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Help with design + RFID

Discussion in 'Electronic Design' started by [email protected], Aug 5, 2007.

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  1. Guest

    For a design course in our third year of EE - we were hoping to make a
    system that reads a value from a passive RFID chip - and returns that
    value to our transmitting system. We can't design the entire RFID
    portion - so we were looking at purchasing the chip and programming
    our own binary id into it. How would we do so? Where can we find
    information/resources? Is it a viable project that can be done in 10
    weeks? Thanks in advance.
  2. Guest

    Is there any design tips? I'm sure we can't design the entire RF
    portion - so we were looking into getting a kit - but what kind of kit
    can we use that will sense an RFID in a 20m radius and send the value
    stored on the chip and send that value to another circuit we have?

    I'm thinking we'll be using alot of microelectronic design / embedded

    any more help?
  3. Gary Tait

    Gary Tait Guest

    wrote in
    Search for programmable RFID chips.

    Then find RFID tags that use those chips, and the reader/programmer system
    used for them.
  4. ck

    ck Guest

    I think you're being optimistic if you think you can read a passive RFID tag
    within a 20m radius.
  5. Jim Thompson

    Jim Thompson Guest

    Indeed! The poster falls into the "dreamer" category.

    ...Jim Thompson
  6. Donald

    Donald Guest

    I think he stated that he (they) are young engineers.

    Practical matters sometimes get in the way of a "good" design.

    Experience and testing are missing in an 12 week class.


    At least he admitted they are students.
  7. Guest

    If we were to design a prototype with a range of a 1 - 1.5 meters -
    would passive RFID still be viable. Also - where can we get help with
    designing circuits with RFID modules?

    Again we're third ELECTRICAL ENGINEERING students with no prior of
    knowledge of RFID.
  8. Donald

    Donald Guest

  9. Donald

    Donald Guest

    For third years students, you still need to learn to do your own
    research and testing.

    Passive RFID is only good for an inch or two.

    On a good day.

    If your lucky.

    If your antenna is as large as a door.

    Good luck

  10. What is asking an honest question on a newsgroup if not research? And they
    didn't ask you for a circuit diagram, just a feel for if they are even in
    the ballpark. Nor did they ask you for a working circuit; evidently they
    will build and test, but it is no good building and testing if it is
    theoretically impossible to do the job.

    THen what is the method used on automobiles and trucks to let them go
    through the tollbooth on the bridge at 40 miles an hour or so with the
    prepaid card stuck to the vehicle? This is not a leading question. I don't
    know what the method is, but it sure as little green apples isn't an inch or
    two. Gotta be a few feet at least.

    So if you know of a method to achieve their goals, why not tell them (and
    the rest of us) rather than say why another method WON'T work?

  11. Gary Tait

    Gary Tait Guest

    wrote in
    My understanding is the RFID trasnciever "modules" simply output RS232
    That is fairly easy to trasnport and to a central computer.

    You simply need an array of them to cover a larger area.
  12. Iwo Mergler

    Iwo Mergler Guest

    Passive RFID tags tend to have a range similar to
    the size of the antennas. 20m is not realistic.

    The longest range passive RFID technology on the
    market is probably the ISO 15693 cards (check out
    Skidata for an application). They work at a range
    of 0.5-1.5m, with an antenna diameter of about
    0.5m on the reader.

    The tags are credit-card size, with the antenna
    coil along the edge.

    To achieve the range you're talking about, look
    into active tags. they need a battery, but can
    achieve the 20m range and more.

    Kind regards,

  13. Jim,
    Those tags aren't passive. They contain a battery and a detector that,
    when they are in the illuminated field, switch a dipole attenna in and
    out of resonance to change the reflection of the incoming RF.

  14. Guest

    I'd like to thank everybody for their help. As this is our first time
    doing a design course as broad as this we started throwing ideas out
    on the internet before doing much real research. With 2 weeks of
    research - we have gone through several books including RFID primers,
    and the IBM sourcebook on RFID.

    Thanks a tonne for the suggestion lwo - for the ISO 15693 RFID cards.
    The range is perfect and the readers are affordable for our design

    We are more geared to using passive RFID as we'll need several and
    powering them on a broader scope would go against our design outcomes.
    - Also the RFID is a small portion of the project and we are thus only
    interested in receiving a digital input from the RFID - in conjunction
    with a manual input by the user.

    Thanks for all the help.

    Right now our only issue is dealing with

    1) programming an 8 bit binary number into the RFID ISO 15693 - i'll
    consult the faculty if they have the hardware to do this.
    2) interpreting the signal from the RFID Module and sending it to our
    comparator circuit.

    Does anyone have any technical RF module design book suggestions?
    We're down to 12 weeks to get the design done.

    Thanks again for all the help.
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