Transmitting low-wattage, high-voltage electricity through air.

[Radium]

Hi:

Can a direct current with a potential-difference of
6,200,000,000,000,000,000 volts but an extremely weak maximum strength
of only 1 electron per second move through air like the electric
currents of lightning and stun guns can?

If so, is it possible to transmit this high-voltage, low-wattage [1
watt if the math is worked out] DC electricity in a wireless manner
through air molecules?


Thanks,

Radium

 

[Eric Gisse]

[snip stupidity]

Don't post here again until you graduate from high school - or you
learn scientific notation. Whichever comes later.

 

[PD]

Hi:

Can a direct current with a potential-difference of
6,200,000,000,000,000,000 volts but an extremely weak maximum strength
of only 1 electron per second move through air like the electric
currents of lightning and stun guns can?

No.
A potential difference of that size cannot be maintained in air.
The dielectric strength of air is about 3,000,000 V/m, above which the
air will break down. This is the fundamental reason why high-tension
power lines are not run at a zillion volts. This is also the
fundamental problem with your scheme, as others tried to broadly hint.

If so, is it possible to transmit this high-voltage, low-wattage [1
watt if the math is worked out] DC electricity in a wireless manner
through air molecules?

Thanks,

Radium

 

[Radium]

A potential difference of that size cannot be maintained in air.
The dielectric strength of air is about 3,000,000 V/m, above which the
air will break down.

Doesn't the air need to breakdown before electricity can pass through
it?

AFAIK, electricity cannot move through non-ionized air. How else can
the electrons pass through air?

This is the fundamental reason why high-tension
power lines are not run at a zillion volts.

Obviously, if you want current to move through wires [but not air],
you'd definitely keep the voltage below the point of breakdown.

 

[PD]

Doesn't the air need to breakdown before electricity can pass through
it?

And then you can sustain no higher potential difference than what is
constrained by 3,000,000 V/m. That is, that's the top end. Once the
air is broken down, that's your potential difference.

Note also that once the air breaks down, you can no longer control the
path of the current between points A and B.

Moreover, you cannot control the current between A and B, because the
very same breakdown of the air *adds* charge that can be moved between
A and B. You will no longer have 1 electron per second. A column of
air 1 m wide by 100 m long contains about 1200 kg of air, or about
2.5E28 molecules. Breakdown is the liberation of electrons from the
atoms in the column of air. Since you have some difficulty with
scientific notation, that's 25,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
atoms that can lend electrons in that column.

PD

AFAIK, electricity cannot move through non-ionized air. How else can
the electrons pass through air?

This is the fundamental reason why high-tension
power lines are not run at a zillion volts.

Obviously, if you want current to move through wires [but not air],
you'd definitely keep the voltage below the point of breakdown.

This is also the
fundamental problem with your scheme, as others tried to broadly hint.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

 

[Radium]

And then you can sustain no higher potential difference than what is
constrained by 3,000,000 V/m. That is, that's the top end. Once the
air is broken down, that's your potential difference.

So 3,000,000 V/m is the highest voltage than can exist in the air?

Note also that once the air breaks down, you can no longer control the
path of the current between points A and B.

What is the highest voltage at which this current can be efficiently
controlled?

 

[PD]

So 3,000,000 V/m is the highest voltage than can exist in the air?

That's actually a field value. (Note the units.)
But it's more complicated than mulitiplying a field times a distance
to get a voltage, because that assumes a uniform field, and that is
NOT the case. The shape of the electrode governs a lot about the field
strength in the immediate vicinity of the electrode. To learn more how
to do this, you'd simply have to study chapters and do homework in the
field and potential chapters of a calculus-based elementary physics
text. No shortcut, though.

What is the highest voltage at which this current can be efficiently
controlled?

No simple answer. See above.

 

[boson boss]

And then you can sustain no higher potential difference than what is
constrained by 3,000,000 V/m. That is, that's the top end. Once the
air is broken down, that's your potential difference.

Note also that once the air breaks down, you can no longer control the
path of the current between points A and B.

Moreover, you cannot control the current between A and B, because the
very same breakdown of the air *adds* charge that can be moved between
A and B. You will no longer have 1 electron per second. A column of
air 1 m wide by 100 m long contains about 1200 kg of air, or about
2.5E28 molecules. Breakdown is the liberation of electrons from the
atoms in the column of air. Since you have some difficulty with
scientific notation, that's 25,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000
atoms that can lend electrons in that column.

PD

This is suspicious. Why not add a meter or two for a 3-million or 6?
But then, this kind of energy must be a gamma quanta and forget air?

 

[matt2 - amstereo]

it may be easier to move electicity through air via induction (such as
an induction loop arrangment) or through transmittion.

a tuned transmitter and receiver can move electiricy, thats how radio
works. at close proximity, you can light a lightbulb from a 27MHz cb
using a tuned antanna attached to the bulb.

 

[bb]

This is suspicious. Why not add a meter or two for a 3-million or 6?
But then, this kind of energy must be a gamma quanta and forget air?

And not to forget http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:TrigaReactorCore.jpeg

 

[Radium]

it may be easier to move electicity through air via induction (such as
an induction loop arrangment) or through transmittion.

a tuned transmitter and receiver can move electiricy, thats how radio
works. at close proximity, you can light a lightbulb from a 27MHz cb
using a tuned antanna attached to the bulb.

You are talking about EM radiation caused by AC current.

I am discussing movement of DC electric current through air. No
electromagnetic radiation, no magnetism, no AC. Just plain DC electric
current that passes through air instead of metal.

Electricity, not electromagnetic waves. There is a significant
difference between the two.

 

[Don Kelly]

--

Don Kelly [email protected]
remove the X to answer
----------------------------

Hi:

Can a direct current with a potential-difference of
6,200,000,000,000,000,000 volts but an extremely weak maximum strength
of only 1 electron per second move through air like the electric
currents of lightning and stun guns can?

If so, is it possible to transmit this high-voltage, low-wattage [1
watt if the math is worked out] DC electricity in a wireless manner
through air molecules?


Thanks,

Radium

I don't know where you get your numbers but the equipment air gaps would
have to be in the order of 2 billion Km -not in this world! - and, if you
have 1 electron being accelerated by the field, there will be an avalance
effect- breakdown.
I suggest that you actually learn something about the subject before you go
back to the drawing board.

However, what's the point - it is a meaningless exercise.[/QUOTE]

 

[[email protected]]

| Can a direct current with a potential-difference of
| 6,200,000,000,000,000,000 volts but an extremely weak maximum strength
| of only 1 electron per second move through air like the electric
| currents of lightning and stun guns can?

It certain can move through the air. But making it useful in some
controlled way is not likely to be possible. At that voltage it will
just do whatever it wants, which is most likely to bypass everything
you try to do to catch it and disappear out the other end.


| If so, is it possible to transmit this high-voltage, low-wattage [1
| watt if the math is worked out] DC electricity in a wireless manner
| through air molecules?

It likely will transmit. It likely will keep on going beyond where you
want to use the power. At this point it's nothing more than radiation.

 

[Radium]

In alt.engineering.electrical Radium <[email protected]> wrote:

| Can a direct current with a potential-difference of
| 6,200,000,000,000,000,000 volts but an extremely weak maximum strength
| of only 1 electron per second move through air like the electric
| currents of lightning and stun guns can?

It certain can move through the air. But making it useful in some
controlled way is not likely to be possible. At that voltage it will
just do whatever it wants, which is most likely to bypass everything
you try to do to catch it and disappear out the other end.
Okay.

| If so, is it possible to transmit this high-voltage, low-wattage [1
| watt if the math is worked out] DC electricity in a wireless manner
| through air molecules?

It likely will transmit. It likely will keep on going beyond where you
want to use the power. At this point it's nothing more than radiation.

Then what is the maximum practical voltage [combined the minimum
amperage] which can be used for any application? What is the minimum
practical amperage?

The application involves ridding the world of the need for wires and
other metals [as much as practical] for the generation, amplification,
attenuation, processing, recording, playback, transmission, and
reception of DC electric currents without converted the DC current to
any other form.

Wireless DC electricity that remains purely-electric from point A to
point B. Tesla's designs did not remain purely-electric as they
involve transmission/reception of radio waves for power. Whereas, what
I am thinking of remains purely-electric all the way along.

 

[The Great Attractor]

The application involves ridding the world of the need for wires and
other metals [as much as practical] for the generation, amplification,
attenuation, processing, recording, playback, transmission, and
reception of DC electric currents without converted the DC current to
any other form.

You are thoroughly lost. What do you think EM radio is?

 

[The Great Attractor]

Wireless DC electricity that remains purely-electric from point A to
point B. Tesla's designs did not remain purely-electric as they
involve transmission/reception of radio waves for power. Whereas, what
I am thinking of remains purely-electric all the way along.

Which would WASTE a LOT more power, and get a LOT LESS done.

Just stop, and get back to reality. There are thousands of scientists
in this realm. Your ideas are CRAP. If you want scientific recognition,
you need to learn the science that IS being used first, then you will
know what is or is not feasible.

Single electrons floating around in the air with designated
destinations are NOT feasible.

 

[[email protected]]

| On May 13, 6:33 am, [email protected] wrote:
|
|
|> | Can a direct current with a potential-difference of
|> | 6,200,000,000,000,000,000 volts but an extremely weak maximum strength
|> | of only 1 electron per second move through air like the electric
|> | currents of lightning and stun guns can?
|
|> It certain can move through the air. But making it useful in some
|> controlled way is not likely to be possible. At that voltage it will
|> just do whatever it wants, which is most likely to bypass everything
|> you try to do to catch it and disappear out the other end.
|
| Okay.
|
|> | If so, is it possible to transmit this high-voltage, low-wattage [1
|> | watt if the math is worked out] DC electricity in a wireless manner
|> | through air molecules?
|
|> It likely will transmit. It likely will keep on going beyond where you
|> want to use the power. At this point it's nothing more than radiation.
|
| Then what is the maximum practical voltage [combined the minimum
| amperage] which can be used for any application? What is the minimum
| practical amperage?
|
| The application involves ridding the world of the need for wires and
| other metals [as much as practical] for the generation, amplification,
| attenuation, processing, recording, playback, transmission, and
| reception of DC electric currents without converted the DC current to
| any other form.
|
| Wireless DC electricity that remains purely-electric from point A to
| point B. Tesla's designs did not remain purely-electric as they
| involve transmission/reception of radio waves for power. Whereas, what
| I am thinking of remains purely-electric all the way along.

You're thinking of something akin to beta radiation. We try to avoid
that in large concentrations. They use this to kill anthrax in mail.
I worry it might be a cause of cancer.

Spend your time trying to figure ways to accomplish work using less power
and energy to do it. Maybe you can get your peecee to be efficient enough
to run on the ambient room light. People have built radios that can do
that, so why not a computer?

 

[[email protected]]

As to transmission of electricity thru air, didn't Tesla work on this
100 years ago with high frequency electricity. How does this new
development for cordless chargers, power supplies, etc. differ?

 

[Sue...]

Hi:

Can a direct current with a potential-difference of
6,200,000,000,000,000,000 volts but an extremely weak maximum strength
of only 1 electron per second move through air like the electric
currents of lightning and stun guns can?

If so, is it possible to transmit this high-voltage, low-wattage [1
watt if the math is worked out] DC electricity in a wireless manner
through air molecules?

Thanks,

Radium

Illuminate the interior of your home with magnetrons
and "stirrers". The copper you salvage from the old
baseboard heaters should fetch enough at the salvage
yard to buy a couple bottles of cheap wine and you
might even stumble into a couple of free 'maggies'
for relamping the system.

Sue...