How compact fluorescents may affect your electronics

[mm]

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cach...6&lr=lang_en|lang_iw|lang_es&client=firefox-a

....
Neither company had any idea what was causing the problem, although
each assured me it couldn't possibly be their units. Three cable boxes
and two remotes later the problem still persisted. In a typical
incident, the cable box, apparently unhappy with the movie we were
watching, started jumping randomly from channel to channel; the remote
control had no affect on it at all.

It can't be all three boxes, I mused. Something must be interfering
with the remote's signal to the box. Or maybe it's the signal from the
cable. Everything seemed to work fine during the day, but not in the
morning or evening. What was different? Feeling a bit foolish I turned
off all the lights. To my delight, the remote worked again. Turning
the lights on one at a time narrowed the problem down to the new
energy saving fluorescent lights we had installed several months back,
in midsummer, when we weren't watching much TV.

Apparently, the new fluorescents produced a broader spectrum of light
than the standard incandescent bulbs they replaced. They seemed to be
producing an infrared signal that blinded our cable box and
occasionally mimicked the remote control's signals.

Energy efficient fluorescent lights are manufactured by many
companies. I contacted several of the leading manufacturers and all
acknowledged the problem. Though it is widespread, fluorescent light
interference with remotes is so intermittent and unpredictable that
nobody I spoke with could indicate how many homes might be affected.

"Yes, we have had some complaints," Scott Mack, a spokesman for
Philips Lighting told me. Don Lowry, Director of Engineering for
Matsushita Electronics (parent of Panasonic, Quasar, Technics) also
acknowledged that, "We have had some problems." However, Lowry added
that Matsushita feels "we have the problem well in hand in our product
line," and is working to help define standards for the industry.

Compared with the energy savings fluorescent lights can yield, remote
control interference "is a minor inconvenience,"** Mack asserted. His

best advice was to move the lamp to a different electrical circuit
and make sure it was at least ten feet away from any equipment. When I
pointed out the impracticality of his solution, he assured me the
problem is being worked on, and Philips hoped to have a solution soon.
....

Unlike most webpages, this one actually has evidence of the date,
1994. !!! I don't even remember there being CF?s back then. In fact
I don't remember the whole year. So maybe this isn't a problem
anymore. Does anyone know?

It's a darn good thing he gave a date, or I'd be thinking it was in
the last year or two, the only time I've pondered cf?s.



**==> I'm as cheap as anyone, but paying extra for electricity is only
money, it's no inconcvenience. But having the station change when
someone is in the middle of an imprtant sentence can be an enormous
inconvience. I've been watching tv through a different VCR lately,
using the tuner, and it turns off after an hour for no apparent
reason. It gives about 15 seconds warning, and I'm usually in another
room.

 

[James Sweet]

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cach...6&lr=lang_en|lang_iw|lang_es&client=firefox-a

...
Neither company had any idea what was causing the problem, although
each assured me it couldn't possibly be their units. Three cable boxes
and two remotes later the problem still persisted. In a typical
incident, the cable box, apparently unhappy with the movie we were
watching, started jumping randomly from channel to channel; the remote
control had no affect on it at all.

It can't be all three boxes, I mused. Something must be interfering
with the remote's signal to the box. Or maybe it's the signal from the
cable. Everything seemed to work fine during the day, but not in the
morning or evening. What was different? Feeling a bit foolish I turned
off all the lights. To my delight, the remote worked again. Turning
the lights on one at a time narrowed the problem down to the new
energy saving fluorescent lights we had installed several months back,
in midsummer, when we weren't watching much TV.

Apparently, the new fluorescents produced a broader spectrum of light
than the standard incandescent bulbs they replaced. They seemed to be
producing an infrared signal that blinded our cable box and
occasionally mimicked the remote control's signals.

Energy efficient fluorescent lights are manufactured by many
companies. I contacted several of the leading manufacturers and all
acknowledged the problem. Though it is widespread, fluorescent light
interference with remotes is so intermittent and unpredictable that
nobody I spoke with could indicate how many homes might be affected.

"Yes, we have had some complaints," Scott Mack, a spokesman for
Philips Lighting told me. Don Lowry, Director of Engineering for
Matsushita Electronics (parent of Panasonic, Quasar, Technics) also
acknowledged that, "We have had some problems." However, Lowry added
that Matsushita feels "we have the problem well in hand in our product
line," and is working to help define standards for the industry.

Compared with the energy savings fluorescent lights can yield, remote
control interference "is a minor inconvenience,"** Mack asserted. His

best advice was to move the lamp to a different electrical circuit
and make sure it was at least ten feet away from any equipment. When I
pointed out the impracticality of his solution, he assured me the
problem is being worked on, and Philips hoped to have a solution soon.
...

Unlike most webpages, this one actually has evidence of the date,
1994. !!! I don't even remember there being CF?s back then. In fact
I don't remember the whole year. So maybe this isn't a problem
anymore. Does anyone know?

It's a darn good thing he gave a date, or I'd be thinking it was in
the last year or two, the only time I've pondered cf?s.



**==> I'm as cheap as anyone, but paying extra for electricity is only
money, it's no inconcvenience. But having the station change when
someone is in the middle of an imprtant sentence can be an enormous
inconvience. I've been watching tv through a different VCR lately,
using the tuner, and it turns off after an hour for no apparent
reason. It gives about 15 seconds warning, and I'm usually in another
room.

It isn't the spectrum, it's the high frequency flickering. This has been
a known issue for years, I personally don't experience any difficulties
but some more poorly designed equipment may, especially older stuff made
before CFLs were common. A different brand of CFL may also solve the
problem as the ballast may run at a different frequency.

 

[default]

**==> I'm as cheap as anyone, but paying extra for electricity is only
money, it's no inconcvenience. But having the station change when
someone is in the middle of an imprtant sentence can be an enormous
inconvience. I've been watching tv through a different VCR lately,
using the tuner, and it turns off after an hour for no apparent
reason. It gives about 15 seconds warning, and I'm usually in another
room.

That was more of a problem in early compacts and early electronics.
Both manufacturers of lights and electronics are cognizant of this and
working to resolve the problems. In the meantime, you can often just
shield the receiving sensor from direct light and eliminate the
problem.

Compact fluorescent's are pretty good, but they are not "broad
spectrum." Use a compact disc as a diffraction grating and look at
the spectrum from the lamps versus incandescent lamps and sunlight if
you don't believe it.

 

[James Sweet]

Compact fluorescent's are pretty good, but they are not "broad
spectrum." Use a compact disc as a diffraction grating and look at
the spectrum from the lamps versus incandescent lamps and sunlight if
you don't believe it.

Modern ones use a trichromatic phosphor, which is a blend of red, green
and blue emitting phosphors in the correct proportions to produce the
desired color temperature. Some fluorescents are much more of a broad
spectrum source but the halophosphate phosphors are less able to hold up
to the high power density of the compact lamps.

 

[[email protected]]

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cach...6&lr=lang_en|lang_iw|lang_es&client=firefox-a

...
Neither company had any idea what was causing the problem, although
each assured me it couldn't possibly be their units. Three cable boxes
and two remotes later the problem still persisted. In a typical
incident, the cable box, apparently unhappy with the movie we were
watching, started jumping randomly from channel to channel; the remote
control had no affect on it at all.

It can't be all three boxes, I mused. Something must be interfering
with the remote's signal to the box. Or maybe it's the signal from the
cable. Everything seemed to work fine during the day, but not in the
morning or evening. What was different? Feeling a bit foolish I turned
off all the lights. To my delight, the remote worked again. Turning
the lights on one at a time narrowed the problem down to the new
energy saving fluorescent lights we had installed several months back,
in midsummer, when we weren't watching much TV.

Apparently, the new fluorescents produced a broader spectrum of light
than the standard incandescent bulbs they replaced. They seemed to be
producing an infrared signal that blinded our cable box and
occasionally mimicked the remote control's signals.

Energy efficient fluorescent lights are manufactured by many
companies. I contacted several of the leading manufacturers and all
acknowledged the problem. Though it is widespread, fluorescent light
interference with remotes is so intermittent and unpredictable that
nobody I spoke with could indicate how many homes might be affected.

"Yes, we have had some complaints," Scott Mack, a spokesman for
Philips Lighting told me. Don Lowry, Director of Engineering for
Matsushita Electronics (parent of Panasonic, Quasar, Technics) also
acknowledged that, "We have had some problems." However, Lowry added
that Matsushita feels "we have the problem well in hand in our product
line," and is working to help define standards for the industry.

Compared with the energy savings fluorescent lights can yield, remote
control interference "is a minor inconvenience,"** Mack asserted. His

best advice was to move the lamp to a different electrical circuit
and make sure it was at least ten feet away from any equipment. When I
pointed out the impracticality of his solution, he assured me the
problem is being worked on, and Philips hoped to have a solution soon.
...

Unlike most webpages, this one actually has evidence of the date,
1994. !!! I don't even remember there being CF?s back then. In fact
I don't remember the whole year. So maybe this isn't a problem
anymore. Does anyone know?

It's a darn good thing he gave a date, or I'd be thinking it was in
the last year or two, the only time I've pondered cf?s.



**==> I'm as cheap as anyone, but paying extra for electricity is only
money, it's no inconcvenience. But having the station change when
someone is in the middle of an imprtant sentence can be an enormous
inconvience. I've been watching tv through a different VCR lately,
using the tuner, and it turns off after an hour for no apparent
reason. It gives about 15 seconds warning, and I'm usually in another
room.

It might have been true 15 years ago when CFLs weighted a pound each
and used low frequency magnetic ballasts, but today its just not a
problem.


NT

 

[Mike]

i got a budweiser neon sign that screws the hell out of my satellite
receiver and TV. i got to have the remote right up at the device to control
it. so that thing emits infrared like crazy then.

turn the sign off, all is fine.

 

[mm]

i got a budweiser neon sign that screws the hell out of my satellite
receiver and TV.

Does it at least receive Busdweiser when it won't get the remote
right?

Anyhow, as I said in the next post, which I'm afraid someone might
have missed, I'm sorry. This was never about COMPACT fluorescents,
just about fluorescents. They mentioned traditional and
non-traditional, and I was thinking in this year's mode of thinking.
Even when I saw the date, 1994, it didn't make me figure things out as
I should have. Thank goodness they had the date on the webpage or I'd
still be confuse.

 

[Yukio YANO]

It can't be all three boxes, I mused. Something must be interfering

I spent a winter in Arizona, traveling in a large Motor Home !!

When the 12Volt DC. Fluorescent Lights were On, The TV remote
controllers were blocked !!! unless the Remote Control Receivers'
Sensors were shaded from the light from the Fluorescent Tubes.

A few moments of analysis concluded that the ~15KC modulation of the
remote controllers were probably overwhelmed by the ~15KC Modulation of
the Fluorescent Tubes being driven by the 12Volt DC. Ballasts ! Just
shading the R/C Sensors from the direct output of the Fluorescent Tubes
solved the immediate problems. I presume that this is the nature of the
Beast that you are attempting to describe. I made no attempt to measure
the frequencies involved, since the Sunshades solved most of the
problems. It wouldn't take much effort to hook up a Scope to measure the
frequency of the R/C, the 12Volt Ballast operated Fluorescent Lamps
would be a little more difficult due to the distances involved !

Yukio YANO
VE5YS

 

[Don Klipstein]

Compact fluorescent's are pretty good, but they are not "broad
spectrum." Use a compact disc as a diffraction grating and look at
the spectrum from the lamps versus incandescent lamps and sunlight if
you don't believe it.

I have serious doubts of need of "broad spectrum". I surely consider
"good enough" high color rendering index as well as stimulating all known
and suspected photoreceptors in human eyes in ratio roughly similar to
that of the "desired broad spectrum light sources", and that is easily
enough achieved with a spiky spectrum. Color and appearance of the light
and rated color rendering index are good indicators of these issues.

- Don Klipstein ([email protected])

 

[Eeyore]

This was never about COMPACT fluorescents

Really ? I thought it was.

Never had any such trouble myself with them though.

Graham

 

[Don Klipstein]

Really ? I thought it was.

Never had any such trouble myself with them though.

Graham

The issue is mostly with fluorescents powered by electronic ballasts.
In home use, this is mostly with compact ones.

However, I do believe that in the past several years the more reputable
manufacturers have been taking this issue into account and making their
integral-electronic-ballast CFLs non-problematic in this area!

- Don Klipstein ([email protected])

 

[Eeyore]

The issue is mostly with fluorescents powered by electronic ballasts.
In home use, this is mostly with compact ones.

Indeed. I've been using these extensively for many years.

However, I do believe that in the past several years the more reputable
manufacturers have been taking this issue into account and making their
integral-electronic-ballast CFLs non-problematic in this area!

Sounds sensible.

Graham