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Old cables w/new sub-panel?

Discussion in 'Electronic Design' started by JoJo, Dec 9, 2007.

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  1. JoJo

    JoJo Guest

    New sub-panel about to go in. Most of the circuits (they're all 2-wire) use
    50-year-old cloth-and-rubber covered "romex" which is brittle, now.

    Is there any exception in the NEC that allows the use of a bushing or such
    and not a 2-screw clamp to hold the cable where it enters the sub-panel
    enclosure? This old stuff needs gentle treatment...

    Would use of such bushings ever likely pass inspection?

    Thanks,
    JJ
     
  2. Guest

    | New sub-panel about to go in. Most of the circuits (they're all 2-wire) use
    | 50-year-old cloth-and-rubber covered "romex" which is brittle, now.
    |
    | Is there any exception in the NEC that allows the use of a bushing or such
    | and not a 2-screw clamp to hold the cable where it enters the sub-panel
    | enclosure? This old stuff needs gentle treatment...
    |
    | Would use of such bushings ever likely pass inspection?

    I hope you are putting all those old circuit on arc-fault breakers.

    Sorry, I don't know about the bushings issue.
     
  3. Jamie

    Jamie Guest

    Hope you have good home owners insurance..

    Last time I checked, it's illegal to run old clothe wire
    in a new panel/subpanel. It has to be joined out side with
    the proper wire coming out of the box..

    And in this local ordinance, if you perform any upgrades to
    the system on the feeders or sub's, all circuits connecting to
    it also must be replaced or in order with the rules of
    the L1,N and ground. et.
     
  4. Doug Miller

    Doug Miller Guest

    Got a reference to that in the NEC?
     
  5. Guest

    | JoJo wrote:
    |
    |> New sub-panel about to go in. Most of the circuits (they're all 2-wire) use
    |> 50-year-old cloth-and-rubber covered "romex" which is brittle, now.
    |>
    |> Is there any exception in the NEC that allows the use of a bushing or such
    |> and not a 2-screw clamp to hold the cable where it enters the sub-panel
    |> enclosure? This old stuff needs gentle treatment...
    |>
    |> Would use of such bushings ever likely pass inspection?
    |>
    |> Thanks,
    |> JJ
    |>
    | Hope you have good home owners insurance..
    |
    | Last time I checked, it's illegal to run old clothe wire
    | in a new panel/subpanel. It has to be joined out side with
    | the proper wire coming out of the box..

    So you would have the new and old wire joined _outside_ of a box?


    | And in this local ordinance, if you perform any upgrades to
    | the system on the feeders or sub's, all circuits connecting to
    | it also must be replaced or in order with the rules of
    | the L1,N and ground. et.

    So in your local jurisdiction, they make it impractical to incrementally
    make electrical improvements, forcing everyone to choose between all or
    nothing? Someone with only $1000 to spend per year upgrading their home
    wiring will just have to live with a situation that stays fully dangerous
    until they save those $1000 per year to the point of being able to do the
    whole upgrade all at once?
     
  6. Jamie

    Jamie Guest

    If you don't have local ordinance issues like here, you bring new
    wire out and lead it to a existing older junction box where you then
    bond it to the clothe wire.. You do not disturb the old wire..
    In many cases, this was ok if the clothe was the old BX, the armor
    was thus ground connected. Still not a good idea to depend on as a
    ground. the BX is also outlawed now..
    You can use MC, or Green Field in enclosed or unreachable area's
    only now.. The MC has a copper filament in it to help reduce the effects
    of what happen to the old BX wire years ago. that caused lots of fires
    with old clothe wire in armor coil when the cloth insulation started to
    dry up. The coil use to vibrate when it got loose, also, if you have a
    loose connector fitting and some bad appliance on that circuit, the coil
    could heat up!
    oh well.
    Yes, when it comes to clothe wrap and knob wire yes, If you disturb the
    wiring due to upgrades, you are to replace it. of course, you can do
    this with no permit and they wouldn't know.

    This only applies if you live in a city like I do. The fire marshal
    has their own codes you must adhere by. All of this gets things in
    motion as soon as a permit for upgrades is issued around here.

    In my own home, I do have old clothe wrapped wire for lighting
    only, I still have a couple of rungs of knob wire on the beam in the
    basement how ever, these are not directly connected in my panel when the
    service was upgraded years ago. As for the rest of the home, our
    insurance company forced us years ago to upgrade all the outlets and old
    wire with the acception of lighting circuits.
     
  7. Guest

    use s/o cord strain relief at box, insulated staples outside
     
  8. terryS

    terryS Guest

    A recent fire in this city was the fourth in that residence, an old
    one, in 17 years. This most recent fire caused damage to two living
    units. Fortunately no deaths. Investigations indicate that it was an
    electtrical fire one wonders what condition the wiring is in and the
    judgement good or poor of the users?
    Not too long ago another fire did kill somebody, even with smoke
    alarms etc. one might not escape especially from one of these older
    homes?
     
  9. terryS

    terryS Guest

    IMO this question would get a better answer on < alt.home.repair >
    news group.
     
  10. Guest

    TO SAVE YOU MONEY ON REPAIR OF RH SHEATHED CABLE US SHRINK TUBE OR
    SAY FOR # 14-USE #12 THHWN AS SLIP SAME AS SHRINK TUBE BE GENTLE AND
    TAKE YOUR TIME.
     
  11. Guest

    In alt.engineering.electrical wrote:
    |> New sub-panel about to go in. Most of the circuits (they're all 2-wire) use
    |> 50-year-old cloth-and-rubber covered "romex" which is brittle, now.
    |>
    |> Is there any exception in the NEC that allows the use of a bushing or such
    |> and not a 2-screw clamp to hold the cable where it enters the sub-panel
    |> enclosure? This old stuff needs gentle treatment...
    |>
    |> Would use of such bushings ever likely pass inspection?
    |>
    |> Thanks,
    |> JJ
    |
    | TO SAVE YOU MONEY ON REPAIR OF RH SHEATHED CABLE US SHRINK TUBE OR
    | SAY FOR # 14-USE #12 THHWN AS SLIP SAME AS SHRINK TUBE BE GENTLE AND
    | TAKE YOUR TIME.

    And if you do this often enough, and save enough money, you can buy yourself
    a caps-unlock key.
     
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