Maker Pro
Maker Pro

tachometer using 555 IC and LM3917

F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
i want to build LED based tachometer for my motorcycle.my friend gave
me the schematic of tachometer published in ELEKTOR in 10/1998
http://fly.srk.fer.hr/~wgottwe/e98a034.pdf .it uses LM3914 as LED
driver and 555 timer for frequency to voltage conversion.
i bought every component and assembled on bread board.but its not
working.
1.i used another 555 IC insted of TLC555 is it ok?
2.for induction pickup i did exactly what mentioned in the article.as
my vehicle is CDI i can't get signal from ignition coil.
3.when i measued the output as shown in the below pic.it was stable 5v
without any effect to the RPM of vehicle.
http://img97.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0mh0.gif

i desperately need help to finish this project.
pls help me
thanks
 
H

Homer J Simpson

Jan 1, 1970
0
fever said:
i want to build LED based tachometer for my motorcycle.my friend gave
me the schematic of tachometer published in ELEKTOR in 10/1998
http://fly.srk.fer.hr/~wgottwe/e98a034.pdf .it uses LM3914 as LED
driver and 555 timer for frequency to voltage conversion.
i bought every component and assembled on bread board.but its not
working.
1.i used another 555 IC insted of TLC555 is it ok?
2.for induction pickup i did exactly what mentioned in the article.as
my vehicle is CDI i can't get signal from ignition coil.
3.when i measued the output as shown in the below pic.it was stable 5v
without any effect to the RPM of vehicle.
http://img97.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0mh0.gif

Can you exercise the input with a square wave generator?
 
D

Donald

Jan 1, 1970
0
fever said:
i want to build LED based tachometer for my motorcycle.my friend gave
me the schematic of tachometer published in ELEKTOR in 10/1998
http://fly.srk.fer.hr/~wgottwe/e98a034.pdf .it uses LM3914 as LED
driver and 555 timer for frequency to voltage conversion.
i bought every component and assembled on bread board.but its not
working.
1.i used another 555 IC insted of TLC555 is it ok?

Which manufacture ???

The TLC555 is a low power CMOS, is the 555 you used a NMOS ??

2.for induction pickup i did exactly what mentioned in the article.as
my vehicle is CDI i can't get signal from ignition coil.

Do you have a o'scope available ??
3.when i measued the output as shown in the below pic.it was stable 5v
without any effect to the RPM of vehicle.

Did you wire this up yourself ??

Did you wire up more then one unit yourself ??
http://img97.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0mh0.gif

i desperately need help to finish this project.

Desperate enough to pay money ??
pls help me

Help us help you, give enough information, please.


PS: learn how to spell.
 
F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
Which manufacture ???
The TLC555 is a low power CMOS, is the 555 you used a NMOS ??

the 55 IC iam using is NE555N.do i need exactly TLC555 or 7555 IC?

no i don't have osci'scope.but i tried blow ckt.and the LED present in
the ckt start flashing when i rise the throttle of motorcycle.
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/3820/inductiveledix5.gif

i don't understand where and what iam doing wong.is the elektor
tachometer ckt right??
or its not working bcz of using NE555N insted of TLC555???
 
D

Donald

Jan 1, 1970
0
fever said:
the 55 IC iam using is NE555N.do i need exactly TLC555 or 7555 IC?

no i don't have osci'scope.but i tried blow ckt.and the LED present in
the ckt start flashing when i rise the throttle of motorcycle.
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/3820/inductiveledix5.gif

i don't understand where and what iam doing wong.is the elektor
tachometer ckt right??
or its not working bcz of using NE555N insted of TLC555???

You have no idea what you are doing.

There is more than building a circuit then replace parts without
reviewing the data sheets.


If you used all the parts suggested in the parts list and it still did
not work, would you blame the author for writing the project wrong.

Good Luck.
 
J

John Woodgate

Jan 1, 1970
0
dated said:
If you used all the parts suggested in the parts list and it still did
not work, would you blame the author for writing the project wrong.

Depends. Some magazines employed illiterate hippos as printers, so you
could never trust the circuits and parts lists to be error-free. Some
still do; you see '47MW' resistors and '1000 F' capacitors called up.
 
F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you used all the parts suggested in the parts list and it still did
not work, would you blame the author for writing the project wrong.

well iam not blaming any one.i just want to confirm.
some guy just mailed me abt this elektor tachometer,that they printed
wrong resistor values.and they corrected it in the next release.
and iam from mechanical filed.i don't have much knowledge in
electronics(just moderate).problem is i have to finish this project all
by myself.
so iam asking u ppl as u know more than me.
any more views regading this project will be appriciated.
thanks
 
F

Fred Bloggs

Jan 1, 1970
0
i want to build LED based tachometer for my motorcycle.my friend gave
me the schematic of tachometer published in ELEKTOR in 10/1998
http://fly.srk.fer.hr/~wgottwe/e98a034.pdf .it uses LM3914 as LED
driver and 555 timer for frequency to voltage conversion.
i bought every component and assembled on bread board.but its not
working.
1.i used another 555 IC insted of TLC555 is it ok?

No- you *must* use a CMOS 555 like the TLC555 for two reasons: C3,R3,
and R4 are sized for a CMOS input current and 100ms time constant, and
it is essential that the 555 output go all the way to 5V. The bipolar
NE555 types will not work in this circuit.
2.for induction pickup i did exactly what mentioned in the article.as
my vehicle is CDI i can't get signal from ignition coil.

Sure-that's fine.
3.when i measued the output as shown in the below pic.it was stable 5v
without any effect to the RPM of vehicle.
http://img97.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0mh0.gif

Use a TLC555 and see if that doesn't improve things.
 
L

Luhan

Jan 1, 1970
0
fever said:
i want to build LED based tachometer for my motorcycle.my friend gave
me the schematic of tachometer published in ELEKTOR in 10/1998
http://fly.srk.fer.hr/~wgottwe/e98a034.pdf .it uses LM3914 as LED
driver and 555 timer for frequency to voltage conversion.
i bought every component and assembled on bread board.but its not
working.
1.i used another 555 IC insted of TLC555 is it ok?
2.for induction pickup i did exactly what mentioned in the article.as
my vehicle is CDI i can't get signal from ignition coil.
3.when i measued the output as shown in the below pic.it was stable 5v
without any effect to the RPM of vehicle.
http://img97.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0mh0.gif

i desperately need help to finish this project.
pls help me
thanks

Measure the voltage on C1 with a digital voltmeter. If you have
increasing voltage there with RPM, did you put that jumper in???

Luhan
 
F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
thanks fred(and other ppl too)
i'll try cmos version of 555 first(can i use 7555 insted of TLC555 as
it is also cmos version).and will post results.

iam using breadboard for trials.
i'll try 555 circuit first and then combined with LM3917.
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
1.i used another 555 IC insted of TLC555 is it ok?
No, or probably no
2.for induction pickup i did exactly what mentioned in the article.as
my vehicle is CDI i can't get signal from ignition coil.

With it outputing 5 volts - the thing is probably not working because
the timing values are for a cmos 555 not a bipolar - recalculate or
switch parts first.

Beyond that. . . I had the same problem and ended up using a toroid -
pass the cable through the core and wind a few turns around it for
signal ground one end use the other to input the 555.

You should be able to test your circuit by repetitively grounding pin
2 on the 555 to simulate a signal - once you get it working.

I wasn't too happy with the toriod on the spark plug because it took
so much filtering to have only one led light at a time, that I was
looking at the RPM ten seconds ago - I ended up using the signal from
my 12 pole alternator with just a little filtering. One pulse per
revolution isn't enough for a fast reaponse.
 
F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
Beyond that. . . I had the same problem and ended up using a toroid -
pass the cable through the core and wind a few turns around it for
signal ground one end use the other to input the 555.

u mean like this.ofcourse with lesser dia. core. (sorry for such bad
pic)
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8909/ideaof4.gif
I wasn't too happy with the toriod on the spark plug because it took
so much filtering to have only one led light at a time, that I was
looking at the RPM ten seconds ago - I ended up using the signal from
my 12 pole alternator with just a little filtering. One pulse per
revolution isn't enough for a fast reaponse.

first i want to trial on sparkplug cable only.if it failed i'll go for
other method.as currently i don't have tools to messup with my
motorcycle.
and someone told me not to connect other end of signal wire to ground.i
think i need to experement these 2(imean connecting to ground and
leaving the end)
**have u used 555 ic for ur tachometer?
what shld be rough dia of wire that shld be wound on ferrite core?
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
u mean like this.ofcourse with lesser dia. core. (sorry for such bad
pic)
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8909/ideaof4.gif

Yeah, just like that. Or one of the "clam shell" type cores radio
shack sells to put around power cords to limit RFI might work
first i want to trial on sparkplug cable only.if it failed i'll go for
other method.as currently i don't have tools to messup with my
motorcycle.

and someone told me not to connect other end of signal wire to ground.i
think i need to experement these 2(imean connecting to ground and
leaving the end)

Wrapping the sense wire around the spark plug wire does not provide an
"inductive" pickup. The wire is not oriented correctly to inductively
couple much energy. Leaving it ungrounded gives you a capacitive pick
up.

When you use a core you're making a transformer with a single turn
primary (the spark plug wire) and need to ground one end of the
secondary to develop voltage input to your circuit.

**have u used 555 ic for ur tachometer?

I started with the 555 charge pump then tried a LM2917 (I think that's
the number - frequency to voltage convertor) Better smoothing with a
smaller cap, but still not what I wanted. Leds have the ability to
outperform a mechanical meter for response time - seemed a shame to
hobble them with a large filter cap.
what shld be rough dia of wire that shld be wound on ferrite core?

Use whatever you want - the current and voltage are low it won't
matter too much. Better to wind the wire around the entire core
rather than have all the turns bunched at one side - so space them
out.

When I started thinking about what I was doing . . . do I really need
to know when it is turning 500 RPM? My motorcycle idle speed is
supposed to be 1100 RPM and it won't run slower than 800 RPM, so one
LED is virtually useless unless the starter motor is spinning the
engine.

Then the idea of only 20 LEDs wasn't too my liking either. Red-line
is 12,000 RPM not plus or minus 500 RPM. The final version of my tach
used a set of four comparators to change the scale of the 20 led
display. 1000-4000, 4000-7000, 7000-10000, 10000-13000.

Each of the comparators has a reference voltage that they compare to
the signal from the charge pump, as each comparator's range is
exceeded it lights an LED to tell me the range it is on, and connects
its reference voltage to the display (via an analog switch IC).

So I've got 20 LEDS doing the work of 80 and have 150 rpm resolution -
and it took me a month to get working. but the display goes around
four times now.

I used a 4" PVC plumbing fitting for a housing and put a thin ring of
4" pipe in it to give me a ledge to seal the display board to - I
didn't use a PC board and made it in two assemblies.

Most of the time and fun was on the breadboarding of it and developing
the idea. I think I have something like a total of 7 IC's in it if I
count the two regulators (one is for the power supply and another for
the reference).

I even incorporated a high/low switch for display brightness but found
that 6 ma per led was more than enough for high efficiency leds.
 
F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
sure i'll keep in mind abt grounding the other end of pickup coil.
I started with the 555 charge pump then tried a LM2917 (I think that's
the number - frequency to voltage convertor) Better smoothing with a
smaller cap, but still not what I wanted. Leds have the ability to
outperform a mechanical meter for response time - seemed a shame to
hobble them with a large filter cap.

wow thats a quite detail explanation.
thanks a lot.
at first i want to use that F-V converter only(LM2917) and i found
circuit in this german page.
http://www.digitaler-drehzahlmesser.de/ this is completely dedicated to
LED based tachometer which uses LM2907 with 8-pin.but the problem i
faced is with the F-V chip.in my area LM2907 with 14-pin are
available.no LM2917 and no LM2907 with 8-pin.so i stuck at this point.
and is it possible to see ur tachometer pics.
thanks for ur help once again
fever
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
sure i'll keep in mind abt grounding the other end of pickup coil.


wow thats a quite detail explanation.
thanks a lot.
at first i want to use that F-V converter only(LM2917) and i found
circuit in this german page.
http://www.digitaler-drehzahlmesser.de/ this is completely dedicated to
LED based tachometer which uses LM2907 with 8-pin.but the problem i
faced is with the F-V chip.in my area LM2907 with 14-pin are
available.no LM2917 and no LM2907 with 8-pin.so i stuck at this point.
and is it possible to see ur tachometer pics.
thanks for ur help once again
fever


Well I'm an American don't speak much but English and a smattering of
Spanish - enough to get me in trouble most days.

The LED digital tach in the German picture - is there a link to the
schematic? Sorry for my ignorance.

I have an absolutely - "damn wish I'd thought of it" schematic of a 64
LED display from a guy that makes use of a 8 bit A/D converter and
decodes the display into a 8X9 matrix using a few common CMOS parts.
That is 64 LED's with only three IC's ... minus the regulator, and
only 20 wires to the display board.

At the time I built mine. the LED's were costing 29 cents each and
using 20 to represent 80 was a cost consideration

I built my tach four years ago and it has been on the MC ever since.
I have a shematic that I put in my notebook and can scan and send and
it will give you an idea of what I did.

Should I send it to [email protected] ?

Take care
bob
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
I was looking at your web space - what does the alternator file
contain? I just rewound the rotor coil on my bike and wondered if
there was something I might use.

I'd rather replace the field coil with permanent magnets and then just
design a new regulator.

The program for the USR modem? what does it do?. I have a USR
external.

Thains
bob
 
F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
The LED digital tach in the German picture - is there a link to the
schematic? Sorry for my ignorance.

yes in download section u'll find the circuit details.if ur facing
problem with the langauge then use altavista's-bable fish translator to
read the site.this site contain 40,30,20 LED tachometer circuits with
PCB layout.

if possible do mail me the schematic of your tachometer.u said it uses
LM2917 is it 8-pin or 14-pin.
thanks
 
F

Fred Bloggs

Jan 1, 1970
0
fever said:
and someone told me not to connect other end of signal wire to ground.i
think i need to experement these 2(imean connecting to ground and
leaving the end)
**have u used 555 ic for ur tachometer?
what shld be rough dia of wire that shld be wound on ferrite core?

Right- the author of the Elektor article mentions "induction" and the
"high voltage" in the spark plug cable. He doesn't translate into
English very well because his sensor is capacitive and works on the
principle of rapid voltage collapse in the wire when the spark fires.
The 20 wraps of the sensing wire around the spark plug wire form a small
capacitance, and the rapid high voltage collapse in that wire couples
charge into the sensing wire and into the 555 circuit, triggering it.
There is no connection to GND. The sensor is just a single wire going
from the 555 circuit to the plug cable, wrapped about 20 times, and ends
there. This is better than an inductive type pickup using a core in some
ways because it is immune to stray magnetic fields.
You seem to be having a problem following directions. Elektor doesn't
publish circuits that have not been built and tested, which means it
will work as advertized if you follow the directions. But when you go
off on your own changing part numbers, component values, and sensing
methods, when you don't know what you're doing, you will end up with a
pile of malfunctioning crap.
 
F

fever

Jan 1, 1970
0
ways because it is immune to stray magnetic fields.
You seem to be having a problem following directions. Elektor doesn't
publish circuits that have not been built and tested, which means it
will work as advertized if you follow the directions. But when you go
off on your own changing part numbers, component values, and sensing
methods, when you don't know what you're doing, you will end up with a
pile of malfunctioning crap.

could be.
because the article is quite old.and its kinda hard to get the exact
components in the market.still iam trying my best to get them.(7555
insted of TLC555 as both r cmos versions)
and till now i experemented the signal wire by leaving the other
end,and was using less dia wire.this time i'll try different dia wires
with 7555 IC.
 
Top