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Re: Audio Precision System One Dual Domani Measuirement Systems

Discussion in 'Electronic Repair' started by Phil Allison, Dec 30, 2011.

  1. Terry Casey

    Terry Casey Guest

    All hypothetical. As David said earlier, it is a myth that transmission
    was cut in the middle of the cartoon. Station logs exist that say

    Another myth is that the Television Service resumed in 1946 with the
    same cartoon. It didn't!

    The cartoon WAS repeated that day - but it wasn't the first programme.
  2. That's what we'd call a trailing socket. To be used with an extension
    lead. I thought you meant permanently installed sockets. But perhaps you
    can't tell the difference.

    It look like it would also accept other than the UK 13 amp plug - which is
    why some tourists might buy it. It doesn't conform to UK regs.
  3. Ian Jackson

    Ian Jackson Guest

    Same lot, in the land of the concrete cows and a thousand roundabouts.
    Ah yes. That's certainly one of the reasons for using a weird reference
    frequency. I recall that certain systems insisted that the four set-top
    bypass channels had to be close to the standard off-air broadcast
    channels, because some TV sets would not tune to anything but these.
    Almost certainly this is what I was involved in.

    But wasn't it at the same place which ingeniously used a not-quite-8MHz
    comb reference which was actually derived from one of the UHF off-air
    channels? As the headend equipment was largely supplied by the 'other'
    company, I doubt if I would have been involved with tinkering with it
    (although I'm pretty sure that I did swap one or two of the modulator
    SAW filters because of the problems which arose when NICAM started).
    Maybe 'my' comb generator was a replacement.
  4. Ian Jackson

    Ian Jackson Guest

    I'm sure that that the point being made was that despite all that had
    happened to Britain since 1939, we were now picking up the pieces,
    continuing where we had left off, and getting back to business as usual.
    Even if it didn't quite happen as reported, there is no doubt that the
    popular version of the story would have been good for moral.
  5. Terry Casey

    Terry Casey Guest

    They would have to be very unusual TV sets!

    It was more likely to be, in the case of Westminster, that, when CATV
    systems rarely went above 600MHz, there was nowhere else to put them,
    coupled with the fact that the off-air channels were left clear, so it
    was convenient utilise to this for the n + 2 arrangement by straddling
    the otherwise blank off-air allocation.

    A comb of 7.988636364MHz would allow E25, E27, E29 and E31 to be used
    with +/-34kHz error (off-airs being 23, 26, 30 & 33)

    Of course, this was all long before the Channel 5 debacle - I can't see
    a way of interleaving 5 channels around Crystal Palace without involving
    the allegedly taboo n + 5 scenario - although I've never seen a problem
    with any set I used directly connected to a CATV network
    Well, dividing E26 by 64 or E30 by 68 would do the trick. I based my
    comb frequency on E28, being the centre channel but an off-air lock
    would certainly produce a very stable result, and the offsets would
    still be reasonable - +58/-11kHz or +11/-58kHz, depending on choice of
    off air channel.
    My involvement with the Westminster system was at the time of the DTV
    roll-out (or possibly Broadband Internet, I can't remember which) which
    coincided with the transfer of the system from BT to ntl, so I never saw
    the BT headend but I did see the documentation related to it, complete
    with frequency details.
  6. Ian Jackson

    Ian Jackson Guest

    I don't know about 'unusual', but they were a problem. I think there
    were only couple of budget brands which only tuned 'spot-on' to the UHF
    channels (xxx.25MHz, in 8MHz steps). One might ask indeed "Why would you
    need them to do otherwise?" Of course, even our cable set-top boxes
    could normally only tune in 125kHz steps, but at least that got you to
    within +/-63kHz of the correct frequency - and that was more than close
    Sets generally seemed to improve a lot in later years. I think that the
    change of IF from 39.5MHz to the European 38.9MHz made quite a
    difference to N+/- problems. What surprises me is how well some sets
    could tolerate having direct inputs of 48+ channels (without them going
    through the converter UHF bypass filtering). Certainly, in the olden
    days, when faced with more than half a dozen channels, some sets tended
    to sag a bit at the knees.

    But, as you have said, there used to be so many embargoed channels on a
    cable TV system - no adjacent, no N+/-5, no N+/-9, no sums or
    differences (with single-ended amplifiers) etc. It's a wonder anyone was
    able to get more than two or three channels!
    If this is what they did, they could have used either of those channels
    from Crystal Palace. Next time I see him, I'll ask the man who will
    almost certainly know (if I remember!).
    I had little to do with the system in London (I think I only went there
    once - underground, near Shepherds Bush IIRC). As I said, my involvement
    was among the concrete cows and the roundabouts.
  7. Terry Casey

    Terry Casey Guest

  8. In message <>,
    And there was a film - 1970s I think - very loosely based on it. If I
    saw it now, I'd probably cringe at all sorts of errors in it, but I
    remember enjoying it _as a film_, then. I think it might have been
    "Operation Crossbow" - CBA to check.
  9. Terry Casey

    Terry Casey Guest

    1965, I think you'll find. The rocket in the film was supposed to be a
    successor to the V2 and I'm sure that it is referred to as the V3 in the
    film although, as I later found out, the V3 was a multi-barrelled high
    velocity cannon, the site of which I've since visited.
  10. Ian Jackson

    Ian Jackson Guest

    The word, of course, should have been 'morale'. I'm sure that, even
    during the war, British morals remained impeccable!

    TV broadcasting didn't resume until 1946 - a year after VE Day.

    After the war, it took a long time for life in Britain to get back
    normal. We were constantly being reminded of austerity and deprivation.
    For example, lots of things were rationed, and de-rationing didn't begin
    until 1948. I believe that certain things which has escaped rationing
    during the war were actually rationed after it ended. I remember sweets
    coming 'off the ration' in 1953. Meat was the last, in 1954. In 1951, we
    had the Festival of Britain, which was intended to boost both morale and
    the economy, and a lavish coronation in 1953.

    I expect that the resumption of the TV service with a Mickey Mouse
    cartoon also helped to cheer us up - even though, at the time, it would
    only be seen by a handful of people in the London area. It could be that
    the urban legend which followed was actually more effective than the
    broadcast itself.
  11. "Morality" refers to correct behavior -- not just sexual behavior.
  12. J G Miller

    J G Miller Guest

    Actually, and not surprisingly, you will find that morals in the
    UKofGB&NI deteroriated badly during the war.

    In Ipswich in 1943, an increasing number of complaints were received
    about air raid shelters being used for “immoral purposes".
  13. Don Pearce

    Don Pearce Guest

    I don't suppose they were any good for much else. And since when was
    sex immoral?

  14. David Looser

    David Looser Guest

    Indeed, I was going to ask J G Miller what he meant by "morals". Its
    certainly the case that both World Wars created significant social change
    including liberating women from many of the social restrictions that they
    had previously suffered from. If J G Miller thinks that giving women more
    independence equates to "morals deteriorating badly" then maybe he has a

  15. Ian Jackson

    Ian Jackson Guest

    And, where still accessible, they probably also continued to be used for
    immoral purposes for a long time after the war. And pillboxes.
  16. Terry Casey

    Terry Casey Guest

    Perhaps Ian forgot the smiley when he wrote that? ;-)
  17. J G Miller

    J G Miller Guest

    Indeed so, and there was a marked increase in behavior which was not
    correct during WW2, eg the black market.
  18. J G Miller

    J G Miller Guest

    Have you stopped beating your wife?

    Your attempt at linking two totally unrelated issues is nothing
    less than disingenuous and ill-considered.
  19. J G Miller

    J G Miller Guest

    Or maybe he was confusing morals and morale?
  20. David Looser

    David Looser Guest

    There are *far* from being unrelated! A sexual act takes two, and usually
    one is a woman. The social effect of WW2 gave women the freedom to engage in
    such sexual behaviour as well as many other freedoms.

    It is your attempt to deny the link that is "disingenuous and

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