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problem with video to film recording

7

7

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hello all:

I´m working with video in Spain and I´m trying to discover which is the
problem with a video to film recording system that we have.

We send the images from a computer to the recorder and when we develop the
film the images are perfect if we see one by one, but they are moved one of
them respect the other. I mean, there are two positions for the images. The
moves is, in appearance, random. Some people has told me that maybe it´s a
frequency problem because the system comes from Usa but nobody really it´s
sure.

The system is very simple: one computer to send the images to the recorder
via GPIB cable.

I have no found any person here that may help me. I hope somebody here may
do it.

Thanks in advance.

Fernando Sánchez
 
7

7

Jan 1, 1970
0
May I solve the problem with a frequency 50 to 60hz converter?
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
I´m sending .tif file format so I don´t think here is the problem.

The monitor that expose the images to the film camera is a CRT that makes
three passes, for red, green and blue. He don´t show the image enterely, it
makes a raster for each color.
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
I´m sending .tif file format so I don´t think here is the problem.

The monitor that expose the images to the film camera is a CRT that makes
three passes, for red, green and blue. He don´t show the image enterely, it
makes a raster for each color.
 
D

DarkMatter

Jan 1, 1970
0
May I solve the problem with a frequency 50 to 60hz converter?

It has nothing to do with the power line or power line frequency.

PAL video is 50Hz refresh, or 25 Frames Per Second.

NTSC video is 60Hz refresh or 30 Frames Per Second.

Though they coincide with the power line frequencies used, the two
are not really related.

What you need to "convert" is the actual video make-up. So, what
you need is a PAL to NTSC converter (or vice versa).
 
T

Tzortzakakis Dimitrios

Jan 1, 1970
0
Not MHz , Hz.The frequency of the video system is based on the frequency of
the mains.
 
D

DarkMatter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Not MHz , Hz.The frequency of the video system is based on the frequency of
the mains.

No, it is not. It just happens to coincide.
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
Maybe I have no explained very well the problem. I´m going to do more
explicit.

Still images from the computer are sended to a film camera through a monitor
that rasters the image in three passes:red, green and blue.

The camera uses FILM no VIDEO so I don´t think the problem it´s in the PAL
or NTSC...only if the monitor that rasters the still image to be captured
for the film camera has influence by the NTSC system. But I think here there
is no influence because it´s a still image.

Also each image is perfect. The problem is that not all the images are
placed in the same HORIZONTAL position. Are TWO positions that changes, in
appearance, in a random way. This is a problem in the theather projection.

Anyone has opinion about what it´s happening?

Thank to all: Jack, no_one, darkmatter, dimitrios
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
Maybe I have no explained very well the problem. I´m going to do more
explicit.

Still images from the computer are sended to a film camera through a monitor
that rasters the image in three passes:red, green and blue.

The camera uses FILM no VIDEO so I don´t think the problem it´s in the PAL
or NTSC...only if the monitor that rasters the still image to be captured
for the film camera has influence by the NTSC system. But I think here there
is no influence because it´s a still image.

Also each image is perfect. The problem is that not all the images are
placed in the same HORIZONTAL position. Are TWO positions that changes, in
appearance, in a random way. This is a problem in the theather projection.

Anyone has opinion about what it´s happening?
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
One more thing: each frames is shooted in 22 seconds. We are no talking
about real time.
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
One more thing: each frames is shooted in 22 seconds. We are no talking
about real time.
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
The test we have done is with the same picture and sended in repetitive mode
100 times or more.
We see in the computer monitor a preview of the image, but is in a proper
window so we see always the same frame, but no the position, when is being
sended. what we have seen when have developed the film is that the mecanical
window is always in the same position (we see a little shadow of it), and
inside this shadow the image is moved.
The system has this parts:
A computer with windows 2000 as operative system and a software called Werp,
very simple but efective, that sends the image to the film recorder.
The film recorder is a Phoenix Film recording system and the mecanical part
is an Oxberry 3200.
The Phoenix consists in some hardware cards and the monitor that raster the
image. Really is a CRT film recording system as other (solitaire, etc). The
Oxberry is a film camera, here there is no one electronic technology, is
only basic film technologhy.
The system comes to work in 120 or 100v, but we have transform it with a
transformer to be used in 220v. The system is about only 1Kw. Also has a
good ground connection, and one electricity stabilizer. We think the tension
inside the system is correct because the density of the image is stabilized
and good in every frame.
The unique one we have no try it´s to convert the 50hz to 60hz. because this
we think maybe here it´s the problem. Also it´s important the the movement
it´s only in horizontal direction (perpendicular to the advance of the film
in cine that we are talking). In vertical it´s perfect.
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
We have tried with different resolutions: Pal, HD, 2k, 4k. Tif´s file that
has been generated with the Discreet company software called Combustion.
In the system we may catch (I´m no sure this is the word in english), vary
the format in vertical depending the image (Panoramic, etc).
 
D

DarkMatter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Maybe I have no explained very well the problem. I´m going to do more
explicit.

Still images from the computer are sended to a film camera through a monitor
that rasters the image in three passes:red, green and blue.

The camera uses FILM no VIDEO so I don´t think the problem it´s in the PAL
or NTSC...only if the monitor that rasters the still image to be captured
for the film camera has influence by the NTSC system. But I think here there
is no influence because it´s a still image.
it appears that there is no image for the camera to record from.
THAT sounds as if you are feeding the monitor with an unlike signal
composition.

You should insure that both your source for the video, and the
monitor receiving it are of the same format.
Also each image is perfect. The problem is that not all the images are
placed in the same HORIZONTAL position. Are TWO positions that changes, in
appearance, in a random way. This is a problem in the theather projection.

That sounds like a software problem. The registration of those
images should be exact, so if they are not, the image rendering
software has to be to blame, because there is no reason for them to
shift. So the above info about format mismatch is probably not the
issue, if you are indeed seeing the imagery.

This COULD be an issue with the type of monitor used. Three dot
matrix or slot mask might make a difference at the camera level.

Since each shot only illuminates one gun at a time (hopefully), they
can be in actual different locations. This would only be some portion
of a millimeter, however. How big are the shifts?
 
D

DarkMatter

Jan 1, 1970
0
One more thing: each frames is shooted in 22 seconds. We are no talking
about real time.


Each color gets exposed that long, or each color gets somewhere
around than a seven second exposure?
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
We are talking about six or seven pixels of difference, no more
 
T

**THE-RFI-EMI-GUY**

Jan 1, 1970
0
Maybe there is some magnetic field influencing the CRT? How about that
big transformer?
 
T

**THE-RFI-EMI-GUY**

Jan 1, 1970
0
Maybe a mechanical problem in the film transport? Thats a pretty slow
process. Usually film just flys by.
 
T

**THE-RFI-EMI-GUY**

Jan 1, 1970
0
Are the three color passes in perfect registration? What happens if you
freeze the transport and make a double exposure, do the images shift?
 
T

TERESA

Jan 1, 1970
0
Respect the mechanical we think this part of the system works correctly
because we may see a very little shadow that means the camera window and
it´s always in the same position. Also we may see the image that is moved
respect this mask.

The three colors are in perfect position, really the image viewing alone is
perfect in definition and color, so the three passes are positioned
perfectly. We have no done one double exposure anytime, we may try to be
what happens.

Respect the magnetic field. It´s also a possibility. We have two stabilizer
of 500w each, from this we have two autotransformers of 500w each
(220-110v), and from here one to the computer and the other to the film
recorder. All of this is very closed to a brick wall in the office and also
all of this goes to a multiple plug in the wall. The system is very closed
in all of his components.

If were a magnetic field problem, which will be the solution?
 
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