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mp3-encoder device

Discussion in 'Electronic Design' started by Henry Kiefer, Feb 11, 2007.

  1. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    Hi all -

    Does someone know of a small mp3-encoder chip incl. decoding?

    like: ad/da on-chip, small pin-count, spi-interface or such.

    Cannot find one with Google. The MAS3587F is outdated. Seems all other decode-only. Or very high pin-count or DSP soft only.


    I cannot believe there is nothing. Why cannot MAXIM make one - would be the first interesting device of them ;-)

    Is it better to go the SPEEX-way?

    regards -
    Henry
     
  2. linnix

    linnix Guest

    Why don't you make one? It's pretty simple.
    Sample two channels at 192KSPS.
    Do a DCT to reduce the data rate.
    Transmit to PC at 920 Kbaud (via USB).
    Do the rest on the PC.
    Same goes for decoder.
    I'll supply the hardware, if you do the software.
     
  3. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | > Hi all -
    | >
    | > Does someone know of a small mp3-encoder chip incl. decoding?
    | >
    | > like: ad/da on-chip, small pin-count, spi-interface or such.
    | >
    | > Cannot find one with Google. The MAS3587F is outdated. Seems all other decode-only. Or very high pin-count or DSP soft only.
    | >
    | > I cannot believe there is nothing. Why cannot MAXIM make one - would be the first interesting device of them ;-)
    | >
    |
    | Why don't you make one? It's pretty simple.
    | Sample two channels at 192KSPS.
    | Do a DCT to reduce the data rate.
    | Transmit to PC at 920 Kbaud (via USB).
    | Do the rest on the PC.
    | Same goes for decoder.
    | I'll supply the hardware, if you do the software.

    If we can change the roles, may be ;-)

    Annoying there is nothing to find.
    A litte 20-pins chip, please, all your great silicone vendors.

    If nothing helps, I must go the ADPCM-way.
    Is there a solution based on SPEEX?

    - Henry
     
  4. linnix

    linnix Guest

    It's 48 pins SOIC, USB to serial and ARM micro.
    The capabilities are proven, just need software.
     
  5. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | > Annoying there is nothing to find.
    | > A litte 20-pins chip, please, all your great silicone vendors.
    |
    | It's 48 pins SOIC, USB to serial and ARM micro.
    | The capabilities are proven, just need software.

    Hm. You mean one of the ARM microcontrollers like LPC21xx?
    I don't have the time to do serious DSP programming. mp3 is surely not so easy.
    Just looking for hardware and a simple data-stream to control.

    - Henry
     
  6. linnix

    linnix Guest

    Yes, an 50 MHz ARM Cortez.
    Its not that hard either.
    There are existing library for most of it.
    Or just firmware for IP core library.
     
  7. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | > Hm. You mean one of the ARM microcontrollers like LPC21xx?
    |
    | Yes, an 50 MHz ARM Cortez.
    |
    | > I don't have the time to do serious DSP programming. mp3 is surely not so easy.
    |
    | Its not that hard either.
    | There are existing library for most of it.

    Jeah. If you know "how to" there it is always easy.
    If it so easy, why there is nothing googled up?

    - Henry
     
  8. linnix

    linnix Guest

    Because the music industry makes it difficult.
    I can show you how to make it, but i can't make and sell it.
    Encoder devices are covered under DMCA, at least in the US.
     
  9. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | > Jeah. If you know "how to" there it is always easy.
    | > If it so easy, why there is nothing googled up?
    | >
    |
    | Because the music industry makes it difficult.
    | I can show you how to make it, but i can't make and sell it.
    | Encoder devices are covered under DMCA, at least in the US.

    Interesting info.
    But the question stays alive and I see no conflict here with DMCA: Why it seems impossible to google a solution. Maybe for selfmade?

    As far as I know, there is no such stupid regulation thing in the EU. Of course, we have enough others ;-)

    - Henry
     
  10. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | > | > Hm. You mean one of the ARM microcontrollers like LPC21xx?
    | > |
    | > | Yes, an 50 MHz ARM Cortez.
    | > |
    | > | > I don't have the time to do serious DSP programming. mp3 is surely not so easy.
    | > |
    | > | Its not that hard either.
    | > | There are existing library for most of it.
    | >
    | > Jeah. If you know "how to" there it is always easy.
    | > If it so easy, why there is nothing googled up?
    | >
    |
    | Because the music industry makes it difficult.
    | I can show you how to make it, but i can't make and sell it.
    | Encoder devices are covered under DMCA, at least in the US.

    How can I reach you privately? Your email address relays back error 550.

    cheers -
    Henry

    www.ehydra.dyndns.info
     
  11. linnix

    linnix Guest

    You can drop me a note with the contact form at linnix dot com.
    My junk mail volume is huge, so I post from Google with expired email.
    Google never check it so far.
     
  12. If you implement a mp3 encoder commercially, then you will have to talk to
    Fraunhofer I think for the rights, and pay one time licencing, and per piece too, in Europe.
    Clearly you can take a small FPGA, do a picoblaze Linux, and run for example the
    'lame' mp3 soft encoder on it.
    The BGA size maybe 1cm^2, you need memory too.
    For personal use you would be fine with such a Linux system.
     
  13. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | On a sunny day (Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:33:07 +0100) it happened "Henry Kiefer"
    | <45cf8be0$0$27611$-online.net>:
    |
    | >| > Jeah. If you know "how to" there it is always easy.
    | >| > If it so easy, why there is nothing googled up?
    | >| >
    | >|
    | >| Because the music industry makes it difficult.
    | >| I can show you how to make it, but i can't make and sell it.
    | >| Encoder devices are covered under DMCA, at least in the US.
    | >
    | >Interesting info.
    | >But the question stays alive and I see no conflict here with DMCA: Why it seems impossible to google a solution. Maybe for
    | >selfmade?
    | >
    | >As far as I know, there is no such stupid regulation thing in the EU. Of course, we have enough others ;-)
    |
    | If you implement a mp3 encoder commercially, then you will have to talk to
    | Fraunhofer I think for the rights, and pay one time licencing, and per piece too, in Europe.
    | Clearly you can take a small FPGA, do a picoblaze Linux, and run for example the
    | 'lame' mp3 soft encoder on it.
    | The BGA size maybe 1cm^2, you need memory too.
    | For personal use you would be fine with such a Linux system.

    Where can I find the FPGA implementation?

    How long will the Fraunhofer problem lasts? I think mp3 is really old.

    - Henry
     
  14. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | You can drop me a note with the contact form at linnix dot com.
    | My junk mail volume is huge, so I post from Google with expired email.
    | Google never check it so far.

    I sent you an email as wanted.

    - Henry
     
  15. Well, as we discussed in an other thread, there is a learning curve for FPGA,
    and get Linux working on FPGA is a second learning curve, and then to compile
    lame on it and do the IO and connect it to an AD even more.
    So it was a mere theorectical proposition.
    The newsgroup to ask about FPGA is comp.arch.fpga
    This link has a very short paper on implementing mp3 in hardware,
    http://www.celoxica.com/techlib/default.asp?Action=1&CatID=20&CatType=1&OrderBy=2
    It took the team 8 weeks......
    hehe
    It is not a problem, Fraunhofer invented mp3, and actually I was at their site
    today because of the new mp3 surround standard that was 'standardised' today,
    and they have directed licensing to Thompson, http://www.mp3licensing.com/
    These guys are sufficiently agressive to have sued about anybody who made
    an mp3 player IIRC.

    I also think that if you contact Fraunhofer about mp3 IP they may well have it
    ready for you to buy.
     
  16. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | >Where can I find the FPGA implementation?
    |
    | Well, as we discussed in an other thread, there is a learning curve for FPGA,
    | and get Linux working on FPGA is a second learning curve, and then to compile
    | lame on it and do the IO and connect it to an AD even more.
    | So it was a mere theorectical proposition.
    | The newsgroup to ask about FPGA is comp.arch.fpga
    | This link has a very short paper on implementing mp3 in hardware,
    | http://www.celoxica.com/techlib/default.asp?Action=1&CatID=20&CatType=1&OrderBy=2
    | It took the team 8 weeks......
    | hehe

    2 man for 8 weeks. Seems a good value.
    After all that is unreachable for me.

    |
    | >How long will the Fraunhofer problem lasts? I think mp3 is really old.
    |
    | It is not a problem, Fraunhofer invented mp3, and actually I was at their site
    | today because of the new mp3 surround standard that was 'standardised' today,
    | and they have directed licensing to Thompson, http://www.mp3licensing.com/
    | These guys are sufficiently agressive to have sued about anybody who made
    | an mp3 player IIRC.
    |
    | I also think that if you contact Fraunhofer about mp3 IP they may well have it
    | ready for you to buy.

    Nah. Nothing to buy. Seems I must look on patents here.

    regards -
    Henry
     
  17. jasen

    jasen Guest

    Real-time MP3 encoding need something like a 200MHz pentium,
    but worse than that there's a patent on MP3.

    Bye.
    Jasen
     
  18. Henry Kiefer

    Henry Kiefer Guest

    | > Hi all -
    | >
    | > Does someone know of a small mp3-encoder chip incl. decoding?
    | >
    | > I cannot believe there is nothing. Why cannot MAXIM make one
    | > - would be the first interesting device of them ;-)
    |
    | Real-time MP3 encoding need something like a 200MHz pentium,
    | but worse than that there's a patent on MP3.

    Do you know the patent number or expiration date?

    Other codecs more useful?

    - Henry
     
  19. almo

    almo Guest

    What are you trying to achieve with this mp3 encoder? Do you want to
    go from some other media, CD, or wma, aiff, etc., to plain mp3? If
    so, you can do that right on your PC for free (well...), but you can
    only do it real time, i.e., play the song into the line-in of the
    sound card, then save it as an mp3. It won't to a batch conversion,
    but it'll convert any music source into digital, and save it in any
    format, depending on your software. You can use Wavepad. And the
    Sound Blaster card, and probably all of the others, samples at 48Khz,
    which is higher then CD quality, so your mp3 ends up almost lossless,
    except that mp3 is a lossy compression algorithm, however you can
    specify the bit rate for the amount of compression.

    And don't worry about the mp3 patent. That's owned by Napster, and
    it's only used to protect their music (DRM.) So, unless you're going
    into business to rip their music library, then screw Napster.
    Actually, it was Napster that made me figure a way to get songs off of
    an old mp3 player without having to buy a new subscription to thtm,
    because I was using Napster a couple years ago. I didn't want to have
    to pay them again for stuff I already paid for.
     
  20. It's recent enough that nobody should be thinking about what happens
    after the patent expires. Poke around here http://www.mp3licensing.com

    OGG is supposed to be a free alternative, though of course the problem
    is that it's not compatible with MP3s, so if you don't get or put
    something into OGG format in the first place, you'll have to convert
    from MP3s if that's the distribution method, and suffere the losses.

    Some simple searches in obvious places would find useful information.

    Michael
     
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