Telephone and FCC and CSA help

[Arch-lab]

I want to hook up my project to the phone line.

What are the best methods out there to ensure that my DAA will pass FCC and/or
CSA approval?

I saw part of a CS-03 document, and it was so far out there with general
comments that there wasn't any nice outline of really what guidelines to
follow.

Anyone passed one of there certifications?
If yes, what do you recommened to read (Yes, it is my own built DAA) ?


Thanks

 

[Michael Black]

I want to hook up my project to the phone line.

What are the best methods out there to ensure that my DAA will pass FCC and/or
CSA approval?

I saw part of a CS-03 document, and it was so far out there with general
comments that there wasn't any nice outline of really what guidelines to
follow.

Anyone passed one of there certifications?
If yes, what do you recommened to read (Yes, it is my own built DAA) ?


Thanks

The way around it is to buy a pre-built DAA, that's been approved.
Unless you have a need for a lot of them, it is far cheaper to
buy an expensive DAA than to try to get a home made unit approved.

I don't know about the DAA's, but when it comes to CSA approval
it's not just a matter of meeting certain specs. It actually
has to be tested or approved. And that's where the high cost
comes in, because you have to pay for that testing.

Michael

 

[Arch-lab]

The way around it is to buy a pre-built DAA, that's been approved.
Unless you have a need for a lot of them, it is far cheaper to
buy an expensive DAA than to try to get a home made unit approved.

You still need it tested from what I've been told about these FCC parts.
Apparently because once you put them in your circuit, you still need to pay to
get the whole thing tested as a unit.

I don't know about the DAA's, but when it comes to CSA approval
it's not just a matter of meeting certain specs. It actually
has to be tested or approved. And that's where the high cost
comes in, because you have to pay for that testing.

I'm pretty sure that both require actual physical testing.

 

[Dave VanHorn]

I'm pretty sure that both require actual physical testing.

FCC part 68 isn't bad. Of all the DAA's I've done, the US is the simplest.
Testing will run you about $2000 or so, depending on how well it goes.

The best way to be sure, is to do your own testing. Most of the testing can
be done with homebrew test gear, to within 1-2dB.

German, French, and Swedish requirements were more interesting.

The DAA circuitry will end up at $5 or so in moderate quantities.
Compare that to the pre-certified DAA pricing, and decide wether you're
better off to take the one-shot cost of engineering and testing.

"Understanding Telephone Electronics" is back in print, much more impressive
looking, thicker, and now $30 instead of $5. It's a very good book on the
subject. Sort of the AofE of the daa world.

 

[Arch-lab]

Thanks Dave I will check on that book. It covers actual DAA design?

Would you know about any certification stuff for Canada?

 

[Arch-lab]

The way around it is to buy a pre-built DAA, that's been approved.
Unless you have a need for a lot of them, it is far cheaper to
buy an expensive DAA than to try to get a home made unit approved.

I checked a mfg. site and they say, if it is their "certified" DAA part, then
you still need to pay to have it tested, but if it is "registered" you don't
have to pay...

Now to see what they charge for the "registered" parts...

However, my real point in all this is to just build my own because I already
have built it, and would like to fine tune it. I mean just even looking at
this "made in China" 5$ phone I took apart their DAA is even simpler than mine
and they are selling these phones here...
(Then again, I'm not sure if Canada requires CSA approval, or if that is up to
the consumer. I think the USA requires FCC otherwise it is illegal to connect
to the phone line.)

 

[Dave VanHorn]

Thanks Dave I will check on that book. It covers actual DAA design?

It spells out all the requirements nicely, and shows you how they are met in
a few example designs.

Would you know about any certification stuff for Canada?

I don't remember the details on canada, which seems odd. Basically, you'll
find that everything pretty much lumps into "british-like" and "usa-like"
with some local variations that are harder to meet like the swedish return
loss spec, the french 100mA loop current requirement, or the german billing
pulse filter. I don't remember anything specifically different about canada
though.

If this is something you're experimenting with at home, I wouldn't worry too
much about it.
Just don't get too wild, or the local CO may decide to terminate your
service for a while.

If it's for something you're intending to sell, then I'm afraid you need to
bite the bullet and get your approvals. It's not cheap, but if we don't do
this, then we end up with a hopelessly hosed phone system, and polluted
airwaves. Although the US now allows us to self-certify, my company still
does third party testing at an independent lab. I'm headed up there in the
next week or so to get part 15 on our latest design.

 

[Tim Shoppa]

I checked a mfg. site and they say, if it is their "certified" DAA part, then
you still need to pay to have it tested, but if it is "registered" you don't
have to pay...

Now to see what they charge for the "registered" parts...

However, my real point in all this is to just build my own because I already
have built it, and would like to fine tune it. I mean just even looking at
this "made in China" 5$ phone I took apart their DAA is even simpler than mine
and they are selling these phones here...

You don't say what your device hooks to other than the phone lines. If
it hooks to stuff other than the phone lines, then things get a little
bit more complex than a simple $5 phone.

(Then again, I'm not sure if Canada requires CSA approval, or if that is up to
the consumer. I think the USA requires FCC otherwise it is illegal to connect
to the phone line.)

I don't think it's CSA in Canada for phone stuff... CRTC? A sub-agency
of the CRTC?

Tim.

 

[Spehro Pefhany]

You don't say what your device hooks to other than the phone lines. If
it hooks to stuff other than the phone lines, then things get a little
bit more complex than a simple $5 phone.


I don't think it's CSA in Canada for phone stuff... CRTC? A sub-agency
of the CRTC?

Not CSA. I believe it's under Industry Canada..

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany

 

[Michael Black]

You don't say what your device hooks to other than the phone lines. If
it hooks to stuff other than the phone lines, then things get a little
bit more complex than a simple $5 phone.


I don't think it's CSA in Canada for phone stuff... CRTC? A sub-agency
of the CRTC?

Tim.

Of course, the manufacturers of those $5 phones expect to sell a lot,
so they design for as low a cost as possible, and can justify they
full cost of getting approval (since it's spread over so many). As
you say, it is a self contained unit, so everything is well defined.
They don't have to worry about someone connecting something that will
damage the phone line, so they don't have to accomodate a lot of unknown.

It would be Industry Canada in Canada. But this has gotten pretty
big, so I have no idea specific section controls telephone equipment.
The CRTC is about content, and tarriffs, rather than technical matters.

Michael

 

[HERAUD LUC]

Hello,

A few information about DAA, have a look at the CLARE site:
http://www.clare.com/Products/Products.htm

They have excellent DAA. I use the Litelink chipset which is a very good one
for a PCI card design for my company. There is a kit available for test. Lot
of documentation available and a few words about approuval and FCC.

wish it will help.