Start again, this time with timetable and a measurable goal

[ChrisGreaves]

Hello; Again; when I introduced myself last December I was hoping for a complete system at $20. reality has sunk in, and now, of course, I wish I had bitten the bullet a year ago when prices had not made a hole in the roof.

I have set aside UP TO $1,000 for my first effort at a 12vDC-based system for my home.

(1) I am not going off-grid; I will always maintain my mains-Power supply (110vAC)

(2) I will not be self-sufficient in electrical energy. See point (1) above

(3) I WILL establish a platform, a starting-point, from which I can learn and develop skills.



The platform will start as:-

(a) a Vertical Spindle turbine capable of generating electrical energy at 12vDC

(b) a used 12vDC car battery supplied by my good neighbour who works in a car shop

(c) a 12vDC car jug capable of boiling a mug of water.


I will place an order for the turbine no later than this coming Saturday 22nd May, but perhaps as early as tomorrow.

Vertical spindle because I think a propeller/wind-vane is throwing away energy by turning the body into the wind, and by friction on the swivel plate. I don’t know how much energy is lost, but I think of it as “lost energy”.

Two models appear to be in stock at Amazon. “NINILADY” and “TQ 5000W”. Five months ago there seemed to be a dozen in stock.

They are priced at $729 and $490 respectively. I am inclined to go the $490 route (see “strategy” below)

Single 12vDC car battery in good condition (see “strategy” below) because my neighbour can obtain these for me at a low cost.

12vDC car jug to boil one mug of water for tea/coffee/oatmeal sachet, because I used one of these on my trips around North America.

Strategy: I will start with a single turbine, a single car battery, and a single application (boiling water for beverages). I drink four beverages per day – two coffees in the morning and two teas in the afternoon. The hot water jug will run from the battery. After two months running, I shall add a second application from my list of twenty-nine applications, perhaps “(3) Reading Lamp” or else “(4) Phone Charger”. When I need more storage I will purchase another car battery; when I need more power I will purchase another turbine. I plan to keep adding turbine power and battery storage as I add applications. By next winter I will have a 12v DC driveway cable snaking down my driveway melting the snow that falls in two- to three-foot deep slabs.

Right Now: I would appreciate any rational reasons why I should NOT go with a $490 vertical spindle turbine, a car battery, and a jug to boil water.

I have to get my hands dirty, in a manner of speaking, and sitting around theorizing is not going to help me resolve any issues.

Down the road I might purchase a bigger/better turbine; there is always a chance I can sell any earlier turbine to someone else who, like me, would like to dabble in 12vDC systems.

My overall goal here in Bonavista is educational: to create a demonstration home (mine!) with a glittering array of applications that will educate and I hope enthuse the locals.

Thanks

Chris Greaves

 

[Harald Kapp]

Vertical spindle because I think a propeller/wind-vane is throwing away energy by turning the body into the wind, and by friction on the swivel plate. I don’t know how much energy is lost, but I think of it as “lost energy”.

By design vertical wind turbines seem to be less efficient than standard wind turbines (see e.g. here).

Right Now: I would appreciate any rational reasons why I should NOT go with a $490 vertical spindle turbine, a car battery, and a jug to boil water.

Because 490 $ is a hefty prize tag?
Why not build your own wind turbine at a fraction of the cost? The turbines you linked to are 600W and 5000 W, respectively. These are oversized for the application. A car battery has on the order of 50 Wh (give or take depending on the model and the age). Assuming you can get power from the turbine only 20 % of the time (will depend on the typical wind characteristics in your area), a 600 W turbine will deliver an average of 150 W (with peaks and troughs). This will fully charge the battery in less than 1/2 hour (you'll have to take into account charge losses). What would you do with the power from the turbine once the battery is fully charged?

If I were to start this project, I'd begin with an inexpensive turbine, probably DIYed from a used car alternator. Once the project has shown its feasibility and more power is needed, I could always upgrade to a more powerful turbine (and battery).

 

[ChrisGreaves]

Harald, thank you for this informative and (wonderfully!) provocative reply. Provocative in the trues sense "pro" "vocal", or perhaps "positively presented"! This morning I ordered a horizontal axis wind turbine and once this reponse is submitted, i shall order a 12vDC electric mug.
I have begun a web page http://www.chrisgreaves.com//TheLandfallGardenHouse/12vdcProjects.htm with details, but here I will briefly respond to your most welcome comments.

By design vertical wind turbines seem to be less efficient than standard wind turbines (see e.g. here).

I had not thought this through. I reasoned that some wind energy is lost in turning a horizontal turbine to face the wind, an incessant bleeding away of energy. I had not considered what I now suspect is a much greater loss of energy in the wind blowing on the back-side of the vanes on a vertical spindle turbine. I have no measurements or data on which to base this, except that the vertical spindle loss occurs 100% of the time whereas the horizontal spindle loss occurs only when the wind shifts by perhaps five degrees. That is, the direction loss will never be 100% of the time, whereas the back-side loss occurs 100% guaranteed.
So I have ordered the Pikasola 12vDC for $cdn324 (includes tax and shipping, they say)

Why not build your own wind turbine at a fraction of the cost?

I did this in a half-hearted manner this past (six-month) winter, using three vanes made from two-litre pop bottles and a discarded electrical fan. I say half-hearted because (a) I was not going to spend time out of doors making adjustments and (b) my educational goal is to demonstrate what can be achieved with off-the-shelf components. I embrace Second Use For Everything and enjoy DIY, but most people in town are more interested in buying a kit and getting on with life.

If I were to start this project, I'd begin with an inexpensive turbine, probably DIYed from a used car alternator. Once the project has shown its feasibility and more power is needed, I could always upgrade to a more powerful turbine (and battery).

My wondeful neighbour works in a car repair facility and promises a supply of near-new car batteries (the car is totalled but the battery works) and last week showed me an alternator in his shed. I can see us getting together while he builds his own system for his cottage.
A significant factor here is that I believe in wind power as a practical source for SOME of my energy. I grew up in the Australian wheat belt where windmills pumped water into sheep troughs. I refuse to believe that in this wind-swept peninsula that juts into the North Atlantic Ocean I can't get enough energy for another cup of coffee.

Again, thank you for your comments and the links. I read that material and have made better decisions already. My path will not be error-free, but my path is wider due to you!
Cheers
Chris