lives that monster is thirty
seconds behind us"
-Bart Davis, 'Destroy the Kentucky'
 
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