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OT: Can modern PCs run 5-1/4" floppy drives?

J

Joerg

Jan 1, 1970
0
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
It's not THE phoenix Award BIOS v1.0.3, It is the:

<insert MOBO make and model name here> BIOS v 1.0.3, provided by the
Award Bios vendor. The versions are MOBO specific, and IF Dell comes out
with another, it will increment. Phoenix is merely the provider. Dell
authors the code.

So Dell wrote the BIOS? Interesting. I thought they were migrating
farther away from the design process. At least they seem to be doing
that with hardware.

Actually, the entire MOBO is likely made FOR Dell by a popular MOBO
maker.

Yes, by Foxconn.

There's your solution. Examine the form factor of the MOBO, and BUY a
cheap MOBO that fits it, that carries the floppy utilization capacity you
need! :-] Bet you could find one for less than $50.


Either that or get a BIOS for a similar G33 Foxconn mobo that includes
the drive support I need. If the HW is on the mobo it can't be rocket
science to access it. Someone said that Linux bypasses the BIOS and see
all the stuff that's on the mobo but was blocked out by the BIOS that
came with it. Maybe there is a kludge for Windows that does that.

My curiosity tells me that I want to figure this out some day and not
take the easy road of swapping the mobo. But not right now, no time.
 
B

Baron

Jan 1, 1970
0
Joerg said:
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
It's not THE phoenix Award BIOS v1.0.3, It is the:

<insert MOBO make and model name here> BIOS v 1.0.3, provided by the
Award Bios vendor. The versions are MOBO specific, and IF Dell comes
out
with another, it will increment. Phoenix is merely the provider.
Dell authors the code.

So Dell wrote the BIOS? Interesting. I thought they were migrating
farther away from the design process. At least they seem to be doing
that with hardware.

Actually, the entire MOBO is likely made FOR Dell by a popular MOBO
maker.

Yes, by Foxconn.

There's your solution. Examine the form factor of the MOBO, and
BUY a
cheap MOBO that fits it, that carries the floppy utilization capacity
you
need! :-] Bet you could find one for less than $50.


Either that or get a BIOS for a similar G33 Foxconn mobo that includes
the drive support I need. If the HW is on the mobo it can't be rocket
science to access it. Someone said that Linux bypasses the BIOS and
see all the stuff that's on the mobo but was blocked out by the BIOS
that came with it. Maybe there is a kludge for Windows that does that.

My curiosity tells me that I want to figure this out some day and not
take the easy road of swapping the mobo. But not right now, no time.

Joerg, Don't mess about! Try a Linux Live CD. You could be pleasantly
surprised.
 
C

ChairmanOfTheBored

Jan 1, 1970
0
It's part of it.



The WDs I have are quite quiet.



The 10k rpm Barracudas I've used are with doubt the NOISIEST drives I've ever met.

Graham


Don't even think about comparing your 5 year old drive with current
models. Compare modern drives with modern drives.

My early ide drives were quite noisy, but they do not belong in this
comparison. Use your brain, boy.
 
C

ChairmanOfTheBored

Jan 1, 1970
0
Graphics controllers integrated onto the mobo are typically
one-connector deals like on this new Dell here. And it doesn't let me
check out any dual-monitor settings until I actually plug a 2nd monitor in.


So disable it, and plug in a PCI vid card. Sheesh.
 
C

ChairmanOfTheBored

Jan 1, 1970
0
Yes, by Foxconn.


OK, then THEY are the BIOS authors, and THEY are in control of whether
a new version ever gets released, and it is THEY who you should be
contacting, NOT Dell.
 
J

Joerg

Jan 1, 1970
0
Baron said:
Joerg said:
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:33:35 -0700, Joerg

It's the
Phoenix AwardBIOS 1.0.3. I am very surprised that such legacy
features were chopped off.

It's not THE phoenix Award BIOS v1.0.3, It is the:

<insert MOBO make and model name here> BIOS v 1.0.3, provided by the
Award Bios vendor. The versions are MOBO specific, and IF Dell comes
out
with another, it will increment. Phoenix is merely the provider.
Dell authors the code.
So Dell wrote the BIOS? Interesting. I thought they were migrating
farther away from the design process. At least they seem to be doing
that with hardware.

Actually, the entire MOBO is likely made FOR Dell by a popular MOBO
maker.
Yes, by Foxconn.

There's your solution. Examine the form factor of the MOBO, and
BUY a
cheap MOBO that fits it, that carries the floppy utilization capacity
you
need! :-] Bet you could find one for less than $50.

Either that or get a BIOS for a similar G33 Foxconn mobo that includes
the drive support I need. If the HW is on the mobo it can't be rocket
science to access it. Someone said that Linux bypasses the BIOS and
see all the stuff that's on the mobo but was blocked out by the BIOS
that came with it. Maybe there is a kludge for Windows that does that.

My curiosity tells me that I want to figure this out some day and not
take the easy road of swapping the mobo. But not right now, no time.

Joerg, Don't mess about! Try a Linux Live CD. You could be pleasantly
surprised.

Much of my stuff doesn't work under Linux and some supposedly not even
in a VM.
 
J

Joerg

Jan 1, 1970
0
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
OK, then THEY are the BIOS authors, and THEY are in control of whether
a new version ever gets released, and it is THEY who you should be
contacting, NOT Dell.


Well, for me the first avenue is always to contact the comapny that sold
me the merchandise. Give them a chance. That would be Dell, and so far
they were pretty responsive. Foxconn will be next but I won't get my
hopes up. IME the responsiveness of Chinese companies is, ahem, sub-par.
Unless you happen to be the cousin twice-removed of the brother-in-law
of the chief engineer there. Taiwanese companies were usually very
different in that respect. I remember a long time ago when I contacted
Tseng Labs (remember them?) because I needed to address their graphics
chip directly out of an ultrasound scan converter. Then next day the
phone rang and a woman asked whether she could help. Turns out she was
one of the designers of that chip, knew it inside out and answered every
single question about it and actually gave me some valuable info that
wasn't in the datasheet.

The reason for this exercise is not to save a buck but to learn and also
to see whether a system like this could be used in some client
applications. They often require XP as the OS just like I do and legacy
support is also important. Piecing together a system isn't an option and
usually it has to come from places like HP or Dell.
 
C

ChairmanOfTheBored

Jan 1, 1970
0
Baron said:
Joerg said:
ChairmanOfTheBored wrote:
On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:33:35 -0700, Joerg

It's the
Phoenix AwardBIOS 1.0.3. I am very surprised that such legacy
features were chopped off.

It's not THE phoenix Award BIOS v1.0.3, It is the:

<insert MOBO make and model name here> BIOS v 1.0.3, provided by the
Award Bios vendor. The versions are MOBO specific, and IF Dell comes
out
with another, it will increment. Phoenix is merely the provider.
Dell authors the code.

So Dell wrote the BIOS? Interesting. I thought they were migrating
farther away from the design process. At least they seem to be doing
that with hardware.


Actually, the entire MOBO is likely made FOR Dell by a popular MOBO
maker.

Yes, by Foxconn.


There's your solution. Examine the form factor of the MOBO, and
BUY a
cheap MOBO that fits it, that carries the floppy utilization capacity
you
need! :-] Bet you could find one for less than $50.

Either that or get a BIOS for a similar G33 Foxconn mobo that includes
the drive support I need. If the HW is on the mobo it can't be rocket
science to access it. Someone said that Linux bypasses the BIOS and
see all the stuff that's on the mobo but was blocked out by the BIOS
that came with it. Maybe there is a kludge for Windows that does that.

My curiosity tells me that I want to figure this out some day and not
take the easy road of swapping the mobo. But not right now, no time.

Joerg, Don't mess about! Try a Linux Live CD. You could be pleasantly
surprised.

Much of my stuff doesn't work under Linux and some supposedly not even
in a VM.


Bullshit. I'll bet that it works under DOSBox, or QEMU either one,
whether from within DOS, Windows, Linux, or even on a MAC, as the app has
no way of knowing what it is running under.
 
G

Gary Tait

Jan 1, 1970
0
Got the PC fired up now. Lo and behold the on-board graphics set (Intel
G33) seems to have that feature. Maybe. But it's grayed out, saying that
you must first connect two monitors before it can be configured. In a
big city I'd walk over to a PC store to buy a splitter cable and
adapter. Not out here :-(

Purchase it from an eBay vendor. That is how I buy most of my little knic-
knacks like that.
 
J

Joerg

Jan 1, 1970
0
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
Baron said:
Joerg wrote:

ChairmanOfTheBored wrote:
On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:33:35 -0700, Joerg

It's the
Phoenix AwardBIOS 1.0.3. I am very surprised that such legacy
features were chopped off.
It's not THE phoenix Award BIOS v1.0.3, It is the:

<insert MOBO make and model name here> BIOS v 1.0.3, provided by the
Award Bios vendor. The versions are MOBO specific, and IF Dell comes
out
with another, it will increment. Phoenix is merely the provider.
Dell authors the code.

So Dell wrote the BIOS? Interesting. I thought they were migrating
farther away from the design process. At least they seem to be doing
that with hardware.


Actually, the entire MOBO is likely made FOR Dell by a popular MOBO
maker.

Yes, by Foxconn.


There's your solution. Examine the form factor of the MOBO, and
BUY a
cheap MOBO that fits it, that carries the floppy utilization capacity
you
need! :-] Bet you could find one for less than $50.
Either that or get a BIOS for a similar G33 Foxconn mobo that includes
the drive support I need. If the HW is on the mobo it can't be rocket
science to access it. Someone said that Linux bypasses the BIOS and
see all the stuff that's on the mobo but was blocked out by the BIOS
that came with it. Maybe there is a kludge for Windows that does that.

My curiosity tells me that I want to figure this out some day and not
take the easy road of swapping the mobo. But not right now, no time.
Joerg, Don't mess about! Try a Linux Live CD. You could be pleasantly
surprised.
Much of my stuff doesn't work under Linux and some supposedly not even
in a VM.


Bullshit. I'll bet that it works under DOSBox, or QEMU either one,
whether from within DOS, Windows, Linux, or even on a MAC, as the app has
no way of knowing what it is running under.


It's not all DOS stuff, that would be easy. Some instrument control like
for the DSO is rather fickle, requires .NET 1.1 (won't work with 2.0).
Just one example.
 
J

JosephKK

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eeyore [email protected] posted to
sci.electronics.design:
You are deliberately/intentionally misinterpreting what I said.

Only to be expected from an IDIOT like yourself of course.

FFS, have you nothing better to do than make a FOOL of yourself ?

Graham

Boys, the whole thread is stored on most servers still, and certainly
on the google archives. It is all easily sorted out.
 
J

JosephKK

Jan 1, 1970
0
ChairmanOfTheBored [email protected] posted to
sci.electronics.design:
Idiot. It isn't about spindle speed.

WD and many others use die cast cases. They resonate fiercely.

Seagate uses fully machined cases and are notorious as the
quietest

What a blazing liar. I just examined several of my drives for a
variety of manufacturers, including Seagate, WD, Hitachi, Fujitsu,
and Maxtor, and every damn one of them from brand new driver to
12-year old drives have a cast then machined frame, most with stamped
spindle covers. It has been that way for 20 years for all makes.
 
C

ChairmanOfTheBored

Jan 1, 1970
0
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
Baron wrote:
Joerg wrote:

ChairmanOfTheBored wrote:
On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:33:35 -0700, Joerg

It's the
Phoenix AwardBIOS 1.0.3. I am very surprised that such legacy
features were chopped off.
It's not THE phoenix Award BIOS v1.0.3, It is the:

<insert MOBO make and model name here> BIOS v 1.0.3, provided by the
Award Bios vendor. The versions are MOBO specific, and IF Dell comes
out
with another, it will increment. Phoenix is merely the provider.
Dell authors the code.

So Dell wrote the BIOS? Interesting. I thought they were migrating
farther away from the design process. At least they seem to be doing
that with hardware.


Actually, the entire MOBO is likely made FOR Dell by a popular MOBO
maker.

Yes, by Foxconn.


There's your solution. Examine the form factor of the MOBO, and
BUY a
cheap MOBO that fits it, that carries the floppy utilization capacity
you
need! :-] Bet you could find one for less than $50.
Either that or get a BIOS for a similar G33 Foxconn mobo that includes
the drive support I need. If the HW is on the mobo it can't be rocket
science to access it. Someone said that Linux bypasses the BIOS and
see all the stuff that's on the mobo but was blocked out by the BIOS
that came with it. Maybe there is a kludge for Windows that does that.

My curiosity tells me that I want to figure this out some day and not
take the easy road of swapping the mobo. But not right now, no time.
Joerg, Don't mess about! Try a Linux Live CD. You could be pleasantly
surprised.

Much of my stuff doesn't work under Linux and some supposedly not even
in a VM.


Bullshit. I'll bet that it works under DOSBox, or QEMU either one,
whether from within DOS, Windows, Linux, or even on a MAC, as the app has
no way of knowing what it is running under.


It's not all DOS stuff, that would be easy. Some instrument control like
for the DSO is rather fickle, requires .NET 1.1 (won't work with 2.0).
Just one example.


Then you need an update from them, because the .net update to 2.0
shouldn't break an app. If it does, it is usually the app's fault.
 
C

ChairmanOfTheBored

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eeyore [email protected] posted to
sci.electronics.design:


Boys, the whole thread is stored on most servers still, and certainly
on the google archives. It is all easily sorted out.


I can easily quote and post his original remark where he clearly claims
that the controller CARD was the only difference.
 
K

krw

Jan 1, 1970
0
If it doesn't support dual monitors, it can't be used. ;-)
Craigslist it is then.

Or donate to a worthy cause, starving student, etc.

Even starving students have better hardware.
 
K

krw

Jan 1, 1970
0
ChairmanOfTheBored wrote:



In IDE, the master does not do any at all with respect to command sent to
the slave.

If I am wrong, where is that specified in the ATA specification? If you are
right, then you should be able to answer the question.

The master only knows of the presence of the slave, little more.

If you read and understand the spec, you'll find that both drives receive
the command (the registers in each are written) but only the addressed
drive responds to the command.

How in the world did you get sucked into an argument with those two
idiots?
 
C

ChairmanOfTheBored

Jan 1, 1970
0
What a blazing liar. I just examined several of my drives for a
variety of manufacturers, including Seagate, WD, Hitachi, Fujitsu,
and Maxtor, and every damn one of them from brand new driver to
12-year old drives have a cast then machined frame, most with stamped
spindle covers. It has been that way for 20 years for all makes.


No, dumbass. A cast case is used in many, but NOT the seagate drives.
And the casting is MINIMALLY machined on the boss for the spindle motor,
and the locations for mounting it into the machining center, and aligning
the PCB so the rear connectors are all correctly located, you stupid
****.

The seagate case is FULLY machined, and it is done so from a billet,
not a casting.

Maybe one day, you will know the difference, you goddamned retard.
 
I

IAmTheSlime

Jan 1, 1970
0
I see you finally found one of mommy's socks that fit.


**** off, KeithStain.

If you'll go look up the lyrics, you'll see that they fit better than
you might imagine.

You are owned.
 
J

Joerg

Jan 1, 1970
0
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
ChairmanOfTheBored said:
On Sat, 13 Oct 2007 13:24:24 -0700, Joerg

Baron wrote:
Joerg wrote:

ChairmanOfTheBored wrote:
On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:33:35 -0700, Joerg

It's the
Phoenix AwardBIOS 1.0.3. I am very surprised that such legacy
features were chopped off.
It's not THE phoenix Award BIOS v1.0.3, It is the:

<insert MOBO make and model name here> BIOS v 1.0.3, provided by the
Award Bios vendor. The versions are MOBO specific, and IF Dell comes
out
with another, it will increment. Phoenix is merely the provider.
Dell authors the code.

So Dell wrote the BIOS? Interesting. I thought they were migrating
farther away from the design process. At least they seem to be doing
that with hardware.


Actually, the entire MOBO is likely made FOR Dell by a popular MOBO
maker.

Yes, by Foxconn.


There's your solution. Examine the form factor of the MOBO, and
BUY a
cheap MOBO that fits it, that carries the floppy utilization capacity
you
need! :-] Bet you could find one for less than $50.
Either that or get a BIOS for a similar G33 Foxconn mobo that includes
the drive support I need. If the HW is on the mobo it can't be rocket
science to access it. Someone said that Linux bypasses the BIOS and
see all the stuff that's on the mobo but was blocked out by the BIOS
that came with it. Maybe there is a kludge for Windows that does that.

My curiosity tells me that I want to figure this out some day and not
take the easy road of swapping the mobo. But not right now, no time.
Joerg, Don't mess about! Try a Linux Live CD. You could be pleasantly
surprised.

Much of my stuff doesn't work under Linux and some supposedly not even
in a VM.

Bullshit. I'll bet that it works under DOSBox, or QEMU either one,
whether from within DOS, Windows, Linux, or even on a MAC, as the app has
no way of knowing what it is running under.

It's not all DOS stuff, that would be easy. Some instrument control like
for the DSO is rather fickle, requires .NET 1.1 (won't work with 2.0).
Just one example.


Then you need an update from them, because the .net update to 2.0
shouldn't break an app. If it does, it is usually the app's fault.


No, this one looks like MS's fault. They botched backward compatibility.
I am not the only one who found out.

Also, whether an app is considered faulty or not, many times we must
live with it because there ain't anything else. Also, the old saying
applies: The customer is king.
 
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