square wave harmonic theory (time domain)

[Phil Allison]

"Don Blows it out his Arse Bowey"


( snip more ASD fucked drivel)


** Look - nothing left !!!


As always from the Bowey blow hard bullshit artist.




......... Phil

 

[Phil Allison]

"John Larkin ASD fucked Cretin "

The "domains" are just ways of looking at exactly the same thing, a
square wave. If you really have a square wave, the harmonics are
present all the time, no matter how you think about them.

** More brain dead BOLLOCKS !!

Classic, grossly autistic engineer think.

Larkin sure as hell is an autistic cretin .

Plus he has the pig arrogance that normally accompanies it.

Peeeukeeee ....



....... Phil

 

[Don Lancaster]

The bell isn't generating anything. It really is a filter and in fact
its output will only have harmonics of the rate it is struck at.

So, if you blow into an organ pipe, all you get is the air you put in?

The response of any dynamic system is the convolution of the driving
function and the natural function.

You have to consider both the transient and steady state responses.

--
Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: http://www.tinaja.com/whtnu.xml email: [email protected]

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com

 

[John Larkin]

"John Larkin ASD fucked Cretin "



** More brain dead BOLLOCKS !!

Classic, grossly autistic engineer think.

Larkin sure as hell is an autistic cretin .

Plus he has the pig arrogance that normally accompanies it.

Peeeukeeee ....



...... Phil

Are you suggesting that the harmonics are not present all the time? Or
do you, like DorkMatter, just switch over to dumb insults when you get
out of your technical depth?

John

 

[Phil Allison]

"John Larkin ASD fucked Cretin "

The "domains" are just ways of looking at exactly the same thing, a
square wave. If you really have a square wave, the harmonics are
present all the time, no matter how you think about them.

** More brain dead BOLLOCKS !!

Classic, grossly autistic engineer think.

Larkin sure as hell is an autistic cretin .

Plus he has the pig arrogance that normally accompanies it.

Peeeukeeee ....



....... Phil

 

[John Larkin]

"John Larkin ASD fucked Cretin "




** More brain dead BOLLOCKS !!

Classic, grossly autistic engineer think.

Larkin sure as hell is an autistic cretin .

Plus he has the pig arrogance that normally accompanies it.

Peeeukeeee ....



...... Phil

Isn't mindless repetition a symptom of autism?

John

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Isn't mindless repetition a symptom of autism?

John

He's trying to catch up with 'Jack'. Now, were is that lazy dog?


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

 

[joseph2k]

I was only kind of talking a theoretical ADC. Even though there are ADC's
up in the Giga samples per second, lets talk about a theoretical test with
an ADC that samples at 1Gsps with 24 bit resolution (kick-ass ADC). If I
took a 1 KHz square wave and triggered my ADC on the rising edge of the
pulse...delayed a bit waiting for the transistor to settle (say
200uS)...then took 65536 samples (65uS) of the steady state and did an FFT
on them...what would I see? In the time domain it would appear I was
sampling DC. If the FFT shows high frequencies relating to 1KHz where are
they coming from?

Thomas

This is not really the right place to dig into the mathematical artifacts of
DFT's and FFT's. That will be most of what you are seeing.

 

[John Larkin]

He's trying to catch up with 'Jack'. Now, were is that lazy dog?

They both bring new meaning to the phrase "don't know Jack."

Hey, that's his new handle: DontKnowJack. Followup to DorkMatter and
AlwaysWrong.


John

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

They both bring new meaning to the phrase "don't know Jack."

Hey, that's his new handle: DontKnowJack. Followup to DorkMatter and
AlwaysWrong.

John

I think I've already called him that, but you're right. He needs a
list so he doesn't reuse a handle. That would be really embarrassing,
wouldn't it? I wonder if he even remembers his real name?


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

 

[John Larkin]

I think I've already called him that, but you're right. He needs a
list so he doesn't reuse a handle. That would be really embarrassing,
wouldn't it? I wonder if he even remembers his real name?

He certainly doesn't have the balls to use it.

John

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

He certainly doesn't have the balls to use it.

He knows that he would wake up to a thousand villagers with torches
waiting at his door after his aberrant behavior over the years. It goes
with the yellow streak up his back. Do you think he has a concealed
carry permit for the feminine little pearl handled derringer in his
purse, and does it match his pierced earrings and necklace?


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

 

[Robert Latest]

If you have anything sensible to say, then say it. *IF*

This part of the thread showed up in a peculiar manner in my newsreader:
John Larkin apparently answering himself over and over again.

Of course that's because I don't see any Allison posts.

robert

 

[RRogers]

So now I'm really confused, are you saying that during certain times of a
square wave there is no harmonic content? Would that not imply that the high
frequency harmonics are stronger at certain instances of time compared to
others?

Thomas

Yes you might say that. In fact the xform from continuous data to
sampled data is a projection from a "vector space" (actually an
extension of one) of functions to a subspace. In your case a finite
dimensional subspace (you took a finite number of readings).
In any case you can exactly analyze your experiment by replacing the
edges by dirac delta functions of a +1 order and manipulating them;
then you apply your sampling function to the result to see what the
result is. You can also experiment with truncating the waveform or
changing the sampling times. There should be formal method of doing
this but I have only seen (and been able to use) block diagrams of the
signal flow that are then converted to equations.
My point is that you don't have to imagine a lot or take other
people's opinion; you can do your own analysis. It's good for your
abilities and while it takes some thought and study, the result is
quite useful.

RayRogers

 

[MooseFET]

So, if you blow into an organ pipe, all you get is the air you put in?

No, the Organ pipe is a nonlinear system. The fipple is a gain
element connected to the tuned system. The bell is a linear system
for the sizes of inputs we are considering.

The response of any dynamic system is the convolution of the driving
function and the natural function.

Agreed, if the system is linear. In the case of striking the bell at
a constant rate the frequency content of the input consists only of
harmonics of the rate of striking. Since the bell can't create new
frequencies, its output must also only contain those frequencies.

You have to consider both the transient and steady state responses.

I did.

 

[John Larkin]

This part of the thread showed up in a peculiar manner in my newsreader:
John Larkin apparently answering himself over and over again.

Of course that's because I don't see any Allison posts.

robert

I find it easier to just ignore fatheads that I know are fatheads,
rather than killfiling them; Eeyore and Sloman come to mind.
DampMatter keeps changing names, so I have to catch onto that (it
takes a post or two) and you have to update your kill list.

John

 

[Don Lancaster]

Yes you might say that. In fact the xform from continuous data to
sampled data is a projection from a "vector space" (actually an
extension of one) of functions to a subspace. In your case a finite
dimensional subspace (you took a finite number of readings).
In any case you can exactly analyze your experiment by replacing the
edges by dirac delta functions of a +1 order and manipulating them;
then you apply your sampling function to the result to see what the
result is. You can also experiment with truncating the waveform or
changing the sampling times. There should be formal method of doing
this but I have only seen (and been able to use) block diagrams of the
signal flow that are then converted to equations.
My point is that you don't have to imagine a lot or take other
people's opinion; you can do your own analysis. It's good for your
abilities and while it takes some thought and study, the result is
quite useful.

RayRogers

We have found that the plain old conventional Fourier analysis is more
than fast enough with modern computers for many uses.

And that it eliminates all of the FFT happy horseshit over windowing,
aliasing, Hanning, and general lying about what you think you are
looking at.

http://www.tinaja.com/magsn01.asp



--
Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: http://www.tinaja.com/whtnu.xml email: [email protected]

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com

 

[Don Lancaster]

No, the Organ pipe is a nonlinear system. The fipple is a gain
element connected to the tuned system. The bell is a linear system
for the sizes of inputs we are considering.

Not even wrong.

A resonant system is a resonant system.

Response depends on both the forcing function (transient) and the
natural function (steady state).


--
Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: http://www.tinaja.com/whtnu.xml email: [email protected]

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com

 

[John Larkin]

We have found that the plain old conventional Fourier analysis is more
than fast enough with modern computers for many uses.

And that it eliminates all of the FFT happy horseshit over windowing,
aliasing, Hanning, and general lying about what you think you are
looking at.

How do you avoid windowing artifacts, or aliasing, simply by using a
classic Fourier transform? They are inherent in taking a finite time
slice out of an infinite waveform, and sampling at a finite rate, not
in the details of the transform.

An FFT does the same math as a discrete Fourier transform; it just
reorganizes it to avoid a lot of inefficiency.

John

 

[Don Lancaster]

How do you avoid windowing artifacts, or aliasing, simply by using a
classic Fourier transform? They are inherent in taking a finite time
slice out of an infinite waveform, and sampling at a finite rate, not
in the details of the transform.

An FFT does the same math as a discrete Fourier transform; it just
reorganizes it to avoid a lot of inefficiency.

John

You use the plain old sines and cosines.
Works like a champ.

--
Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: http://www.tinaja.com/whtnu.xml email: [email protected]

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at http://www.tinaja.com