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package converter

J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
I have a what I think is a really good idea to make a ic package converter
that is solderless(i.e., you don't have to solder the ic to the converter).
Sorta like the ones for plcc's. Not sure if they are on the market as all
I've seen is solder ones. Is this marketable? (probably main use would be
for prototyping) Not sure if its worth pursuing or not. They probably could
be made pretty cheap too.


Thanks,
Jon
 
I have a what I think is a really good idea to make a ic package converter
that is solderless(i.e., you don't have to solder the ic to the converter).
Sorta like the ones for plcc's. Not sure if they are on the market as all
I've seen is solder ones. Is this marketable? (probably main use would be
for prototyping) Not sure if its worth pursuing or not. They probably could
be made pretty cheap too.

Thanks,
Jon

Send them your idea
http://www.ironwoodelectronics.com/
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
I have a what I think is a really good idea to make a ic package converter
that is solderless(i.e., you don't have to solder the ic to the converter).
Sorta like the ones for plcc's. Not sure if they are on the market as all
I've seen is solder ones. Is this marketable? (probably main use would be
for prototyping) Not sure if its worth pursuing or not. They probably could
be made pretty cheap too.

Figure out who your prospective market is, build one, and show it
around. :)

Good Luck!
Rich
 
J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rich Grise said:
Figure out who your prospective market is, build one, and show it
around. :)

Hehe, well, I'm trying to see if there is a market. I know I'd probably use
it but thats just me. Wondering if anyone else would find it useful?
 
E

Ecnerwal

Jan 1, 1970
0
Jon Slaughter said:
Hehe, well, I'm trying to see if there is a market. I know I'd probably use
it but thats just me. Wondering if anyone else would find it useful?

Nope, I know how to use a soldering iron, and I have considerable
experience which leads me to consider most solderless schemes to be
lousy lash-ups that are prone to the most annoying forms of failure.
 
J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Spehro Pefhany said:
With many seemingly good ideas, it's by far the cheapest approach.

;-)

Thats true but I'd hate for it to turn out to actually be a decent idea and
someone make a killing off it... ok, not a killing but to charge about 10
times what its worth like digikey does is immoral to me(there almost as bad
as radio shack). I almost had a heart attack as I was looking through
digikey's catalog. Things that I know that only cost 1$ are being sold for
10$. One example is copper wick. Now are you going to tell me there is any
difference between copper wicks? I've brought them for 50c and digikey is
selling them for almost 4$ for the same length and weight.

I know I'll get flamed for putting down digikey since there are so many
digikey butt buddies. I'm also not saying everything is a rip off on
digikey but almost everything dealing with prototyping was. I'm sure if you
sold popsickle sticks on digikey for 10$ each there will be someone to buy
it.

In anycase, I'd like to see this idea work out but I doubt it will. Just
not enough of a market to do it myself(or I don't know about how to go and
get these things manufactured and sold)... Maybe I'll talk to ironwoods and
see what they think but chances are if it is any good they would just steal
it.
 
S

Spehro Pefhany

Jan 1, 1970
0
lol, for free?

With many seemingly good ideas, it's by far the cheapest approach.

;-)


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
 
J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ecnerwal said:
Nope, I know how to use a soldering iron, and I have considerable
experience which leads me to consider most solderless schemes to be
lousy lash-ups that are prone to the most annoying forms of failure.

Amazing. You have no idea about the idea yet you assume it won't work from
the get go. My idea, I'm pretty sure and willing to bet a significant sum
of money, won't fail if properly used(which means only a moron like yourself
could **** it up). (its actually quite easy and very similar to plcc
sockets... do you have problems with them failing?)

I guess you are great a desoldering smt ic's too, right? how fast can you
solder on a 144 pin tfqn and then desolder it? how many times can you do
this to the same circuit before the traces lift?

So, lets make this hypothesis first,

Lets assume it works perfectly... would you use it then?
 
R

Rich Webb

Jan 1, 1970
0
I have a what I think is a really good idea to make a ic package converter
that is solderless(i.e., you don't have to solder the ic to the converter).
Sorta like the ones for plcc's. Not sure if they are on the market as all
I've seen is solder ones. Is this marketable? (probably main use would be
for prototyping) Not sure if its worth pursuing or not. They probably could
be made pretty cheap too.

I've used adapters from these guys: http://ebccompany.com/ and
http://www.logicalsys.com/. Lots more out there ...
 
J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rich Webb said:
I've used adapters from these guys: http://ebccompany.com/ and
http://www.logicalsys.com/. Lots more out there ...

http://www.logicalsys.com/qfp-programming-adapter.asp

That one sorta looks like my idea except mine is not nearly as bulky... and
definitely a fraction of the cost. (I think it would work probably 99% as
good as that one. As far as I can tell it looks like it uses the same
general idea but mine isn't as rugged but I think one doesn't need such a
beast for prototyping(it doesn't have a survice a plane crash).
 
M

mpm

Jan 1, 1970
0
Thats true but I'd hate for it to turn out to actually be a decent idea and
someone make a killing off it... ok, not a killing but to charge about 10
times what its worth like digikey does is immoral to me(there almost as bad
as radio shack). I almost had a heart attack as I was looking through
digikey's catalog. Things that I know that only cost 1$ are being sold for
10$. One example is copper wick. Now are you going to tell me there is any
difference between copper wicks? I've brought them for 50c and digikey is
selling them for almost 4$ for the same length and weight.

I know I'll get flamed for putting down digikey since there are so many
digikey butt buddies. I'm also not saying everything is a rip off on
digikey but almost everything dealing with prototyping was. I'm sure if you
sold popsickle sticks on digikey for 10$ each there will be someone to buy
it.

In anycase, I'd like to see this idea work out but I doubt it will. Just
not enough of a market to do it myself(or I don't know about how to go and
get these things manufactured and sold)... Maybe I'll talk to ironwoods and
see what they think but chances are if it is any good they would just steal
it.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You can market anything. (evidence the "Pet Rock")
The trick is doing so successfully.

My knee-jerk reaction is this ain't it.
Market is too small, too niche, too technical, and already has
established competitors.
Plus, the market you're targeting is notoriously cheap and "inventive"
itself.
Not good.

I strongly suspect if you put your mind to it, you could easily come
up with something that has better odds. (heck, even door-to-door
vitamin sales?!)

If it's your passion, and you really don't care all that much about
the cash, then go for it. You never know?? But I can tell you this,
and hear me when I say it:

"NEVER BUILD ANYTHING UNTIL YOU HAVE CUSTOMERS LINED UP!"

-mpm
 
B

Ben Jackson

Jan 1, 1970
0
I have a what I think is a really good idea to make a ic package converter
that is solderless(i.e., you don't have to solder the ic to the converter).

You mean a socket??? There are sockets for all kinds of packages that
aren't typically socketed. All kinds of SMT IC packages. They're
typically very expensive. I've seen a few custom ones at work from an
old ASIC project that look like medieval torture devices.
 
J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ben Jackson said:
You mean a socket??? There are sockets for all kinds of packages that
aren't typically socketed. All kinds of SMT IC packages. They're
typically very expensive. I've seen a few custom ones at work from an
old ASIC project that look like medieval torture devices.

Yeah... look at the rich webb subthread. mine is a similar idea but. I
imagine it could be done for just a few dollars instead of a hundred(those
things are way over priced).
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
Amazing. You have no idea about the idea yet you assume it won't work from
the get go. My idea, I'm pretty sure and willing to bet a significant sum
of money, won't fail if properly used(which means only a moron like yourself
could **** it up). (its actually quite easy and very similar to plcc
sockets... do you have problems with them failing?)

I guess you are great a desoldering smt ic's too, right? how fast can you
solder on a 144 pin tfqn and then desolder it? how many times can you do
this to the same circuit before the traces lift?

So, lets make this hypothesis first,

Lets assume it works perfectly... would you use it then?

So, you've reinvented the socket?

Thanks,
Rich
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
Yeah... look at the rich webb subthread. mine is a similar idea but. I
imagine it could be done for just a few dollars instead of a hundred(those
things are way over priced).

They're "overpriced" because there is so little market demand that
it's not worth making tooling, so essentially each one is "hand-made",
so to speak.

Cheers!
Rich
 
R

Rich Webb

Jan 1, 1970
0
That one sorta looks like my idea except mine is not nearly as bulky... and
definitely a fraction of the cost. (I think it would work probably 99% as
good as that one. As far as I can tell it looks like it uses the same
general idea but mine isn't as rugged but I think one doesn't need such a
beast for prototyping(it doesn't have a survice a plane crash).

A fraction of the cost would be good. However, although not at the
plane crash level, prototyping and programming adapters do get beat
around a bit. (er, no pun intended) I've been using a PLCC44-to-DIP40
adapter quite often recently (the device is in-system programmable but
that's SLOW as compared to using a stand-alone parallel programmer)
and the adapter can get quite a workout,
 
J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rich Webb said:
A fraction of the cost would be good. However, although not at the
plane crash level, prototyping and programming adapters do get beat
around a bit. (er, no pun intended) I've been using a PLCC44-to-DIP40
adapter quite often recently (the device is in-system programmable but
that's SLOW as compared to using a stand-alone parallel programmer)
and the adapter can get quite a workout,

Well, For a fraction of the cost you could afford several. I mean, I think
my idea will do a good job and you just gave me an idea(or, well, it popped
into my head while reading your post) how to even make it better). I imagine
it will work well with no problems 99% of the time. Of course I could be
wrong but its such a simple thing and only needs to be manufactured properly
to work well. (there are basically 4 components and all simple)

Essentially though its the same off those sites for the most part. Of course
I have no idea how much it would actually cost since I tend to under
estimate things. I looking at how expensive some things are makes me believe
things are way overpriced now days.
 
J

Jon Slaughter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rich Grise said:
They're "overpriced" because there is so little market demand that
it's not worth making tooling, so essentially each one is "hand-made",
so to speak.

still not work 100$. Even if its "hand made" all the components can be
produced on a medium scale so the price is still to expensive. I guess the
guy doing it has a degree in EE and feels he should get paid 75$ and hour
just to assemble parts?
 
W

whisky-dave

Jan 1, 1970
0
Jon Slaughter said:
I have a what I think is a really good idea to make a ic package converter
that is solderless(i.e., you don't have to solder the ic to the converter).
Sorta like the ones for plcc's. Not sure if they are on the market as all
I've seen is solder ones. Is this marketable? (probably main use would be
for prototyping) Not sure if its worth pursuing or not. They probably could
be made pretty cheap too.

What about ZIF sockets .

But how much would your sockets cost.
I work in a teaching lab and if we want 20 pin sockets I buy them,
if I want 40 I buy them.
How much would a socket that can take from 8 pin to 64 pin sockets
cost and what of the physical size ?


[1] assuming a package is a form or word for a socket
 
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