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3-5 watt audio amp

chris cash

Nov 8, 2014
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Hey everyone,

I'm new to the forums so figured I'd say hello!

I just finished one of my first circuit builds. It was an lm386 audio amp driver a couple old computer speakers.

My question now is what kind of IC's can I look at to build something more along the lines of 3-5 watts of output power with the same 9v supply from a battery? I have it hooked up to play my guitar through now and .3 watts or so doesn't give me much headroom. I figured if I could up that to a few watts i could have a really nice little practice amp.

Thanks for any help! Looking forward to the responses!

-Chris
 

KrisBlueNZ

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Hi Chris and welcome to Electronics Point :)

If you're using a PP3-type 9V battery (the little rectangular ones with the snap-on connector), that isn't a practical power source for an amplifier rated for 3~5W output, or more. The voltage is probably not high enough, but more importantly, PP3 batteries can't supply much current because they have quite a high internal resistance. The voltage will droop badly on every loud passage in the signal!

If you really need portability, you could use a battery of rechargeable cells such as NiMH, Li-ion, Li-pol, etc.

Digi-Key is a huge electronic components retailer. They are a very good place to start if you want to see the range of components that are out there. Click here to see their selection of audio amplifiers with output power from 3W to 50W in through-hole packages. Each device has a link to the data sheet in the second column of the table. Download a few of these and have a look to see what they require in terms of supply voltage to achieve the output power you want.
 

chris cash

Nov 8, 2014
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Thanks for the reply! I can already tell that site will be super helpful in the future.

http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/AN7523N/AN7523N-ND/440643

Forgive my ignorance. But it looks like this one says it will have a max output of 4W with a 3.5-13v supply. I understand that probably isn't going to give me all 4 watts with a 9v supply, but would it work at all? Maybe produce something in between.

Thanks again!
-Chris
 

Arouse1973

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Dec 18, 2013
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Hi Chris and welcome. Looks like you have met Kris then. You will be wise to stick around, we all have a good deal of knowledge in all sorts of areas. Kris even knows a lot about Darleks :)
Adam
 

davenn

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Sep 5, 2009
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...................
Forgive my ignorance. But it looks like this one says it will have a max output of 4W with a 3.5-13v supply. I understand that probably isn't going to give me all 4 watts with a 9v supply, but would it work at all? Maybe produce something in between.

Thanks again!
-Chris

Hi Chris

No, one of those small 9V batteries has very limited current capabilities. If you were lucky, you may get a few minutes of operation
it just doesn't have the grunt

that is why Kris suggested a 12V sealed lead acid or similar battery. going that way will probably give you several hours of use between charges :)

Dave
 

chris cash

Nov 8, 2014
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Awesome info guys. Portability would ideally be my thing. So I'd like to stay in some kind of small package. Kris mentioned the rechargeable batteries. Either lithium ion or nimh. Would those provide enough umpire alone? Or is he saying to use a package of them together?

Right now I'm only getting about a third of a watt out of this oneone. I guess I'll have to play around and see how much power I'd need to make it decent for playing the guitar through. I've read some good things on a tda7052 ic for projects like this. Anyone have experience with it?

Thanks again! Looks like I came to the right place for some knowledge.

-Chris
 

KrisBlueNZ

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http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/AN7523N/AN7523N-ND/440643
Forgive my ignorance. But it looks like this one says it will have a max output of 4W with a 3.5-13v supply. I understand that probably isn't going to give me all 4 watts with a 9v supply, but would it work at all? Maybe produce something in between.
Better give that one a miss. It's obsolete.

The data sheet says that at 9V the output power will be at least 3.2W and typically 4W into an 8Ω load at 10% distortion. But that really means that the supply voltage must be 9V. As I said before, and Dave repeated, a little 9V battery is not up to supplying that much current and its voltage will droop quite badly. So you would never get even 3W from any amplifier powered from a PP3 battery.
Kris mentioned the rechargeable batteries. Either lithium ion or nimh. Would those provide enough umpire alone? Or is he saying to use a package of them together?
Enough umpire? Auto-correct strikes again :)

You will need a battery, i.e. several cells connected in series, to provide enough voltage. This is because the speaker's impedance limits the amount of power that can be delivered to it, according to the supply voltage of the amplifier.

To deliver 5W (for example) into an 8Ω speaker, you have to apply a voltage of about 6.3V RMS across the speaker. (I'm assuming the speaker is a perfect 8Ω resistive load, which it isn't, but anything else makes the arithmetic impractical.)

6.3V RMS corresponds to about 9V peak or 18V peak-to-peak. A "single-ended" amplifier has a single output stage, and can generate, in principle, a maximum peak-to-peak output voltage equal to its supply voltage (that's assuming the output can swing all the way to both rails, which is never true in practice). So for a single-ended amplifier, you need a supply voltage of at least 18V (more like 22V when you include voltage losses) to deliver 5W into an 8Ω speaker.

The amplifiers you'll be looking at use a trick called "bridge-tied load" ("BTL") where the speaker is connected between the outputs of two separate output stages, which are driven with opposite signals. A BTL amplifier can generate, in principle, a maximum peak-to-peak output voltage equal to twice its supply rails. So a BTL amplifier needs 9V (more like 12V in practice) to deliver 5W into an 8Ω speaker.

So assuming you use a BTL amplifier (which you definitely should), even a 12V supply will only give you a maximum of about 5W into an 8Ω speaker. If you want more power than that, your basic options are (a) use a higher power supply voltage, and/or (b) use a lower speaker impedance.
Right now I'm only getting about a third of a watt out of this oneone. I guess I'll have to play around and see how much power I'd need to make it decent for playing the guitar through. I've read some good things on a tda7052 ic for projects like this. Anyone have experience with it?
I haven't used it.

If you can, try to find a high-efficiency speaker. Modern speakers are normally pitifully inefficient.

Do you just want a practice amp? If so, how about just using headphones? Your neighbours would appreciate it, I'm sure :)
 

BobK

Jan 5, 2010
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In addition the what Kris said, there is a difference in the type of amplifier you use. A typical old-style amplifier is class AB, which will waste more than 1/2 the energy. A newer style is class D which uses digital logic to control the signal and can be 90% efficient. For battery operation at that level a class D amplifier will give you more than twice the battery life.

This impressive little board is all over ebay:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Digital-DC-...mplifier_Parts_Components&hash=item3392dfe963

Get 2 4Ω speakers and use each channel to run one one of them. Power it with 4 D cells and a low dropout 5V regulator and you can get up to 6W of power for several hours of playing at full blast.

Bob
 
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