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XML and spice

Discussion in 'CAD' started by Insane And Lazy, Aug 28, 2004.

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  1. I saw that this question has been covered and debated many times in the
    past. Is there a version of spice (preferably free) that uses XML as
    input instead of the standard netlists?
     
  2. : I saw that this question has been covered and debated many times in the
    : past. Is there a version of spice (preferably free) that uses XML as
    : input instead of the standard netlists?

    I am curious why you are interested in XML netlists for circuit
    simulators. Do you have an application in mind which would be enabled
    or eased by using XML?

    Stuart
     
  3. Mantra

    Mantra Guest

    I know of none, but it wouldn't be hard to write a SAX-based parser
    that could translate from some hypothetical, as-yet-undefined
    DTD/Schema to a "standard" SPICE netlist.

    MM
     
  4. I was never on the XML bandwagon, but it does allow for a well defined
    ASCII file format, and there are lots of parsers out there for it. Also,
    I saw a reference on the Parametric Technology website about a public
    XML DTD associated with their Pro/ENGINEER Routed Systems Designer, but I
    can't find where that public specification is actually available.
     
  5. SPICE defines both a program and a netlist file format. The file
    format is ASCII, compact, and is well entrenched. Since the file
    format is ASCII, SPICE netlists are human readable, which -- besides
    the ready availability of parsers -- is the only real advantage to
    XML. Currently existing SPICE simulators have parsers built in which
    already read and parse the format.

    It is true that lots of XML parsers are out there. However, that's
    only 1/100th the job performed when reading in a SPICE netlist. The
    other 99/100th involves filling out the circuit and simulation data
    structures which SPICE uses to do its computations, and then solving
    the matrix equations iteratively. That means that just having
    an XML parser in hand is barely a beginning to writing a circuit
    simulator.

    Finallly, there are zillions of SPICE models already out there for
    useful components. Unless there is a really something new and
    astounding whiich you can do with an XML format, it's unlikely that
    people will ever change.

    Stuart



    : I was never on the XML bandwagon, but it does allow for a well defined
    : ASCII file format, and there are lots of parsers out there for it. Also,
    : I saw a reference on the Parametric Technology website about a public
    : XML DTD associated with their Pro/ENGINEER Routed Systems Designer, but I
    : can't find where that public specification is actually available.



    :> From: Stuart Brorson ()
    :> Subject: Re: XML and spice
    :>
    :> Newsgroups: sci.electronics.cad
    :> Date: 2004-08-29 17:17:40 PST
    :>
    :> I am curious why you are interested in XML netlists for circuit
    :> simulators. Do you have an application in mind which would be enabled
    :> or eased by using XML?
    :>
    :> Stuart
    :>



    :> From: Mantra ()
    :> Subject: Re: XML and spice
    :>
    :> Newsgroups: sci.electronics.cad
    :> Date: 2004-08-29 20:17:37 PST
    :>
    :> I know of none, but it wouldn't be hard to write a SAX-based parser
    :> that could translate from some hypothetical, as-yet-undefined
    :> DTD/Schema to a "standard" SPICE netlist.
    :>
    :> MM
    :>
    : Insane And Lazy wrote:

    :> I saw that this question has been covered and debated many times in the
    :> past. Is there a version of spice (preferably free) that uses XML as
    :> input instead of the standard netlists?
     
  6. Having a netlist in XML format would make it easier to:

    a) generate the netlist from an external GUI (no need to learn all the details
    of the ASCII netlist file format).
    b) draw a schematic of a pre-existing netlist

    So basically, it would save me/others from having to learn how to parse the
    current ASCII netlist file format.
     
  7. The use of SPICE-XML as a common place for models, topology and
    parameters for analog circuitry. Lack of topology info in SPICE is a
    real drawback.

    You could theoretically read a circuit definition into a program without
    the need of writing a spice parser yourself. There are enough libraries
    for XML parsing out there, let it be SAX or DOM.

    Another thing that is not so evil with XML is that you are allowed to
    insert whatever *additional* information you would like to. XML say that
    you have to treat data you don't need well and leave it alone. There are
    enough tries to add information in SPICE netlist as secert codes in the
    comments.

    XML is an extreme overhead on the functionality of SPICE as a hardware
    description language, and replacing the structure of SPICE with that of
    XML just to make it XML is, in my opinion, not a reason to change.
     
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