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LT Spice problem

Discussion in 'Electronic Design' started by [email protected], Jun 2, 2011.

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  1. Guest

    I'm trying to add the models of a couple of N-FETs I use to LTSpice. I'm
    getting a simulation-time error that I can't resolve. Any ideas? Thanks.

    The error:

    |M1: Only a level 9 B3SOI can have 6 nodes

    It thinks I have six terminals on my transistor and only SOI models have that
    many? Looks like only three to me.


    The circuit:

    Version 4
    SHEET 1 880 680
    WIRE 144 -80 16 -80
    WIRE 288 -80 144 -80
    WIRE 16 -32 16 -80
    WIRE 144 0 144 -80
    WIRE 288 16 288 -80
    WIRE 16 80 16 48
    WIRE 288 112 288 80
    WIRE 144 192 144 80
    WIRE 240 192 144 192
    WIRE 144 240 144 192
    WIRE 288 288 288 208
    WIRE 288 288 208 288
    WIRE 288 320 288 288
    WIRE 144 448 144 336
    WIRE 224 448 144 448
    WIRE 288 448 288 400
    WIRE 288 448 224 448
    WIRE 224 496 224 448
    FLAG 224 496 0
    FLAG 16 80 0
    SYMBOL LED 272 16 R0
    SYMATTR InstName D1
    SYMBOL npn 208 240 M0
    SYMATTR InstName Q1
    SYMBOL res 272 304 R0
    WINDOW 0 -7 51 Left 0
    SYMATTR InstName R1
    SYMATTR Value 100
    SYMATTR SpiceLine tol=1 pwr=0.1
    SYMBOL res 128 -16 R0
    SYMATTR InstName R2
    SYMATTR Value 10K
    SYMATTR SpiceLine tol=1 pwr=0.1
    SYMBOL voltage 16 -48 R0
    SYMATTR InstName V1
    SYMBOL DiodesInc\ Models\\DMG1012T 240 112 R0
    SYMATTR InstName M1
    TEXT -18 520 Left 0 !.op


    The model:

    *SYM=POWMOSN
    ..SUBCKT DMG1012T D=10 G=20 S=30
    * TERMINALS: D G S
    M1 1 20 3 3 NMOS L=0.6U W=47.66m
    RD 10 1 220m
    RS 30 3 80m
    CGS 20 3 57p
    EGD 12 0 20 1 1
    VFB 14 0 0
    FFB 20 1 VFB 1
    CGD 13 14 27p
    R1 13 0 1.00
    D1 12 13 DLIM
    DDG 15 14 DCGD
    R2 12 15 1.00
    D2 15 0 DLIM
    DSD 3 10 DSUB
    ..MODEL NMOS NMOS LEVEL=3 U0=500 VMAX=80k
    + ETA=0.1m VTO=0.99 TOX=16.8n NSUB=4.57e16
    ..MODEL DCGD D CJO=27p VJ=80m M=0.320
    ..MODEL DSUB D IS=36.1n N=1.50 RS=21.8m BV=20
    + CJO=14p VJ=0.800 M=0.420
    ..MODEL DLIM D IS=100U
    ..ENDS

    Another model with the same problem:

    ..SUBCKT irlml6402 1 2 3
    **************************************
    * Model Generated by MODPEX *
    *Copyright(c) Symmetry Design Systems*
    * All Rights Reserved *
    * UNPUBLISHED LICENSED SOFTWARE *
    * Contains Proprietary Information *
    * Which is The Property of *
    * SYMMETRY OR ITS LICENSORS *
    *Commercial Use or Resale Restricted *
    * by Symmetry License Agreement *
    **************************************
    * Model generated on Sep 25, 06
    * MODEL FORMAT: SPICE3
    * Symmetry POWER MOS Model (Version 1.0)
    * External Node Designations
    * Node 1 -> Drain
    * Node 2 -> Gate
    * Node 3 -> Source
    M1 9 7 8 8 MM L=100u W=100u
    ..MODEL MM PMOS LEVEL=1 IS=1e-32
    +VTO=-1 LAMBDA=0.0111358 KP=12.788
    +CGSO=5.36099e-06 CGDO=5.54234e-08
    RS 8 3 0.0246704
    D1 1 3 MD
    ..MODEL MD D IS=2.03395e-08 RS=0.0432758 N=1.5 BV=20
    +IBV=0.00025 EG=1 XTI=4 TT=1e-07
    +CJO=1.11974e-10 VJ=0.5 M=0.3 FC=0.5
    RDS 3 1 5e+07
    RD 9 1 0.0001
    RG 2 7 29.2227
    D2 5 4 MD1
    * Default values used in MD1:
    * RS=0 EG=1.11 XTI=3.0 TT=0
    * BV=infinite IBV=1mA
    ..MODEL MD1 D IS=1e-32 N=50
    +CJO=1.68841e-10 VJ=1.50027 M=0.3 FC=1e-08
    D3 5 0 MD2
    * Default values used in MD2:
    * EG=1.11 XTI=3.0 TT=0 CJO=0
    * BV=infinite IBV=1mA
    ..MODEL MD2 D IS=1e-10 N=0.4 RS=3e-06
    RL 5 10 1
    FI2 7 9 VFI2 -1
    VFI2 4 0 0
    EV16 10 0 9 7 1
    CAP 11 10 9.68769e-10
    FI1 7 9 VFI1 -1
    VFI1 11 6 0
    RCAP 6 10 1
    D4 6 0 MD3
    * Default values used in MD3:
    * EG=1.11 XTI=3.0 TT=0 CJO=0
    * RS=0 BV=infinite IBV=1mA
    ..MODEL MD3 D IS=1e-10 N=0.4
    ..ENDS irlml6402
     
  2. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    I don't have your symbol so can't run the subcircuit. But when I use
    just your NMOS model it runs. You have to give V1 a voltage and the LED
    still needs a model as well.

    [...]
     
  3. Joerg

    Joerg Guest


    No, no, the one with the bikini :)
     

  4. Hello krw,

    I don't have your Mosfet-symbol, but I have been able to get it working.

    1. The subcircuit definition was wrong. Below is the corrected line.

    * D=10 G=20 S=30
    ..SUBCKT DMG1012T 10 20 30

    2. Most of th models for power-Mosfets are subcircuits.
    Therefore you can use the normal symbol "nmos" or "pmos" with a very small
    modification.

    Place a symbol "nmos" on the schematic.
    Ctrl-right-mouse-click on the placed symbol.
    A dialog will pop-up. Change Prefix:MN to Prefix:X
    OK.

    The attached example has bias point data flags on the nets
    to better show the operating point.

    Best regards,
    Helmut
     
  5. Guest

    ....and a long-tailed pair?
     
  6. Guest

    It seemed to do something here at home. I didn't have time to look at it
    today. Maybe tomorrow they'll leave me alone so I can get back after it.
     
  7. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    Just use the model alone. Package parasitics don't matter unless the LED
    has to also send out GHz pulses ;-)

    You can enter a ramp for the voltage source, then you can always see
    where it loses steam.
     
  8. Guest

    Thanks, Helmut. I still have something messed up. It can't find the model. I
    should have time to work on it tomorrow.
     
  9. Guest

    Well it is in a GHz field, but I don't think I care about buzz.
    It's not getting that far. I must have something messed up with the
    installation. It can't find anything now.
     
  10. Joerg

    Joerg Guest


    Oh-oh, you crashed LTSpice? I though that wasn't possible. Might have to
    re-install, it is fairly painless. I have to do that once in a while
    because the LTSpice updater doesn't work.
     
  11. Rich Grise

    Rich Grise Guest

    http://mysite.verizon.net/richgrise/images/comptran.gif

    Cheers!
    Rich
     
  12. Guest

    Not crashed, just edited or changed something I shouldn't have, perhaps.
    Really? It wanted to update my home copy but I didn't let it.
     
  13. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    Unless you literally mucked with files in the LTSpice install directory
    it's nearly impossible to break.


    It always freezes up for me but it might be related to security settings.
     
  14. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    Probably related to security settings. But it doesn't matter, this
    software is literally bug-free (unlike others ...) and I only need to
    update if a new must-have feature appear. Then it's rather quick and
    easy. Uninstall, re-install .. get coffee .. hop back into seat.
     
  15. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    Thanks, but I don't want to re-install half of my computer stuff here. I
    get no viruses or any of that and if this is why the LTSpice updater
    doesn't work it's ok. As I said, install by hand is painless. It is so
    fast that I don't even have time to snatch a cookie out of the fridge
    (although I'd like to).
     
  16. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    The computation machine bucks upon clicking "proceed" here, meaning it
    won't continue:

    https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2
     
  17. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    No. It's just very safe :)

    Seriously, yes it will balk at web sites that are overly intrusive but
    those are web sites I am not interested in anyhow. So what's the
    problem? All they can find out is my connection IP and maybe track that
    to find out my preferences. Only to discover that it's gone the next day
    because I turn off the modem at night and it is dynamic IP.

    It's similar when some spammer sends me an email with infested
    attachments -> kersplosh ... gone.

    If someone were interested in watching x-rated stuff on the computer
    they would decidedly not be happy in this here office. Because most
    likely it won't work.
     
  18. My LTspice III updater broke at one time, reinstall fixed it.

    Cheers
     
  19. Joerg

    Joerg Guest

    Hmm, how can that be installed separately? I always did a clean swipe
    and re-installed the whole LTSpice chebang, hoping that this would also
    fix the updater. But it never did.

    It might really be the firewall or something though, in my case.
     
  20. Zonealarm just indicates port 53, which is DNS and Http (80). Might
    want to check your DNS settings.
    Otherwise the Updated can't be installed seperately, a full install is
    needed.

    Cheers
     
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