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Ignition coil driver.

Discussion in 'General Electronics Discussion' started by GamingAddict, Jul 23, 2017.

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  1. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    Hello. I have a question about driving an Ignition coil from a petrol powered car, can i use my ZVS driver to somehow run it ?
     
  2. davenn

    davenn Moderator

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    Sep 5, 2009

    what is that ?
     
    Arouse1973 likes this.
  3. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    this
     
  4. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    [​IMG]
     
  5. kellys_eye

    kellys_eye

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    Jun 25, 2010
    No, you can't use it.

    The primary of a car ignition coil is meant for 12V only - sending the output of the ZVS into it will just cause flash-over in the winding and ruin it.
     
  6. Bluejets

    Bluejets

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    846
    Oct 5, 2014
    A 555 timer and an MJ10012 transistor will work.
     
  7. duke37

    duke37

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    Jan 9, 2011
    You may be able to use it, you do not say what the output voltage is.
    A normal ignition system builds up a current when the points are closed and then when they open a large voltage is generated due to the inductive current. The voltage is defined by the capacitor across the points and is about 300V. Later ignition units use a transistor instead of points for the switch since it doesn't wear out. Mine failed instead!
    I made a capacitor discharge system using an invertor to charge a capacitor to 300V which is discharged through the ignition coil primary by a SCR. This has the advantage that very little power is used when starting and the capacitor can be charged very quickly (if enough power is available) to enable a high rate of spark generation.

    Look up capacitor discharge ignition.
     
  8. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    I can try to build a transformer out of a flyback core that i got, on 1 side 5+5 windings, and on the other side, how much windings give you 15 Volts ( Mine is rated for 15 ). It will be driven at WERY high frequencies tho.
     
  9. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    I could also try to build a HV Power Supply out of a MOT ( Microwave Oven Transformer ) and a voltage multiplier, or the 4 flybacks i got.
     
  10. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017


    He seems to be using a ZVS too, i might actually try what i said
     
  11. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
     
  12. kellys_eye

    kellys_eye

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    Jun 25, 2010
    Any form of oscillator attached to the primary of a car ignition coil should produce an output on the high(er) voltage side.
    The voltage put 'out' will be proportional to the voltage put 'in' multiplied by the turns-ratio of the transformer (coil).
    You are only limited by the breakdown voltage of the wires used to wind the coils and the saturation level of the coil core (magnetic flux density).
    Car ignition coils are (I believe) iron cored so their efficiency will fall off as the switching frequency increases due to aforementioned core losses.
    If you have a particular purpose in mind then please let us know and we can advise more accurately on how you might resolve any difficulties.
     
  13. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    I tried to run it with the ZVS, i dont know how much Amps are going into the Coil, but all i know is that theres going in more than 100V. Im saying more than 100, cause i measured the voltage of the secondary coil on the Flyback core a long time ago, and i dont really remember what it exactly was, but i remember it was over 100V. Ive made the secondary coil on the flyback core from a thin wire, which i dont know the gauge of, but its 1/4 the size of a toothpick ( with its insulation on ). The switching frequency has to be REALLY high, cause when i allow it to arc over, the arc is wery high pitched. I dont have a REAL purpose for it, its only a high voltage Power Supply.
     
  14. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    Also, is there a way i can decrease the switching frequency of the ZVS driver to make the arcs longer ? the mosfets are IRFP250N. If you need the full circuit diagram, it might not be the exactly same one, but its somewhere 'up' in this post.
     
  15. kellys_eye

    kellys_eye

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    Jun 25, 2010
    You won't be putting 'amps' into the ignition coil - the ZVS output is very high voltage but relatively (if still lethal) current. It's the voltage that will cause the 'flash-over' and ruin the ignition coil.

    Also you probably can't measure the output of that ZVS, certainly using 'normal' meters. It's high frequency is beyond most average test equipment and an oscilloscope would usually be required - even then they don't like such high voltage directly into them!

    You could build an h.f. rectifier/smoothing arrangement and measure the DC from that......

    You are messing with stuff that, as mentioned, could prove fatal and you seem to be doing so with little knowledge or regard of precisely WHAT you're doing.

    As a result I'm not prepared to divulge any details of how to adapt that circuit for any reason whatsoever.....
     
  16. GamingAddict

    GamingAddict

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    Apr 26, 2017
    Sorry if im starting to get a little bit rude, but seems like you still dont understand that im using a flyback core in combination with a ZVS to run the coil, not only ZVS...

    I know that its wery high quality art, cause all i got is Paint, but here is my 'schematic', i know that i havent included the spark gap, but you may already know that i have one.
    [​IMG]

    And i HAVE only a flyback CORE, not an entire flyback transformer.
     
  17. kellys_eye

    kellys_eye

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    Jun 25, 2010
    Your image shows the flyback core with 5+5 turns on the primary and 'lots of turns' on the secondary. That's a flyback transformer.

    That arrangement in itself is capable of potentially fatal voltages and you're applying it to yet another coil with even more turns-ratio.....

    You have no means of measuring let alone calculating the output other than demonstrating the result via a spark gap! I have over 40 years of electronics experience and even I would be extremely cautious around such a set up - and I know what I'm doing!

    As much as I would normally encourage experimentation this is not at the expense of personal safety and a lack of basic knowledge. If you can demonstrate that you are conversant with amps, volts and their effect on the human body then I may reconsider. Your previous statements tell me that you don't understand the basics.

    Continue if you must but I'm sorry that I won't be adding any further information.
     
  18. duke37

    duke37

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    Jan 9, 2011
    I do not know what you mean by a flyback core. Perhaps it is the core from a line output transformer. If so, it will be made from ferrite and suitable for high frequencies. You are then feeding into a car ignition coil which is relatively a low frequency device. The ignition coil has a laminated iron core so will absorb a lot of power at high frequencies due to Eddy currents.

    I suggest that you dispense with the car coil and use a Line OutPut Transformer complete with the high voltage output winding which will be suitable for up to 10kV or so.
    The oscillator can also be run on this core, eliminating another souce of mismatch and power loss.

    Invertors that I have made using a LOPT core, were wound with 1t/V bifilar wire and about 20kHz. I have not used the secondary, just wound my own to get 400V or so. The turns ratio will be the square root of the inductance ratio so you can find the turns of the secondary without unwinding it.
     
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