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How is building bombs related to this group?

Discussion in 'Electronic Basics' started by Chesucat, Oct 1, 2003.

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  1. Chesucat

    Chesucat Guest

    What does bomb creations have to do with basic electronics, aside from the obvious
    need for a timer or RF-controlled detonation device? I do know there were "electronic
    engineers" at Los Alamos in the 1950's, but I bombs are mostly chemical things! There
    are some innovative devices for bombs, like placing a bomb on a collar and the placing
    the collar around the neck. That really was quite clever to think of, eliminate the
    witness type of thing. But the collar was not home made, it look the type of collar
    that they put on livestock to temporary hold them?

    chesucat
     
  2. It isn't.
    If you had read the replies, I don't think many people do think it is
    relevant. It's probably just some idiot trying to get attention. (This is
    assuming you were talking about a recent post titled "building a bomb", from
    'Tom R. Rastell'

    Andrew Howard
     
  3. He might be talking about some of the bad circuit ideas that crop up
    all the time! ;-)
     
  4. John Fortier

    John Fortier Guest

    The "How do I build a bomb" thread was popular simply because it was so
    ridiculous. Anyone who comes out and asks a newsgroup how to build a bomb is
    pretty obviously not a threat, and it gave us the opportunity to provide the
    derision that the post so obviously deserved - a very human reaction.

    I enjoyed it and I particularly hope that the poster took my advice about
    holding the capacitor in his mouth while connecting it to the mains.

    To take it in any way seriously would have been the wrong reaction. Mind
    you, if he was posting from within the US, Homeland Security may not take
    such a lenient attitude!

    John
     
  5. Think it was probably a poor attempt at trolling.

    The book references I gave are in part the argument against people claiming
    that the internet is a home for nutters looking to build bombs, their local
    library has been providing them this service long before the internet.

    Explosives are a good way to get young people interested in science in
    general, manufacturing even basic explosives is non trivial and knowing how
    it is done, is far different from being capable of doing it.
    There are pyrotechnic news groups for those who wish to pursue an interest.

    So no kewl gunz `n` bombz here.

    Adam
     
  6. The fact is, learning a clever or flashy trick is often what drives a kid
    into learning about something. From there, the feeling of accomplishment then
    often gets them to learn more about the subject.
    I really doubt that some 8 year old says to him/herself, "Gee, I wish I
    understood how the chrome plating was put on that hydraulic ram. That would be
    a cool trick to show my friends!" Or "I sure would like to make the machines
    that insert the springs inside ball point pens! That would be real cool!"
    Things that assault our senses draw interest. Things that produce an
    eye-catching effect or weird sound will draw us. Stink bombs are another
    example- making something innocuous looking that smells so bad it can take the
    lining out of the nasal cavities and cause wild animals to flee in terror...
    kids like stuff that goes fast, makes a flash and a bang, sounds loud or neat,
    or smells read bad.
    Along those lines, explosives are a constant draw for many kids who often
    enough become fascinated with the finer points of the skills they learn, to
    eventually become useful members of society.

    Cheers!

    Chip Shults
    My robotics, space and CGI web page - http://home.cfl.rr.com/aichip
     
  7. I blew them up!
     
  8. Baphomet

    Baphomet Guest

    Explosives are a good way to get young people interested in science in
    So much for our educational system if making explosives is considered a good
    way (or perhaps the only way) to get young people interested in science.
     
  9. John Fields

    John Fields Guest

    ---
    Our educational system has very little to do with it, I think, since (in
    the early years _for sure_ they pretty much tend to pretend that
    explosives don't exist. When I was a kid I was attracted to explosives
    because they were exciting and dangerous and it was thrilling to be able
    to make things that actually blew up or made different colored flames,
    or could melt steel, and all that kind of stuff.

    Matter of fact, I had a Gilbert chemistry set with the "good stuff" in
    it; Potassion Nitrate, Strontium Nitrate, Potassium Permanganate and its
    friend Glycerine, Magnesium filings and ribbon, Sulfur, charcoal, a nice
    little mortar and pestle and an instruction manual with PLENTY of
    warnings.

    Take a look at the pussy chemistry sets they have now and you're lucky
    to get Boric acid, so that's not going to attract too many kids.
     
  10. Baphomet

    Baphomet Guest

    What happened to erector sets, tinker toys and model trains. These are the
    things (as well as many others) that first stimulated my interest in things
    technical.
     
  11. Baphomet

    Baphomet Guest

    What happened to erector sets, tinker toys and model trains. These are the
    Hmmm....Now that I think of it, I did deliberately crash trains head on
    several times more than once. :)
     
  12. Terry

    Terry Guest

    Thanks for the memory John:
    Gosh. I remember those type of Chemistry Sets. What a stink I
    used to make with 'Flowers of sulphur'!
    Later spent over 40 years in radio/telecommunications/electronics
    work! Still dabble.
    Terry.
     
  13. Chesucat

    Chesucat Guest

    Terry wrote:
    T>
    T>Thanks for the memory John:
    T>Gosh. I remember those type of Chemistry Sets. What a stink I
    T>used to make with 'Flowers of sulphur'!
    T>Later spent over 40 years in radio/telecommunications/electronics
    T>work! Still dabble.
    T>Terry.

    I was never interested in chemistry when I growing up! However, I was fascinated with
    thermite and the intense heat it emitted. Just a little bit of iron ore and magnesium
    shavings mix together and ignited. That would melt just about anything! Yep!

    chesucat
     
  14. John Fortier

    John Fortier Guest

    When I was a young idiot, well, nerd would be a better word, but nobody had
    heard of nerds back then in 19 her humm, a friend of mine and I took up
    rocket building. We were also into grinding our own mirrors for Cassgrain
    Telescopes, but the rockets were a lot more dynamic, either vertically or,
    all too often, horizontally!

    We lived in Ontario, on the north shore of Lake Ontario, and our final
    effort was a six foot job, fuelled by a mixture of sublimated sulfur and
    powdered aluminum, chemically sintered using alchahol. For reasons known
    only to 16 year olds, we decided that the safest place to fire it was south
    into the lake.

    It worked beautifully, went up until we lost sight of it and, presumably,
    fell somewhere in the lake or, if it worked as well as it seemed, in New
    York State, where I presently live. (If I ever find a long aluminum tube in
    my garden, with a ceramic nozzle at one end and a lamp shade at the other,
    I'll know where it came from.)

    We were just packing up and putting our launch rail into the back of Ron's
    dad's pickup, (which we had "borrowed") when the RCMP. the OPP and the RCAF
    all turned up. Our rocket had set off a major NORAD alert!

    Up to that time I didn't really know what the expression "deep shit" really
    meant, but I sure found out over the next few hours. We were so grounded I
    still sometimes wonder if I'm allowed out of the house!

    What is this all leading up to. Well, there are ways to get interested in
    science and there are other ways to get interested in science. Building
    bombs and killer rockets are not good ways to get interested. People get
    hurt. The builders blow their hands off, and get very little sympathy. We
    were lucky, we managed to put together a working rocket, and survived to
    tell the tale, but we could so easily have blown our fool heads off and
    those of anyone else who happened to be nearby at the time.

    So, please, Adam, don't encourage anyone to experiment with pyrotechnics.
    Unless the experimenter is a part of a group which actually knows what it's
    doing, and by group I don't mean Hammas or their ilk, then they will be a
    menace to themselves and everyone around them. If they are building a bomb
    with the intent to do harm with it, such encouragement borders on the
    criminal.

    So the answer to "I'm building a bomb, what do I need?" is either "A
    different hobby." or "Psychiatric help."

    John
     
  15. John Fortier

    John Fortier Guest

    It's not often I agree with John Fields, but this time he's right. Kids
    these days are far too protected. See my past earlier in this thread, and
    don't think I am encouraging the building of amateur bombs, but the pendulum
    has swung for to far the other way. Chemistry sets you can't do anything
    with because they are safe above all else won't interest any kid in
    chemistry or science in general.

    Hey, John, isn't it amazing what you can do with potassium nitrate and icing
    sugar!

    John
     
  16. John Fortier

    John Fortier Guest

    Sounds like we were all lucky to survive to adulthood!
     
  17. The reference books in the school library had all the formulas and
    instructions to make black powder, and nitroglycerine. Two of my friends
    and I would make 20 pounds of black powder at a time, then we made our
    own firecrackers.

    We found a great use for empty 2 ounce glass bottles from our
    chemistry sets. A nail hole in the lid, a 30 second fuse, and you could
    glass blast the rust off lots of old junk. They were good for cleaning
    the trash out of a culvert under the driveway, too.
     
  18. What does bomb creations have to do with basic electronics, aside from
    My friends and I also tried to build rockts. The highest one ever went was
    about three or four feet before it blew up. We did lots of experiments, but
    pretty soon got tired of our rockets blowing up so we just made bombs
    instead. We did this until my friend got hurt, when we broke a rule and
    used a trail of match heads on a windy day instead of electrical ignition.
    That was the last bomb.

    I have been half hoping my own children would get interested in it, so I
    could keep them safe instead of making them hide. Alas, the Gamecube seems
    much more exciting to them. Just as well.

    But the OP asked a what might be a little bit of a snarky question, but
    it's a good one when turned around. Why do people interested in electronics
    also seem interested in blowing things up? I don't speak for everyone here,
    obviously, but plenty of you share my own general childhood experiences. If
    we could find out what personality traits are to be cultivated, maybe we can
    start producing some precocious techies.

    As for me, I think I set off bombs because I like to set a system in
    motion and watch it progress. I like to give my creations some degree of
    autonomy. Who's going to stop a bomb from doing what it wants to do once it
    gets going? :)

    - Owen -
    P.S. Good job!
     
  19. Strange thing about pyro is it is actually hard to make a successful item.
    Lack of proper ingredients or slack procedure more often than not will
    result in something that will not even burn, never mind explode.
    Indeed the way to learn about such things with the help and supervision of a
    peer group, the determined reader was given pointers towards groups that may
    offer assistance.
    To be honest I am more disturbed about the muttering of people about
    Homeland Security in the U.S..Think Benjamin Franklin is generally
    attributed the quote about those who would sacrifice freedom for security
    deserving neither.

    The original poster in the original thread was what has turned out to be a
    reasonably succesful troll.But his method was somewhat similar to running
    into a room full of adults and shouting "knickers!"

    The knowledge of how explosives are made is not the same as being able to
    make explosives.In the U.S. thanks to your constitution you have protected
    free speech, part of this is people`s right to publish books on homemade
    explosives, deadly toxins , homemade automatic weapons etc.Again being aware
    of how these things are made is very differnt from being able to replicate
    results.
    a degree in chemistry or several years of lab experience would probably
    help.

    Adam
     
  20. Baphomet

    Baphomet Guest

    Great post John
     
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