Discussion in 'Electronic Basics' started by Redink, Jul 31, 2005.

1. ### RedinkGuest

the thing i want to do is a Shock Pen if you don't know what a shock

(If you don't want to read all this just scroll down and see the lsat

[Shock Pen]
http://www.thegag.com/aj-0001.html

or just simple type "Shock pen" in google and you will find enough

now the thing is the place where i like which is India we don't get
stuff like that.
so i decided to make one my self.

things i got hold of
so far a Pen that can fit a AAA battery
1 AAA battery
some wires
soildering machine
Capacitors (1000uf 50v electrolytic capacitors)

thing i think i need is all the above and
1) Electric Coil

now by my research on these pens i found out that they give around 30v
- 60v of
electric current to the user. and uses small electric coil
and one person that is helping me says it uses "vibrating reed on a
coil to interrupt the circuit and generate high voltage spikes."

but what i don't know is what is a coil?, can i make one my self?, can

now since i have a (or 4 to be exact) capacitors of 50v and 2 AA
Batteries
what i was thinking is

How do i charge the capacitor?
i hooked the capacitors to the battery via matching the polarities but
how do i know it is chargeing or not??

all i want to create is some kind of a shocking device that will give
a noticable shock since this is my science project and would get a A++
if i am
successful in it i konw that for sure.

the questions i like help on is as follows

1) How do i charge a capacitor of 50v via 2 AA Battery?

2) How to discharge them via a LED Blub so i know it was charged?

3) How do i make a Shocking Device like the Shock Pen?

4) What things i would need to make such a device?

Please do try to help me thx.

2. ### Tom BiasiGuest

If you really want to shock someone, spend some time studying the basic
concepts of electricity.
This will probably shock your parents.

3. ### Guest

find an electronic cigarette lighter.... and dismantle it then
reinstall the parts in an ink pen...use some of that indian ingenuity
to fiqure how to make it switchable so you can shock people with it.
Flash cameras and grill lighters also contain usabale parts to
construct the pen... easier than trying to construct your own miniature
induction coil that will fit inside of an ink pen......

4. ### Si BallengerGuest

A disposable flash camera has all the fixings for a good shock.
Might even have enough punch to stop your heart.

5. ### RedinkGuest

"Tom Biasi"
Thx for the tip i just might do it (Just!!) and this already shock my
parents so i don't belive i want to give them another shock that i

""
thx m8 but i don't own a electronic cigarette and even if i manage to
get it which is not that hard it would be 1) Costly 2) it could actully
give a spark which will light stuff up or give a bad scar to the person
rather then just a shock
but will look into it.

"Si Ballenger"
i don't know where to get a disposable flash camera if it even is sold
and even if it is sold it would be costly and on the topic of
stoping my heart well i have come close to it quite often then one
might thing and don't plan to do it on perpose and i don't have any
heart problems so it's not quite likely to stop my heart that easy

and thx you all for replying the thing is and i am quite sure you
people can help me in it is that
i have a 50v capacitor and have created a series out of 2 AA battery
and should get a 3v around from them since i can light a 3v LED light
what i intent to do is to charge the capacitor and then with the
capacitor light the LED light if that i can do then i think i can
create a shock device.

so now my question should be
1) How do i charge the capacitor with the 2 AA battery? (i mean how do
i hook them up)

2) if possible can you tell me how to create a shock device from the
stuff i currently have please? since i don't like to spend more on this
project then i have to and would like the price of it to be as low as
possible.

6. ### Guest

I don't think you could possibly make a shocking pen out of the
materials you have. Just because the capacitor says it's 50 volts
doesn't mean it will automatically charge up to that amount, a
capacitor will only charge to the voltage you give it. each AA battrey
will supply 1.5 volts, so if you connected them in series (the bump on
one battery touching the flat end of the other) you will have a total
of three volts. if you wanted to chagre the capacitors with the two
batteries you would hvae to connect the two batteries in series and
then the lead with a white line next to it on the capacitor to the flat
end that has nothing else touching it and the other end to the bump
that has nothing else touching it. the only way i know of to tell if
the the capacitor is chargeing with an LED would be to add it in
series. Connect the shorter lead of the LED to the flat end of the
batteryand the longer lead to the side of the capacitor with the white
line. when the whole circuit is connected the Led should quickly
brighten, once the LED reaches full brightness, you know the capacitor
is charged. check this site out for some information on capacitors.

http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/capacitor1.htm

7. ### RedinkGuest

Thx alot
seriously thx for the info i will be trying it out tonight.
then can you please tell me what things i need to build my own shocking
device
i am very much into the project and would like to build one my self so
if possible
do tell me what things i would need to do it.

thx you very much

8. ### Guest

i'm sorry, i don't exactly know how these things work, but as people
mentioned a lighter would work, they have small white squares called
peziolectric devices that produce a 15+kv pulse, it won't burn people
or seriously hurt them, as werid as it sounds i sometimes shock my
thumb with them when i'm bored, there shock is that minor. you can buy
a lighter from this site

http://vistawholesale.zoovy.com/product/DELUXESHOCKPEN

i'm not sure if these guysship internationally but i have bought
products from them and they are very reliable sellers. you could buy a
pen, take it a part and then reasemble it or something like that.

9. ### RedinkGuest

thx m8 i am currently online if you want to talk or not your choice
but in any case thx alot you have been alot of help

10. ### RedinkGuest

in doing some of my research i found certain things that if right i can
make this shocking device rather easy

question
1) What is a coil? is it a normal coper wired just rounded up? is it a
wired rounded up?

please tell me what is a coil exactly and i bet i can create a shocking
device and once i create it i will post the tutorial of doing such a
thing so others can learn from it.

thx you all for your posts.

11. ### John FieldsGuest

---
Recent studies done on victims of self-inflicted 'peziolectric'
shocks have indicated that, along with the momentary diversion
created by the shock, one of the unfortunate side effects is a
progressive loss of mental acuity. This loss of acuity leads to
feelings of ennui which only another 'peziolectric' shock will
alleviate, albeit only temporarily. Unfortunately, the disease is
progressively degenerative and, in its later stages, results in the
victim becoming a "clicker", perpetually pressing and releasing the
trigger on a specially wired, gas-depleted barbecue lighter for
their "hit".

Some victims have reportedly, over time, become so blasé that
they've progressed to "hitting the mains", but not much is known
about that condition since they're usually found close to an
electrical outlet, babbling incoherently, with a bobbypin in each
hand.

12. ### LumpyGuest

I'd like to hear from the OP, why is
it that you want to build a device
that inflicts pain, however small,
on someone else?

You're obviously not quite sure what
you're doing. What if you err and produce
something that will seriously injure or
kill someone? What if you build just a
mild 'tickler' but tickle the wrong
person and he decides to break your face?

Geez...Whatever happened to cat whisker receivers
and hot dog resistance cookers.

Lumpy

13. ### Si BallengerGuest

The simplest shock setup I used as a kid is a simple transformer
and some batterys. Get a transformer out of an old AC powered
radio. doorbell transformer, or something similar. If you hold
onto the high voltage wires that would have gone to the wall and
then start taping the low voltage wires that went to the radio
across the batterys, a spark/shock should be generated on the
high voltage side. A 120v/6v transformer use to make a little
shock/spark for those kid purposes. You probably can charge up an
old capacitor out of a car ignition with this to the point if you
touch it you will have something to remember.

14. ### Guest

Ha, very funny. I'll make sure to not become an obsesive clicker, and
trust me, i'm not going to be sticking a bobby pin in any wall outlets
any time soon.

15. ### RedinkGuest

"John Fields"
John it seems that you have extensive knowledge in this clicking
business or have extensive experience in it thx for the heads up but i
do like when i get a small shock trust me my pc is not totaly earthed
and hence touching the back will get me a good shock, beside do you
know what happens to your hand when you touch a good amount of voltage
that comes out of your VCD Player ? the player i have in wiredly wired
so even if it's of it has enough capacitors to give me a shock
continusly for around 1 min and i plug it in and then touch it i have
extensive knowledge on what will happen if i touch a VCD Player like
that for nearly 30mins i tried alot of stuff and have good amount of
knowledge that the CIA and KGB might want their hands on

"Lumpy"
Well m8 i am trying to do this as a project for a science thing not for
shocking people
but i will shock few friends with it once i have shocked my self more
then 20 times with it and stated that it does not do any damage.

"Si Ballenger"
thx for the info m8 but that's not simple i know more simple stuff to
shock me lol what i am looking for is a shock thing that can work out
of 2 AA Battery or 1 AAA Battery and is relatively small or campact.
but thx for the info none the less

""
you are sure to not become an obsesive clicker but a clicker none the
less don't worry your not the only one out their

thx for all your info people i think i am more closer to what i want to
achive then ever and once i do i will post a tutorial and ofcource give
credit to people that help me so do look for it but till then do tell
me how to do stuff

thx once again

I have what looks like a cig lighter that uses back EMF from a coil. It
takes a few times to get the message to the brain that you are being
shocked, but eventually you get it. You end up pressing harder and I guess
holding the button down longer each time until you realize there is
something wrong with it or it's not a lighter.

So what kind of turns ratio in the X-former to get the back EMF potential
would you need to feel the shock from a 1.5 volt batt? What potential would
you need to feel shocked from such a device?

On the funny bone: My girlfreind got big time mad at me when she forgot
about my shock pen two weekends ago. I told her the weight should have been
a clue. She was not happy! I was in tears trying not to let her hear me
laugh out loud. You know those violent shakes you get from holding laughter
in? That'll teach to take all the pens out of my desk and not return them!

17. ### Dr Engelbert BuxbaumGuest

Redink wrote:

That sounds like Wagners hammer, a double pole relay wired to interrupt
its own power supply:

o- NO
/ NC
+Ub o--------o o-----------o High voltage out
|
||(
||(
||(
||(
|
-Ub o-----------------------o Gnd

As the relay energizes, the switch goes from normally closed (NC) to
normally open (NO), interrupting the power supply to the relay. So the
relay falls of, and the switch goes back to the NC position. This is
repeated with a frequency determined by the mechanics of the relay. As a
result you get an alternating voltage across the relay coil, and since
the magnetic enery stored in the coil gets converted into an electrical
impuls when the current is suddenly interrupted, that AC has a
significant voltage. I once looked at the pulses generated with an
oszilloscope and the spikes were quite impressive.

This method of high-voltage generation has three main drawbacks:
a) The current drawn by the relay will empty the battery quickly.
b) The relay will not make it for very long.
c) The very steep impulses generated have high harmonics, which
interfere with radio reception. Hence authorities tend to take a dim
view of such contraptions.

18. ### Lord GarthGuest

Why don't you use the piezo striker from a barbecue grill? You'll be
one hell of a zap, I promise!

19. ### RedinkGuest

thx for the info m8 will look into that coil
"You know those violent shakes you get from holding laughter in?"
yup been there

"Dr Engelbert Buxbaum"
only 1 thing for your m8
I AM NOT AN EXPERT AT THIS SHOCKING THING I DID NOT GET ONE THING THAT
YOU SAID EXCEPT
blah blah coil blah blah, blah blah blah blah. high-voltage blah blah
blah.
and i am not jokeing i actually read blah where i did not get you
but thx for the information blah i know what you said made more sence
then this post but lets just say i am not supposed to know some stuff
and your post comes in that stuff but thx m8

"Lord Garth"
i can't try your suggestion because i don't have a barbecue grill
but you can try it one more time for me would liked to get that hell
of a zap but i guess it has to wait

20. ### Rich GriseGuest

He's talking about one of these things:
http://www.hometownhearthandgrill.com/cgi-bin/gc2.storefront/EN/product/58420

Run all of the butane out, and peel back enough of the shroud to expose
the electrodes.

Voila! Zapper!

Have Fun!
Rich