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PCB drilling: problem solved

I've been drilling PCBs for years with a regular handheld electric
drill and non-carbide bits. I've had surprisingly good results and
broke very few bits. But holding that drill does get old after about
100 holes.

I'm looking for an alternative solution to this. A drill press at
www.micromark.com looks decent for 150-200 USD. How about a Dremel?
This seems like an ideal solution, but I've been reading a lot about
the Dremel drill press stands that aren't precise enough (too much
wobble for carbide bits). Ebay has a lot of super-cheap small drill
presses, but the price makes me think they're junk.

What does everyone do, besides pay a PCB house?

I solved my problem. I liked the idea of a Dremel and a drill press
stand, but didn't like the grumblings about the rigidity of the stand.
I know some have claimed the older stands are better, but didn't want
to mess with it.
So, I found another company that makes rotory tools and a nice sturdy
stand. Proxxon, which I know someone here has mentioned, makes a very
nice rotary tool, and a very solid stand, although with a bit of "made
in Taiwan" cheapness. But the stand is solid as far as drilling is
concerned.

BTW the rotary tool doesn't seem cheap at all, and is made in DE and LU.
 
B

Bobo The Chimp

Jan 1, 1970
0
I solved my problem. I liked the idea of a Dremel and a drill press
stand, but didn't like the grumblings about the rigidity of the stand. I
know some have claimed the older stands are better, but didn't want to
mess with it.
So, I found another company that makes rotory tools and a nice sturdy
stand. Proxxon, which I know someone here has mentioned, makes a very
nice rotary tool, and a very solid stand, although with a bit of "made in
Taiwan" cheapness. But the stand is solid as far as drilling is
concerned.

BTW the rotary tool doesn't seem cheap at all, and is made in DE and LU.

Deustchland and Lusitania? ;-P
 
If you can't afford 33$ to have a two-sided plated-through-hole board
with solder mask and silkscreen made, how can you afford the tools,
chemicals, materials, time and space to futz around to end up with an
inferior product in every way?

The mentality of you DIY PCB guys baffles me totally.
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you can't afford 33$ to have a two-sided plated-through-hole board with
solder mask and silkscreen made, how can you afford the tools, chemicals,
materials, time and space to futz around to end up with an inferior
product in every way?

The mentality of you DIY PCB guys baffles me totally.

If you only have enough money for a $3.00 board, and $2.00 worth of
etchant, and need it right now ...

Well, you "appliance operators" have never understood "Real Hobbyists"
anyway. ;-) ;-)

Cheers!
Rich
 
J

Jeff Findley

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rich Grise said:
If you only have enough money for a $3.00 board, and $2.00 worth of
etchant, and need it right now ...

Well, you "appliance operators" have never understood "Real Hobbyists"
anyway. ;-) ;-)

Yep. I needed four (peripheral) USB jacks for a recent project. I ended up
buying four iPod Shuffle (old style) docking stations on clearance at Radio
Shack for $3. Not only did they have the socket I needed, but also came
with cables and other goodies I can use. ;-)

For me this really is a hobby, so I really don't have any deadlines to meet.
And since I've got three kids, I've got little money for the hobby to begin
with.

Jeff
 
T

Tim Auton

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you can't afford 33$ to have a two-sided plated-through-hole board
with solder mask and silkscreen made, how can you afford the tools,
chemicals, materials, time and space to futz around to end up with an
inferior product in every way?

The mentality of you DIY PCB guys baffles me totally.

Who says people who make DIY PCBs can't afford professionally made ones?
I roll my own because I can have a finished board in a couple of hours
rather than a couple of weeks.


Tim
 
L

Leon

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you can't afford 33$ to have a two-sided plated-through-hole board
with solder mask and silkscreen made, how can you afford the tools,
chemicals, materials, time and space to futz around to end up with an
inferior product in every way?

The mentality of you DIY PCB guys baffles me totally.

Speed is the reason I do it, I can make a prototype PCB at home in
about 30 minutes.

Leon
 
N

Nico Coesel

Jan 1, 1970
0
Tim Auton said:
Who says people who make DIY PCBs can't afford professionally made ones?
I roll my own because I can have a finished board in a couple of hours
rather than a couple of weeks.

Exactly! I keep my etching machine around just in case I want a simple
PCB quick.
 
Tim said:
Who says people who make DIY PCBs can't afford professionally made ones?
I roll my own because I can have a finished board in a couple of hours
rather than a couple of weeks.


Tim

if you pay an extra $10 for fedex delievery, you can have shipped
overnight
 
Tim said:
Who says people who make DIY PCBs can't afford professionally made ones?
I roll my own because I can have a finished board in a couple of hours
rather than a couple of weeks.


Tim

if you pay an extra $10 for fedex delievery, you can have shipped
overnight
 
J

James Thompson

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you can't afford 33$ to have a two-sided plated-through-hole board
with solder mask and silkscreen made, how can you afford the tools,
chemicals, materials, time and space to futz around to end up with an
inferior product in every way?

The mentality of you DIY PCB guys baffles me totally.
With that logic, why climb the mountain when you can rent a helicopter and
fly up there. Because we can make our own and prototypes don't have to be
made with professional pcb's, they just have to work.
 
D

DJ Delorie

Jan 1, 1970
0
if you pay an extra $10 for fedex delievery, you can have shipped
overnight

You also have to pay for rush service *buildling* the board, which can
sometimes double the price. And you still won't have it for a few
days, because it still takes 1-2 days to make the board, plus a day to
ship it. The last board I had made took almost three weeks from
ordering to possession, because I couldn't justify the cost of "fast"
service.

You can mask, etch, and drill a board in about an hour. I do my own
boards for all my one-shot boards (i.e. prototypes, test boards,
socket adapters, etc), but send out for the "final" boards. I might
revise a board a few times in a day before I get it right.

Plus it's more fun to do it yourself sometimes.
 
D

DJ Delorie

Jan 1, 1970
0
if you pay an extra $10 for fedex delievery, you can have shipped
overnight

"Fedex. When it absolutely, positively, doesn't have to be there
until tomorrow."
 
if you pay an extra $10 for fedex delievery, you can have shipped
overnight

It's not a matter of being able to afford it. I'm impatient, and it's
not economical for me. Did I mention I'm impatient?
The last board I did, just a week or two ago, is single side, all
through hole, and would cost $60 USD total from PCBCART in 7 days. I
only need one. No soldermask, silkscreen, nothing extra.

All my tools/materials for doing my own cost much less than $200.
Chemicals and consumable materials are cheap. $60 for one 3.5x7 inch,
single side board. Plus I wait a FULL WEEK. That's about 1/3 the cost
of my tools/materials alone.

How does it make sense again to have a PCB house make all your PCBs??
 
B

Barry Lennox

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you can't afford 33$ to have a two-sided plated-through-hole board
with solder mask and silkscreen made, how can you afford the tools,
chemicals, materials, time and space to futz around to end up with an
inferior product in every way?

The mentality of you DIY PCB guys baffles me totally.


The mentality of the out-source brigade baffles me. Despite all the
PCB house promises, and their "premium-rush" charges, they always seem
to end up a day late with creative excuses "Ah-ha we received the
files at 0802, they must be there by 0800" --- "It's a public holiday
in Mongolia" ---- : "We had them our ready, but the Fedex guy missed
his pickup, real bad luck" and so on. There seems to be no way to
get a PCB in less than 3-4 days. Even goofing about, I can make a
prototype in a couple of hours.
 
M

martin griffith

Jan 1, 1970
0
[/QUOTE]
It's not a matter of being able to afford it. I'm impatient, and it's
not economical for me. Did I mention I'm impatient?
The last board I did, just a week or two ago, is single side, all
through hole, and would cost $60 USD total from PCBCART in 7 days. I
only need one. No soldermask, silkscreen, nothing extra.

All my tools/materials for doing my own cost much less than $200.
Chemicals and consumable materials are cheap. $60 for one 3.5x7 inch,
single side board. Plus I wait a FULL WEEK. That's about 1/3 the cost
of my tools/materials alone.

How does it make sense again to have a PCB house make all your PCBs??

So you only have one design happening at a time?

Work on one thing, send off the gerbers, start the next idea, by the
time you are bored with that the PCBs will have arrived, so you can
get un/board/bored playing on the workbench, then when you get bored
back to the next or last but one idea.

and nothing ever gets finished :)


martin
 
Y

YD

Jan 1, 1970
0
Late at night, by candle light, [email protected] penned this
immortal opus:
If you can't afford 33$ to have a two-sided plated-through-hole board
with solder mask and silkscreen made, how can you afford the tools,
chemicals, materials, time and space to futz around to end up with an
inferior product in every way?

The mentality of you DIY PCB guys baffles me totally.

For the investment you can make many boards, with a significant
reduction in per board cost, even the one-offs.

Hobbyists don't care about the extra time and labor, they do it for
fun.

Some designers make initial prototypes, it's a lot faster than waiting
for the boardhouse to get off its ass.

That said, if a design is done and is sellable it's time to send it
off for professional fabrication.

- YD.
 
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