Help with identify component (extra small)

[AlenZGB]

I try to fix my ps3 and i noticed that one component (dont know what it is)
has no markings and its around 1mm in size maybe more i try to look it on
microscope and i didnt see any markings or color rings just brown color.

Any advice on how can i identify this thing ?
its extra small so i couldnt took better picture

 

[jpanhalt]

It appears to be a ceramic capacitor. If you measure length and width in mm, we can tell you its physical size. My guess is an 805 or 603. With no background objects, it is hard to tell its physical size. If you scroll about half way down here, you can see the dimensions and size chart: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface-mount_technology

As for its value, can you measure it? How did it happen to get removed? Why do you think it is bad?

John

 

[AlenZGB]

I try to measure it but it wont give me nothing, and it was around 4,5 like him but this one was a little off the grid, few degrees turned out so i try to touch it and he moved, i try to solder it but nothing happen thats why i think its bad. But im not 100% sure.

Ill try to measure it but its really small

EDIT:
if i try to measure 2 pins where he was soldered, i get 75ohms.

 

[jpanhalt]

The fact that your couldn't solder it has nothing to do with whether the component is good or not.
1) Be sure the area is clean. There should be two, small pads that the part fits partially over.
2) Put a tiny bit of flux on the pads. I little dab of solder on the pad you will be soldering to first helps.
3) Solder. You can use a piece of music wire or even a tooth pick to hold the part while you solder it. Once you get one side soldered, the other is easy.

John

 

[AlenZGB]

Guess i eat few words, my bad.
i try to solder it and nothing happens i mean nothing i can measure. no reading at all.
like the its not on the board at all.
maybe a measure it wrong :/
try on ohms, and diod/sound.

 

[jpanhalt]

By "nothing" do you mean zero ohms or open circuit?

If zero ohms, then you have a short. It is possible for a capacitor to fail like that, but it is also possible for there to be a short in the solder. Did you test the capacitor before replacing it in the circuit?

John

 

[AlenZGB]

Open circuit.
How can i test capacitor? i dont have cable for capacitor testing, yet

 

[jpanhalt]

Open circuit is the way it should be, but something doesn't make sense.

Without the capacitor in the circuit, you got 75 ohms (post #3). In post #5 you imply that when it is soldered in circuit, you get an open circuit reading.

Have you soldered it into the circuit yet? How sure are you of where it goes?
At this point, maybe you should post a picture of the circuit where you think this capacitor belongs.

John

 

[AlenZGB]

doesent make any sense to me too.

here is picture with component on B136-600D

im 1000000% positive where it should be,
ill took few pictures, but need to take apart PS3.

 

[AlenZGB]

here is more pictures

EDIT:

last time was 75ohms
someone is crazy here for sure :/

 

[davenn]

the 75 Ohms across the pads in the circuit is reasonable ... all you are measuring is the "local" resistance of the circuit ... no probs

on an Ohm meter the capacitor will read open circuit .... you need a capacitance meter to read its value

again ... WHY do you think that capacitor is faulty ?
only because you took it out and got no reading ?
WHY did you take it out ?

Dave

 

[AlenZGB]

I know that its probably ok that 75ohms.
And i know that i cant measure capacitors with ohm meter, its look like resistor to me at first, thats why i ask someone who know better then me.

I think its faulty because it looks like it was ripped off (not by me), i just touch it and he moved, didnt even use any type of soldering to get him off.
My bad is that i use wrong tool
Ill learn, man cant know everthing

 

[jpanhalt]

OK, good photo. The ends of these small devices are plated (copper + tin?) so they take solder. Ceramic itself can't be soldered. From the ragged edges, it appears that the plating on the capacitor may have broken off and remained on the pads. I would not worry about the resistance reading between the two pads. One is probably to the ground plane. You should get a zero reading from that pad to similar pans on nearby capacitors or to the "via" right above the open pad.

First, I would clean the pads.
If you have "solder wick" that is great. If not, can you find some wire braid from a small piece of shielded cable? If you flatten the braid and add a little flux, it will work like solder braid. Put a little solder on the pad, then use the braid to remove it all. A damp (not saturated wet) paper towel can also be used to wipe away molten solder. If a piece of non-melted metal comes off with the clean up, then that probably pulled off the capacitor. (Copper may look salmon red.)

Once the pads are clean, you have a chance of soldering to them. Unfortunately, if the solder ends of the capacitor are torn off, I don't think the capacitor can be soldered. You might consider flipping the capacitor so the still good top side will take solder. I have not tried that and doubt that will give the proper electrical contact to the innards of the capacitor. Do you have any other capacitors in your box? If you have a leaded cap of 0.1 or 0.01 uF you might try carefully soldering the leads to the pad. Use the 0.1 uF, if you have both. Do you have any scrap boards with similar looking capacitors that you could take one from?

Does the PS3 work at all without the capacitor?

John

 

[AlenZGB]

I have wick and i did clean but since my hot air station broke down ill have to wait untill new heater arrive.

Since im not electrician, im car mechanic learning the ways of electronics, dont have any spare smd capacitors here, guess ill have to buy few of them just in case.

PS3 turn on, work about 3 sec and flash yellow light and then blinking red, so called yellow light of death (YOLD)

You sudgest i solder leaded cap of 0.1 or 0.01 uF.

 

[jpanhalt]

I was suggesting a capacitor of some sort. Since we don't know the value of the one that fell off, it was just a guess. You can test the capacitance of the old capacitor to know what to replace it with, if you can find a capacitance meter. If you get a strange or no reading, then it is probably damaged.

Assuming you don't have a way to test it, two things argue against the capacitor be re-usable:
1) Of course solder joints can break, but end plating on those small capacitors can also come off. The rough and pink area that appears on the pad is consistent with what peels off of the end caps. It could also just be lighting, and other things.
2) You were unable to get solder to stick to the ends of the capacitor. That could be just bad technique, but it is also consistent with a capacitor that is physically damaged. If you can't solder to the old capacitor, then you need one you can solder too.

1.0, 0.1, and 0.01 uF are common values among the many values that are available.

John

 

[AlenZGB]

lll try to find capacitance meter in some store here. I have feeling that ill be needing capacitance meter not only for this one.

there is one way to connect it to the board but dont know if its the right way, i have speaker wire from my in car speakers, can i solder some to board and then to old capacitor. Will that be a problem in resistance or something?

And one thing, is it matter how i turn that capacitor ?
i didnt see any marking like on regular capacitors and non of it on board,
So i guess he dont have polarity or am i mistaking ?

 

[jpanhalt]

I just posted on another capacitor failure thread. You may want to look at the links therein (Post #24)( https://www.electronicspoint.com/these-things-t267413p3.html ). There is a good picture of how ceramic capacitors are made. It shows why, if the end cap/plating has been pulled off, I think the capacitor is worthless.

Ceramic capacitors are not polarized. They can go in either way.

John

 

[AlenZGB]

I just watched that thread.
Guess ill have to buy capacitance meter as soon as possible.
to solve this capacitor mystery.

 

[jpanhalt]

Those tiny capacitors come on paper strips. You generally buy multiples at a time,such as 10, 50, 100 or thousands. When you look for your meter you may want to add some strips of common values. They are very cheap. That is why I never worry whether a capacitor is still good after being abused. I just replace. In fact, I usually lose them in the carpet before I can test them. .

John

 

[AlenZGB]

haha
I was thinking the same thing, thats why wonted to get new one before i lose the old one
so strip of 1.0, 0.1, and 0.01 uF it will be D