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73's de Edd
- Aug 21, 2015
- 3,622
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Proceed on . . . . you certainly don't see 1100 watts on your Samsung back of set specifications sticker . . . .do you ?
?????
but if the relay needs to switch 3 - 4A at 12 - 30 V then a 3A relay will be under rated
I wondered about that but going to try it. What's next step to finding the problem if I get it installed?
73's de Edd
- Aug 21, 2015
- 3,622
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Sires . . . . . . . .
NO HIGH current, LOW voltage is being involved in this specific relays switching function .
Repeat of . . . .
Looks like the only chance on that relay is to use its identical mate with its more common terminals and use two appropiately gauged wire sets to form eyelets on one end and extend the other leads ends to reach through the old PCB holes.
Add on . . . .
The two closer teminals require minimal wire gauge to transport 5VDC at a mere 50 ma consumption of its relay coil.
The two greater spaced flat terminals carry the power switching involved with the relay.
In fabricating your round wire - right angle extensions, a wire gauge right at the limitationl aspects of the diameter of the pair of holes in the pcb should meet /exceed the current carrying capacity of the old units former flat bladed terminals.
FIO . . . .
Your set uses 78 watts in its standby mode operation, then there is need for the 5VDC standby supply to key on this relays contacts to then pass 178 watts when the set is turned on for its full operation mode.
That relays power switching function is for switching AC line derived, raw DC power from a FWB rectifier wth companion storage electrolytic, to the switch mode power supply of the unit.
The new unit easily loafs at half its specs in this function.
Had there been any worry with this designated RL802S replacement, on its max current respect, an identical, less critally taxed one, is also being used on the board at RL801S position . . . . 2.778895 CM further down the board.
After seeing that original relay . . . .shudder . . .shudder . . . . is there full assurance that you will not delaminate a PCB foil connection on the replacement of the relay? And will do quality soldering on the board / joints ?
Once installed, hook up the system as if you were fully expecting to get a picture and sound as in times past , and see if anything has happened since your last attempt . . . . . fill us in . . .then we proceed.
RELAY LEAD MODIFICATIONS :
73s de Edd
NO HIGH current, LOW voltage is being involved in this specific relays switching function .
Repeat of . . . .
Looks like the only chance on that relay is to use its identical mate with its more common terminals and use two appropiately gauged wire sets to form eyelets on one end and extend the other leads ends to reach through the old PCB holes.
Add on . . . .
The two closer teminals require minimal wire gauge to transport 5VDC at a mere 50 ma consumption of its relay coil.
The two greater spaced flat terminals carry the power switching involved with the relay.
In fabricating your round wire - right angle extensions, a wire gauge right at the limitationl aspects of the diameter of the pair of holes in the pcb should meet /exceed the current carrying capacity of the old units former flat bladed terminals.
FIO . . . .
Your set uses 78 watts in its standby mode operation, then there is need for the 5VDC standby supply to key on this relays contacts to then pass 178 watts when the set is turned on for its full operation mode.
That relays power switching function is for switching AC line derived, raw DC power from a FWB rectifier wth companion storage electrolytic, to the switch mode power supply of the unit.
The new unit easily loafs at half its specs in this function.
Had there been any worry with this designated RL802S replacement, on its max current respect, an identical, less critally taxed one, is also being used on the board at RL801S position . . . . 2.778895 CM further down the board.
After seeing that original relay . . . .shudder . . .shudder . . . . is there full assurance that you will not delaminate a PCB foil connection on the replacement of the relay? And will do quality soldering on the board / joints ?
Once installed, hook up the system as if you were fully expecting to get a picture and sound as in times past , and see if anything has happened since your last attempt . . . . . fill us in . . .then we proceed.
RELAY LEAD MODIFICATIONS :
73s de Edd
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Hey! I resemble that statement!
Well, even to my amazement, I did actually manage to get it soldered. I powered on my tv and checked the 4 connections I soldered. I get 120vAC, 120vAC, 5vDC, and ground.
So, what's next?
BTW, thank you for your patience, knowledge, and information!
Last edited by a moderator:
73's de Edd
- Aug 21, 2015
- 3,622
- Joined
- Aug 21, 2015
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Sir rutwad. . . . . . . .
Why . . .'soitanly . . . .
It’s just that I am edu-guessing that Samsung might have initially had their power supply design prototype
and then jobbed it out to be manufactured by 2 or 3 other firms / closet subsidiaries.
OR they might have just loosely given out their requirement specs and let others build them.
They were multi sourcing it . . . . . so as not to be caught in problem situations.
At any rate I am NOT currently finding any spot-on EXACT schematics of your unit.
Question:
Are there being any visible signs or responses from unit as per a LED lighting, or even a blip or any sound response of that little musical tone sequence / ditty that Samsung’s make, when it is now being turned on ?
Or with its additional two note solo, when it is being turned off.
You say:
I get 120vAC, 120vAC, 5vDC, and ground.
If you are measuring that RL802S's 5 VDC relay coils power, that means that the sets omnipresent 5VDC standby power supply is being O.K..
ALSO . . . . .Confirm that the 5VDC drops off, when the set is turned off.
Your measuring of that 120VAC on BOTH terminals of the relays POWER contacts, confirms that they are closing.
HOWEVER, that is merely being a " phantom " static leakage AC measurement, since you are using a COLD /isolated / floating ground on the relay coil side, while trying to take a measurement over on the HOT ( AC line connected portion of the power supply.)
Lets now additionally see if there actually IS being a DYNAMIC raw DC rectified B+ voltage of about 160-170 VDC present and being switched by the new relays power contacts . . . or . . . if possibly, that voltage IS NOT being present.
This will require the same test as was done before, but this time connect your DC metering negative test lead to a HOT ground.
The easiest, definitive access point, is being at the string of 5 looooong 450 VDC rated electrolytics towards center board from your just installed relay.
Use one of the negative marked leads of the electrolytic caps.
Testee-testee time . . . . .
73s de Edd
Why . . .'soitanly . . . .
It’s just that I am edu-guessing that Samsung might have initially had their power supply design prototype
and then jobbed it out to be manufactured by 2 or 3 other firms / closet subsidiaries.
OR they might have just loosely given out their requirement specs and let others build them.
They were multi sourcing it . . . . . so as not to be caught in problem situations.
At any rate I am NOT currently finding any spot-on EXACT schematics of your unit.
Question:
Are there being any visible signs or responses from unit as per a LED lighting, or even a blip or any sound response of that little musical tone sequence / ditty that Samsung’s make, when it is now being turned on ?
Or with its additional two note solo, when it is being turned off.
You say:
I get 120vAC, 120vAC, 5vDC, and ground.
If you are measuring that RL802S's 5 VDC relay coils power, that means that the sets omnipresent 5VDC standby power supply is being O.K..
ALSO . . . . .Confirm that the 5VDC drops off, when the set is turned off.
Your measuring of that 120VAC on BOTH terminals of the relays POWER contacts, confirms that they are closing.
HOWEVER, that is merely being a " phantom " static leakage AC measurement, since you are using a COLD /isolated / floating ground on the relay coil side, while trying to take a measurement over on the HOT ( AC line connected portion of the power supply.)
Lets now additionally see if there actually IS being a DYNAMIC raw DC rectified B+ voltage of about 160-170 VDC present and being switched by the new relays power contacts . . . or . . . if possibly, that voltage IS NOT being present.
This will require the same test as was done before, but this time connect your DC metering negative test lead to a HOT ground.
The easiest, definitive access point, is being at the string of 5 looooong 450 VDC rated electrolytics towards center board from your just installed relay.
Use one of the negative marked leads of the electrolytic caps.
Testee-testee time . . . . .
73s de Edd
Last edited by a moderator:
When I plug the TV in, I get a quick click and the blue light comes on and off just as quick. The blue light (not sure it's purpose) is located center just under tv screen.
Testing, testing, testing.... The only way I can get the tv to power down is by unplugging it. Well, it never powers on, but that is the only way to cut the current. Once unplugged the 5vDC remains maybe 5 seconds after unplugging the unit. Then there is a click and the voltage drops.
When plugged in I tested from hot side of relay I installed to negative line on the looong black "tubes". I get 61vAC. I checked all 4 and got the same. I also checked each tube hot and ground and they each read 169v.
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73's de Edd
- Aug 21, 2015
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Its not that I'm up to well above my head in piled up SAMSUNG schematics of YOUR/ THAT unit, but instead, I'm up to the soles of my feet . . . . .but still researching on / for it.
This is my only TV
And a vewy-vewy-VEWY-VEWY expensive Tee- Wee it was !
This is my only TV
And a vewy-vewy-VEWY-VEWY expensive Tee- Wee it was !
without more service info, a schematic at bare minimum, it's almost impossible to remotely diagnose further
would be somewhat easier is the unit was in front of Edd or myself, but even then without a schematic, very difficult
If you cannot get more info for the unit, you may not get it repaired at home and a service centre may be your only other choice
73's de Edd
- Aug 21, 2015
- 3,622
- Joined
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Ad continium . . . .
Sending praise your way . . . .we now DO know that the relay on the unit is now back to being good by virtue of replacement . . . performed with surgical quality of workmanship . . .we hope.
( Not the " looong black "tubes" )
We gonna let you slide on that one , but with no forthcoming:
Need your examination of the below.
REFERENCE:
We want to familiarize you in the proper non destructive pulling of that plug into the side of the power supply and the mechanical ergs involved.
With a dead unplugged set:
Use both hands . . . fingers side by side inline . . .grip the innerside, next to the PCB edge, of the white plug and the thumbs are side by side on frontside pressing in at the RED line.
That portion will cantilever inwards and let the GREEN line latched portion swing out and free of its being latched over of the companion mated BLACK jack connector.
Then you press knuckles against the metal framework for PRECISE bracing in acquiring controlled stability and slightly wiggle right and left halves of the plug while pulling away, outwardly to unplug the connected pair.
After unplugged . . . plug it back in . . . you are now pre-acquainted with the actions and forces involved for a later procedure.
Since you VERY LIKELY don't have a lab quality oscillosope nor journeyman experience in its analytical utilization, lets use a battery powered AM band pocket radio. I now give you time to beg-buy-borrow-steal one . . . hopefully borrowing, if you or friends/ family don't already have one.
73s de Edd
Sending praise your way . . . .we now DO know that the relay on the unit is now back to being good by virtue of replacement . . . performed with surgical quality of workmanship . . .we hope.
- We know that the standby power supply is functioning . . .by virtue of that relay clicking.
- We know that the required 165VDC power for a second power supply is present.
( Not the " looong black "tubes" )
We gonna let you slide on that one , but with no forthcoming:
- doohickey
- thing-a-ma-jig . . . or . . . thingy
- what-cha-ma-call-it
Need your examination of the below.
REFERENCE:
We want to familiarize you in the proper non destructive pulling of that plug into the side of the power supply and the mechanical ergs involved.
With a dead unplugged set:
Use both hands . . . fingers side by side inline . . .grip the innerside, next to the PCB edge, of the white plug and the thumbs are side by side on frontside pressing in at the RED line.
That portion will cantilever inwards and let the GREEN line latched portion swing out and free of its being latched over of the companion mated BLACK jack connector.
Then you press knuckles against the metal framework for PRECISE bracing in acquiring controlled stability and slightly wiggle right and left halves of the plug while pulling away, outwardly to unplug the connected pair.
After unplugged . . . plug it back in . . . you are now pre-acquainted with the actions and forces involved for a later procedure.
Since you VERY LIKELY don't have a lab quality oscillosope nor journeyman experience in its analytical utilization, lets use a battery powered AM band pocket radio. I now give you time to beg-buy-borrow-steal one . . . hopefully borrowing, if you or friends/ family don't already have one.
73s de Edd
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I tried Google before coming to the forum. It became obvious that I am only one of many having the same issues. I read how some fixed their sets, and even saw some youtube videos about the same. However, further reading shows they came back a short time later to admit it was only a temporary fix. Personally, I say it wasn't a fix at all. After doing what I have done to my TV and plugging it back in, it was not responsive at all, other than the initial click when I plugged it up or another click a few seconds after unplugging. I plugged it in several times. I tapped the back of the set (this worked for a couple years helping to power on), still nothing. I TAPPED the set a few times, yes harder. NOTHING! Left it unplugged for a few days and plugged in, nothing. After sitting a couple weeks or so unplugged, I plugged it in and now the blue light came on (not the screen. Small light under screen)...Again, this is my only set, so I have been without TV for a few weeks now. I have looked into new televisions and read reviews. Well, it was rave reviews that led me to this set years ago. So I went further this time and dug into forums. It seems Samsung has more than its fair share of problems. With the number of issues, I would expect to be reading about some no-name brand set. But somehow Samsung retains a HUGE share of the market building a great, short-life product. Quality and reliability do not seem to go together with Samsung. So I have decided to part ways with my set and move on. Well, I mentally made that decision but haven't financially committed.
I would like to mention that prior to my $4000 Samsung, I owned 2 different Loewe sets. Again, quality but no reliability. And they priced them based on quality instead of reliability. I'm done with splurging on TV's trying to achieve the best picture quality or most features, which I likely would not even use. I feel that a set without the best picture compared to others will indeed be the set with the best quality picture in my house. Without seeing one set next to another, I feel the difference will be less noticeable once home and almost any will do for my tv viewing.
I may go with LG, Vizio, Sony, or Panasonic.
I may take another look at my set this weekend and come up with a decision.
I would like to mention that prior to my $4000 Samsung, I owned 2 different Loewe sets. Again, quality but no reliability. And they priced them based on quality instead of reliability. I'm done with splurging on TV's trying to achieve the best picture quality or most features, which I likely would not even use. I feel that a set without the best picture compared to others will indeed be the set with the best quality picture in my house. Without seeing one set next to another, I feel the difference will be less noticeable once home and almost any will do for my tv viewing.
I may go with LG, Vizio, Sony, or Panasonic.
I may take another look at my set this weekend and come up with a decision.
$4000 ???? and you haven't taken it to a service agent ?? at worse it may cost around $150 for a quote for them to say how much it would cost to get fixed
They may be able to repair it for $300 - 500 and that's far cheaper than another multi $1000 replacement !
That is the first thing you should have done considering your lack of electronics knowledge
My AWA flatscreen LCD TV has been running 8 yrs, the Vizio in the bedroom been going about the same time
The HiSense 56" screen in the lounge is the newest @ around 4 yrs
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