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Raising and Lowering Security Cameras

Discussion in 'Security Alarms' started by [email protected], May 18, 2007.

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  1. Guest

    I was told that there was a device that will raise and lower a
    security camera. I guess it would be some thing similar to a flag
    pole. I have an issue where I need to have a PTZ camera mounted 20
    feet up a pole. My contractor has aimed towards health and safety
    rules where they will not climb a ladder above 10 feet high. If you
    can find a 6' 6" technician then he may be able to reach as high as 17
    feet. If any higher I need to pay for a lifting device such as a
    scissor lift or a boom lift. I was told that there is a pole that you
    can mount a camera on and raise and lower the camera. I have searched
    for such a device and have had no results. Anyone ever heard of such a
    thing?
     
  2. Grahammey

    Grahammey Guest

    yes
     
  3. Petem

    Petem Guest

    this will cost him more then the renting for a day of a scissor lift...

    the OP should stop being a cheap AH and start looking at the fact that if he
    want a camera at 20 feet high he need to pay for the tools needed to do it..


    But one more question here..how come the contractor didn't plan this when he
    first sold the camera to the OP

    when we sell camera we always put in our quote the price of renting a
    scissor lift or any other device that will be needed to install the
    cameras...The OP must be dealing with a very low grade contractor...that's
    the pleasure of always taking the lowest bid....
     
  4. It's interesting that the contractor has apparently
    cited OSHA (inferred from the OP's initial post).
    I may be wrong but TTBOMK there is no 10 foot
    restriction from OSHA. There could be a stricter
    local or state regulation but I doubt it.

    Following is a link to the OSHA general ladder
    regulation. There are numerous application
    specific regulations though so this isn't all
    encompassing.

    http://www.osha.gov/Publications/osha3124.pdf

    The following is quoted from an online store,
    Industrial & Safety Supplies at:
    http://www.labsafety.com/refinfo/ezfacts/ezf132.htm


    OSHA Regulatory Requirements
    OSHA has separate regulations for portable wood ladders and portable metal ladders.

    Portable Wood Ladders
    29 CFR 1910.25 addresses wood ladders, and is divided into application, materials, construction requirements, and ladder care and
    usage. This regulation applies to common wood ladders and not to specialty ladders such as shelf ladders, extension ladders, fruit
    picker's ladders, stepladders or library ladders.

    Wood ladders should be constructed of a high-density wood that is free of sharp edges and splinters. Visual inspection should reveal
    no decay, irregularities including shake, wane and compression failures, or other weaknesses. Construction requirements include
    ladder length restrictions (see Table #1) and step spacing. Uniform step spacing must not exceed 12".

    Table #1

    Ladder Type Maximum Length Special Requirements
    Industrial Stepladders 3'-20' Wider than 11½". Must have locking device to hold ladder sections open.
    Commercial Stepladder 3'-12' Same as above.
    Household Stepladder 3'-6' Same as above.
    Rung Ladder 30' None.
    Two-Section Rung Ladder 60' Ladder rails must fit into each other. Upper section can be raised/lowered.
    Trestle Ladder 20' None.
    Painter's Ladder 12' None.
    Mason's Ladder 40' None.
    Side-Rolling Ladder 20' None.



    While scissor lifts have their advantages, they are
    not required for this job.
    He can rent what he needs and install it himself
    for less than what the dealer wants.
    Security salesmen rarely have technical skills.
    The rep might not have realized his company
    doesn't want to go more than 10 feet up a ladder.
    They also might have an agreement with their
    insurer limiting the height to which employees
    will ascend.
    Mistakes happen. The gentleman can choose
    to pay for a lowering system but it will still need
    to be installed atop the pole so there's no real
    savings. He can pay for the installer's lift rental
    or cancel and seek another supplier -- perhaps
    one that owns a lift.

    BTW, I find it interesting that you refer to the
    company as "low grade" yet you also have to
    rent a lift you install. How does not owning a
    lift make them lower grade than your firm which
    apparently also doesn't own a lift?

    FWIW, I don't equate alarm company quality
    with lift possession. Larger firms that frequently
    do that sort of job will find it more economical to
    own a lift. Others won't. My church in CT had
    high ceilings with commercial stage lighting that
    frequently needed to be changed around. We
    found it more economical to buy a scissor lift
    than to keep renting. That didn't mean we were
    high or low budget. It meant we owned a lift.
    Period. :^)

    --

    Regards,
    Robert L Bass

    =============================>
    Bass Home Electronics
    941-925-8650
    4883 Fallcrest Circle
    Sarasota · Florida · 34233
    http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
    =============================>
     
  5. Bob La Londe

    Bob La Londe Guest

    Geez. I've got a heavy double sided step ladder that is 16 feet tall. Rock
    solid too and you can work on both sides. That makes a 20' mount just above
    eyeball level. Depending on the pole type I've also got a 36' extension
    ladder, but I will only use it at max extension if I can park my truck to
    brace the feet.

    And, of course worse comes to worse, go rent a freaking lift you cheap
    bastidge.

    --
    Sincerly,
    The guy who makes the final decision on who we buy from.
    Bob La Londe

    The Security Consultant
    Bob La Londe - Owner
    P.O. Box 5720
    Yuma, Az 85366

    (928) 782-9765 ofc
    (928) 782-7873 fax

    Licensed Contractor
    ROC103044 & ROC103047
     
  6. Tommy

    Tommy Guest


    I think it has to do with tying off. I know that in the industrial regs
    you have to tie off above 4 feet. I am not sure about construction, but i
    think that id where the 10 foot rule is.
    Sounds like the contractor dosen't want to buy hs workers any safety
    equipment.

    OT- why 4 feet? you have to climb higher than that to tie off a 6 foot
    lead and then if you do fall you still hit the ground because of the
    "soft break" feature in most tie off lanyards today.

    "never uderestimate the stupidity of bearocracies in large numbers"
     
  7. Guest

    Thank you very much for your link. I will look into pricing for this
    camera lowering system, it seems like it is what I am looking for.
     
  8. Guest



    Man, you do get slammed in these groups. I'm not a cheap bastidge and
    actually my contractor is not low grade. "Robert L Bass", I thank you
    for the time and effort you put into your response and the links you
    gave me to OSHA, but I am tied to union rules as well as health and
    safety regulations. I know that a 16 foot ladder would get me eyeball
    height with the camera and to be honest with you I would climb up and
    do it myself, but grievances will fly beyond belief. Unfortunately,
    due to the union rules, I can not use any tools, which is frustrating
    since I used to do this type of work in my former job. I guess those
    are the breaks when you "go up the ladder" in your career.

    The application for this camera is unique to me, I have a camera
    mounted up the pole in the center of a large open outside area. You
    wouldn't believe how much it cost me to get conduit run underground to
    this pole, we ran into many obstacles while boring so had to trench a
    lot of the way, which cost more since we needed to replace the
    asphalt. Anyway, I am installing a thermal PTZ camera, with video
    analytics. I am expecting to need to get to this camera fairly often
    since I am testing this technology out. Therefore, renting a lift once
    more to install this camera lowering system, will hopefully save me
    money for future service and experimental work. The camera I have
    priced out will cost me just over $100,000.00 and the video analytics
    console will cost me around $13,000.00. By the time I am done with
    this installation I will have about $150,000.00 plus into it. Then I
    can start playing around with the analytics. So, "BOB LaLONDE" I guess
    if you want to call me a cheap bastidge I guess that your prerogative,
    I guess I won't be needing your consulting services at any time.

    As you can probably tell I am a newcomer to this group and it's been
    good reading your posts. I thank you for your help, hopefully I will
    be able to help you in the future. I will check out the camera
    lowering system that "Michael" sent me. If any of you have any more
    systems for me to look at I would appreciate the links as well.
     
  9. Bob La Londe

    Bob La Londe Guest

    Why thank you for being so informative in your original post. As is
    often the case with this type of query you uttterly failed to describe
    the scope of the problem. You made it sound like you were just
    complaining that your contractor wouldn't climb a ladder. You totally
    failed to mention the fact that you NEEDED to raise and lower the
    camera repeatedly. You made it sound like the contractor simpley
    would not climb a ladder. Now had you not failed to provide that
    information your responses might have been a little different.

    Compare.... "My contractor won't climb a ladder so I need a device to
    raise and lower the camera."

    Whiney and incomplete.


    VS... "I need to raise and lwoer a camera because we need to service
    it for XXX reason regularly."

    Complete and concise and defines the actual problem.


    Given your application and the amount of money you are spending you
    might even consider buying a lift. I've got tons of commerical, R&D,
    and industrial clients who own their own lifts. If you owned a lift
    it would solve future problems as well.

    To be quite frank your limited definition of scope is very common,
    although its usually by clients who are trying to cheap out. That's
    right. Cheap bastidges. Guys who don't tell you everything you need
    to know, and then expect you to just throw it in at the same price.
    I'ld sure like to hear your contractor's opinion of this job and you
    as a client. LOL. Its right up there with guys who interrupt every
    suggestion or statement of fact about how a job could or should be
    done with sentences that start with the words, "just" and "only."
    Heck, I'm curious why your contractor hasn't researched this product
    so they can sell it to you.

    --
    Sincerly,
    The guy who makes the final decision on who we buy from, **and who we
    will or won't work for.**
    Bob La Londe

    The Security Consultant
    Bob La Londe - Owner
    P.O. Box 5720
    Yuma, Az 85366

    (928) 782-9765 ofc
    (928) 782-7873 fax

    Licensed Contractor
    ROC103044 & ROC103047
     
  10. Man, you do get slammed in these groups.
    Don't sweat it. Unprovoked attacks are the
    Usenet equivalent of road rage.
    You're most welcome.
    It's a shame that something so useful and
    necessary as unions can become an albatross
    around your neck.
    I've been fortunate enough not to have to deal
    with unions more than a couple of times in my
    work life. I worked for Union Carbide many years
    ago. I ran a centerless grinder and a milling
    machine. Once when I was behind quota I tried
    to skip my break to catch up. The shop steward
    came over and gave me hell for it. :^)
    Have you considered using a pivoting pole?
    The camera is mounted to the pole while it lies
    on its side. When ready the pole swings up and
    is pinned in position. I don't know who makes
    them but I've seen these poles used before.
    Heh. So much for the "cheap" insult thrown your
    way.
    Knowiung Bob, he was probably kidding. He's one
    of the better participants here.
    Thanks. Some of us try to be helpful... :^)

    --

    Regards,
    Robert L Bass

    =============================>
    Bass Home Electronics
    941-925-8650
    4883 Fallcrest Circle
    Sarasota · Florida · 34233
    http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
    =============================>
     
  11. There's one other option which you might ask the
    installer to consider -- a telescoping pole mount.
    Here's a link to a PDF page illustraating one
    example:

    http://www.altron.co.uk/PDF/aw1697_and_acc_telescopic_column_v22.pdf

    The poles come in varying heights. They use a
    winch to raise or lower the pole with the camera
    in place. I haven't examined this particular line
    so I can't speak for its quality but the concenpt
    is not unique. There are other companies with
    similar products intended for both CCTV and
    lighting systems.

    --

    Regards,
    Robert L Bass

    =============================>
    Bass Home Electronics
    941-925-8650
    4883 Fallcrest Circle
    Sarasota · Florida · 34233
    http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
    =============================>
     
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