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No Time Left For VCRs?

U

UCLAN

Jan 1, 1970
0
GregS said:
I think there is a DVI ont the HD box.

There ya go! *That's* a digital output.
Digital with standard lines/frequency.

Sometimes, you're nonsensical. What does "...digital channels will go off the
air with NTSC bandwidth specs" mean? Digital has nothing to do with NTSC. And
"Digital with standard lines/frequency" ?? All NA video transmissions, be it
NTSC, ATSC SD, or ATSC HD are modulated into the same 6 MHz bandwidth. HD
video uses as high as 18.5 Mbps data rate, while SD typically is around
1-2 Mbps. Broadcasters are allowed up to 19.39 Mbps for their 8VSB modulated
signals. Some use the entire bandwidth (18.5 Mbps of it) for their HD channel,
while others use less for their HD channel, but add one or more SD channels.
Right now I have the RGB going to my new LCD HDTV works fine in HD mode. If
I connectec video to my old 36 inch CRT Toshiba, its not going to recognize
the new formats.

What "formats" ?? If you feed a digital signal into an analog monitor, it
won't tune the digital signal at all.
 
G

GregS

Jan 1, 1970
0
There ya go! *That's* a digital output.


Sometimes, you're nonsensical. What does "...digital channels will go off the
air with NTSC bandwidth specs" mean? Digital has nothing to do with NTSC. And
"Digital with standard lines/frequency" ?? All NA video transmissions, be it
NTSC, ATSC SD, or ATSC HD are modulated into the same 6 MHz bandwidth. HD
video uses as high as 18.5 Mbps data rate, while SD typically is around
1-2 Mbps. Broadcasters are allowed up to 19.39 Mbps for their 8VSB modulated
signals. Some use the entire bandwidth (18.5 Mbps of it) for their HD channel,
while others use less for their HD channel, but add one or more SD channels.


Digital =SD=NTSC= specs for lines vertical horzontal...
Standard Definition = NTSC or SD



What "formats" ?? If you feed a digital signal into an analog monitor, it
won't tune the digital signal at all.


NO NO

I want to feed a high quality video, made from an HDTV broadcast, with higher specs than NTSC
"broadcast" into my Toshiba which can decifer at least 600-700 lines of video regardless of the NTSC
specs.
 
G

GregS

Jan 1, 1970
0
There ya go! *That's* a digital output.


Sometimes, you're nonsensical. What does "...digital channels will go off the
air with NTSC bandwidth specs" mean? Digital has nothing to do with NTSC. And
"Digital with standard lines/frequency" ?? All NA video transmissions, be it
NTSC, ATSC SD, or ATSC HD are modulated into the same 6 MHz bandwidth. HD
video uses as high as 18.5 Mbps data rate, while SD typically is around
1-2 Mbps. Broadcasters are allowed up to 19.39 Mbps for their 8VSB modulated
signals. Some use the entire bandwidth (18.5 Mbps of it) for their HD channel,
while others use less for their HD channel, but add one or more SD channels.


Digital =SD=NTSC= specs for lines vertical horzontal...
Standard Definition = NTSC or SD



What "formats" ?? If you feed a digital signal into an analog monitor, it
won't tune the digital signal at all.


NO NO

I want to feed a high quality video, made from an HDTV broadcast, with higher
specs than NTSC
"broadcast" into my Toshiba which can decifer at least 600-700 lines of video
regardless of the NTSC
specs.
[/QUOTE]

And how is my Toshiba non HDTV going to interupt a different aspect ratio fed out of Video
out, just as its doing from video out RGB into my HDTV.

greg
 
G

GregS

Jan 1, 1970
0
And how is my Toshiba non HDTV going to interupt a different aspect ratio fed
out of Video
out, just as its doing from video out RGB into my HDTV.

greg

I am guessing my other old Comcast box does not have digital out. Its a digital
Comcast cable box. It picks up SD digital channels and outputs them
to NTSC video out.

SD is really not standard definition, only according to the # of lines
displayed on the Tv and bandwidth. The truth of the matter, compressed
digital looks a lot worse than old analog. Its crap.
It does look better on the cable than what I have seen on Direct TV.
Compression is up.

greg
 
G

GregS

Jan 1, 1970
0
I am guessing my other old Comcast box does not have digital out. Its a digital
Comcast cable box. It picks up SD digital channels and outputs them
to NTSC video out.

SD is really not standard definition, only according to the # of lines
displayed on the Tv and bandwidth. The truth of the matter, compressed
digital looks a lot worse than old analog. Its crap.
It does look better on the cable than what I have seen on Direct TV.
Compression is up.

greg


You cannot see much of any good analog broadcasting these days
cause most of the analog signals are digitally processed into an artifacted
mess.

greg
 
U

UCLAN

Jan 1, 1970
0
I'll leave you alone now. You seem to be conversing with yourself just fine,
although you seem somewhat confused, ill-informed, and incoherent. ;)
 
R

Ron

Jan 1, 1970
0
If I select a digital HDTV channel and try to watch it on an old set,
whats going to happen ?? This is with video in, but how about
antenna in ??

Channel 6 here is crazy, broadcasting analog some days and
broadcasting digital other days-- while broadcasting analog at night--
every night. Geez, it's enough to make somebody really go off the deep
end!

But to answer your question, a digital signal going into an old TV or
VCR tuner gets you either a blank picture-- a nice blue screen if
you're lucky-- or more likely a lot of snow and static; but no picture
whatsoever. You either need a converter box or cable.

Ron
 
You cannot see much of any good analog broadcasting these days
cause most of the analog signals are digitally processed  into an artifacted
mess.

greg

You haven't seen analog broadcasts in over 20 years - since the last
old quad machines were retired. Every broadcast tape machine built
since 1976 uses digital time base correctors. I've worked in broadcast
since '76 and while analog can be outstanding when used by qualified
skilled operators, digital is much more tolerant of idiot operators -
though they can still mess it up but it's harder.

 
G

GregS

Jan 1, 1970
0
Channel 6 here is crazy, broadcasting analog some days and
broadcasting digital other days-- while broadcasting analog at night--
every night. Geez, it's enough to make somebody really go off the deep
end!

But to answer your question, a digital signal going into an old TV or
VCR tuner gets you either a blank picture-- a nice blue screen if
you're lucky-- or more likely a lot of snow and static; but no picture
whatsoever. You either need a converter box or cable.

Thanks for the answer. I guess I just have to hook er up and see.
I know several years ago my brother similar rear projection
set was able to get a much better picture receiving HDTV.

greg
 
W

William R. Walsh

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hi!
VCR tuners won't be able to tune into the new digital
signals?

I'd have to think that the newer DVD/VCR combinations would have ATSC
tuners onboard these days.

As for older VCRs, I've used a converter box with mine and it works
fine. The only thing I've had to watch for is the automatic four hour
power-down on the converter box--but I caught that and turned it off
ahead of time.

William
 
W

William R. Walsh

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hi!
VCRs never mangle tapes?

Keeping them in good repair helps. I only ever had problems with one
tape and one machine...where the tape would tangle reliably at one
precise location on that one VCR. It never had trouble on any others.
Someone records over what you wanted to keep?

Yes, that has happened. And then I Laid Down The Law about blindly
reusing tapes. There hasn't been a repeat instance since that time.
And write protect tabs do help a little...people tend to think if
they've got to go and get some adhesive tape to cover up that little
hole.
You can't find the tape something you want is on?

I have forced myself to label all of my tapes, so I know what they
are. It's been surprisingly successful. (I'm not usually good at these
sorts of "organizational tasks".)
Of course with good housekeeping those can be minimised - but
a PVR does all that for you.

I have never tried a TiVo or similar device--the monthly fee that I
believe is required simply was not worth it to me. I have, however,
worked with various PC-based solutions and all have been far too
complicated or far less reliable than they should have been. The
latest one I tried was SnapStream Media's BeyondTV. It was very cool
in a lot of ways and positively maddening/stupidly designed in others.

So far the VCR lags behind in quality, but it's "good enough" and has
always Just Worked for the task at hand.

William
 
W

William R. Walsh

Jan 1, 1970
0
Something else I just remembered...I set up no less than seven VCRs at
differing locations to record the very end of analog TV.

(I was under the impression that the various stations would do
something interesting, as a sort of "grand finale" or just as a way of
saying goodbye to analog TV broadcasting. None did, most didn't even
bother signing off before they dropped out.)

I re-used older tapes that had been given to me, and the VCRs ranged
from 20 to 5 years old. Then I went to sleep.

Not a single one of them failed to do the job. Somehow I can't help
but think that a bunch of newer-fangled DVRs/PVRs/TiVo devices would
not have done so well.

William
 
Something else I just remembered...I set up no less than seven VCRs at
differing locations to record the very end of analog TV.

(I was under the impression that the various stations would do
something interesting, as a sort of "grand finale" or just as a way of
saying goodbye to analog TV broadcasting. None did, most didn't even
bother signing off before they dropped out.)

I re-used older tapes that had been given to me, and the VCRs ranged
from 20 to 5 years old. Then I went to sleep.

Not a single one of them failed to do the job. Somehow I can't help
but think that a bunch of newer-fangled DVRs/PVRs/TiVo devices would
not have done so well.

William

Having been living with 3 PC based recorders for better than 3 years,
they really aren't too much trouble. The bulk of the errors are
becasue of mistakes on my part. Last years log sheet showed 3 operator
errors for every computer error. At the time I was recording 15 hrs/
week. We haven't watched a rerun in 15 months. Recordings that are
_identical_ to live TV (HD of course) are way better than low res
noisy analog tapes.

 
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