HELP: New EE Grad doing Minimum-Wage Jobs.Good Idea to Wait for economy to recover ???

[Jack Steed]

Hi,

I'm a new EE Bachelor. I've been looking for EE jobs
ever since I graduated. But to no avail, I've not been able
to find a EE job, at least in North America, that does NOT
require at least 2 years of Professional/Industrial experience.

So I thought, I'd take on a Minimum-Wage Job for now (and review my
Undergrad Material(Digital, Analog, etc...), and wait for the economy to
recover.

My questions is:

1. 2 Years from now, Assume the economy recovers, would the employers be
considerate enough to understand why I have not had any industrial
experience after I graduated 2 years ago, and consider me for
interviews and only ask for solid undergrad fundamentals as job
requirements (for entry positions of course)?

or

would the employers consider me OBSOLETE, solely based on the fact that
I've not had any industrial experience since I graduated 2 years ago
(recession or not), and TOTALLY IGNORE ANY POSSIBILITY that I might've
been reviewing the Undergrad Material(Digital, Analog, etc...) for the
past 2 years (considering this will probabbly make me just as good(or
even better) as ANY NEW/FRESH EE GRAD) ?

I'd really appreciate any comments/answers

thanks alot

 

[Charles Perry]

Any work experience is better than no work experience.

Charles Perry P.E.

 

[Travis Hayes]

Take classes towards MS and can claim still in school.

Well, you've gotta do what you've gotta do. A minimum wage job will at
least put a roof over your head and keep food on the table while you are
looking. A word to those who may be following this group and are still
working on your degree: don't wait until you have graduated to start looking
for a job; it ain't always easy, no matter what the career center on campus
says (and as Jack's experience has shown).
I've spent the last 1.5 years finishing up a masters in EE; with 3 years
of experience under my belt I will be looking for another "real" job this
next summer. When I was finishing my BS degree, I was thinking about a
masters, but I was really burned out on school and needed to find some
direction: EE is such a diverse field, how was I to know what to focus on in
graduate school?
The masters is a good idea if it is feasible in your circumstances. If
you can't think of anything that you want to study on a graduate level right
now, maybe you would be interested in working towards an MBA or taking some
physics or CS classes. Your milage may vary; I don't have the money right
now to be able to afford taking classes just for fun; if I weren't working
towards a definate goal in the form of a degree, I would drop out of
graduate school tomorrow.
As for finding a job; I just don't believe that there are no EE jobs "in
North America". Yes, the economy is not what it was back in 2000 when I was
shopping for my first professional job, but there are jobs around, even for
a recent grad such as yourself. I mean no disrespect, but what exactly is
the problem? How long have you been looking? Is it finding companies,
getting interviews from those companies, or having interviews but no offers
coming from them? Or is it really as bad as all that, and I am in the dark
here? Maybe if you gave us some idea where the bottleneck is some people
here with much more experience than us can pitch in with some ideas.

Good luck,

Travis

 

[Garrett Mace]

As for finding a job; I just don't believe that there are no EE jobs
"in

North America". Yes, the economy is not what it was back in 2000 when I was
shopping for my first professional job, but there are jobs around, even for
a recent grad such as yourself. I mean no disrespect, but what exactly is
the problem? How long have you been looking? Is it finding companies,
getting interviews from those companies, or having interviews but no offers
coming from them? Or is it really as bad as all that, and I am in the dark
here? Maybe if you gave us some idea where the bottleneck is some people
here with much more experience than us can pitch in with some ideas.

Good luck,

Travis

I'm in pretty much the same boat that he is. Graduated in 2002, have been
looking since before 2001. Fortunately I knew some people and currently have
a temp (not contract) job doing mostly mechanical engineering and
purchasing. It is, I think, better than nothing, but I too am extremely
worried that when the economy turns around I'll be obsolete. So I've been
doing work on my own projects, buying an FPGA dev board and trying to get
the VHDL experience I didn't get in school, etc. Yet when an employer looks
at my resume, I have no professional EE experience.

It really is "as bad as all that" right now. True, electrical engineering
jobs do exist. But there are also many experienced engineers competing for
work with wet-behind-the-ears graduates. Skill and experience requirements
have skyrocketed for the same position, because HR knows that they can get
it. You can't blame them; they get an experienced professional for the price
of a recent graduate.

But that's going to become a problem in a few years. What happens to all the
new graduates who couldn't find jobs, and went into landscaping or
construction or sales? Skills do not improve when they are not used.
Companies are eager to hire all the experienced employees, but at the same
time they are not willing to create experienced employees for ten years down
the road. Very short-sighted. The pros will cash in retirement and go
fishing, and companies will be left with newborn engineers and people who
haven't touched a Laplace transform in a decade. Sure, the engineers get a
bad deal, but we can always find some other way to make a living.
Engineering companies don't have that luxury.

Oh well, what do today's businessmen and MBAs care? When the proverbial fan
blade swings into position, they will be retiring too.

 

[Jack Steed]

Take classes towards MS and can claim still in school.

I live in Ontario, Canada

My Overall Cumulative GPA is B-, which is just below the B MINIMUMLY
required by 95% of the Canadian Universities (that offer EE Grad
Program).

Realisticaly, at least in Canada, with the number of people (Both New
Grads, and the experienced P.Eng's who got downsized) trying to squeeze
into EE Grad Programs, even if my overall CGPA is B, I suspect my chance
of getting accepted into a EE Grad Program is not good.

I checked some the Grad Programs in some American Universities as well,
but most of them require Proof of Finacial Support, Health Insurance,
Etc, things that I don't have.

 

[Jack Steed]

As for finding a job; I just don't believe that there are no EE
jobs "in
North America". Yes, the economy is not what it was back in 2000 when
I was shopping for my first professional job, but there are jobs
around, even for a recent grad such as yourself. I mean no
disrespect, but what exactly is the problem? How long have you been
looking? Is it finding companies, getting interviews from those
companies, or having interviews but no offers coming from them? Or is
it really as bad as all that, and I am in the dark here? Maybe if you
gave us some idea where the bottleneck is some people here with much
more experience than us can pitch in with some ideas.

Good luck,

Travis

Interestingly, even with alot of the high-tech (especially in the hardware
sector) companies outsourcing from Asia nowdays, I was able to locate a
several ENTRY (I was very surprised by the simplicity/primitivity of the
job duties & almost non-existing job requirements) level EE jobs located in
California on www.engineerjobs.com. But,

1. with Entry level EE jobs that easy, the local folks will most likely
beat me to it, considering the companies probabbly prefer local people
as well.

2. I'm a Canadian Citizen, with the excessive number of unemployed EE new
Grads & Seasoned veterans in US as it is, I don't think the custom
officials are all that willing to give me a working visa (Even Tho I
dont't have any religion at all, and I don't mean any offense to
anyone).

3. you new EE grads from US who are reading this, probabbly do
NOT want me to go over to states to worsen your competition any further


Jack Steed

 

[Travis Hayes]

I'm in pretty much the same boat that he is. Graduated in 2002, have been
looking since before 2001. Fortunately I knew some people and currently have
a temp (not contract) job doing mostly mechanical engineering and
purchasing. It is, I think, better than nothing, but I too am extremely
worried that when the economy turns around I'll be obsolete. So I've been
doing work on my own projects, buying an FPGA dev board and trying to get
the VHDL experience I didn't get in school, etc. Yet when an employer looks
at my resume, I have no professional EE experience.

It really is "as bad as all that" right now. True, electrical engineering
jobs do exist. But there are also many experienced engineers competing for
work with wet-behind-the-ears graduates. Skill and experience requirements
have skyrocketed for the same position, because HR knows that they can get
it. You can't blame them; they get an experienced professional for the price
of a recent graduate.

But what has happened to the old line about somebody being
"overqualified" for a position? HR departments with stable companies know
that when they are hiring somebody who is not suited for a position (i.e.
salary not matching the requirements) that the match will be temporary at
best. Someone hungry for a job and willing to take less than they think
they are worth will be moving on as soon as a position opens up, and then HR
is back to trying to find someone to fill the void.

But that's going to become a problem in a few years. What happens to all the
new graduates who couldn't find jobs, and went into landscaping or
construction or sales? Skills do not improve when they are not used.
Companies are eager to hire all the experienced employees, but at the same
time they are not willing to create experienced employees for ten years down
the road. Very short-sighted. The pros will cash in retirement and go
fishing, and companies will be left with newborn engineers and people who
haven't touched a Laplace transform in a decade. Sure, the engineers get a
bad deal, but we can always find some other way to make a living.
Engineering companies don't have that luxury.

Oh well, what do today's businessmen and MBAs care? When the proverbial fan
blade swings into position, they will be retiring too.

Last week I wandered over to a mini career fair on the campus nearby.
There were about 15 companies there, and about 10 of those were looking for
EEs. Of those 10, 8 were looking for entry level employees, and they
actually did have positions for them. The U.S. government is hiring (sorry,
Jack, probably not for you). IBM, Micron, and Ball Aerospace were there as
well. When our university's career fair happens in March HP, GE, IBM, Ball,
Raytheon, TRW, and many government agencies can be counted on to be there,
if the past 6 years are any indication.
Granted, some of them may not have openings and are there only for
publicity, I don't know. As I will be joining the ranks of the
seeking-employment types next summer, I am interested in how you guys are
fairing out there in the real world. Garrett, I know you have been looking
for a while, I have seen your posts on Slashdot and have seen your resume on
your website. What I was hoping to discover with my last post was exactly
were Jack is having troubles; if companies just aren't looking, or if they
just aren't hiring HIM for one reason or another.

 

[Garrett Mace]

I've had an EE since 93 and never got a engineering job.
Life is fucked and then you die.
All of our jobs ARE going overseas and you can thank
the US for being the worlds patsy. Never looking after
ourselves. The whole world laughs at us as we doing the
worlds dirty work (wars), don't have universal health care
for our own citizens as we fund the lion's share of research
who everyone else benefits from, higher retirement age than
Europe, much worse vacation and other job benefits..
The whole world laughs at us.

Yikes, you survived the tech boom without getting an engineering job? I knew
*sophomores* who were offered full-time, full-salary jobs during that time.

 

[DarkMatter]

Yes I do expect things to change for the better in the next year.
Indeed *drastically*. I even am so bold as to predict that
outsourcing development to China-India will fall flat in it's
silly beak. The companies that rely on outsourcing and who have
gutted their own development will go under, while those who
experiment will find an excuse to say it was a good idea.

Proof that you don't know much about the China/Taiwan situation.

We develop here. We have plants in China for high volume demands,
and we manufacture here for low, and medium volume or custom products.

China and Taiwan are assets, not liabilities. They are mere
contract manufacturers. There are still plenty of engineering
capacity jobs around here, despite getting most of our low voltage
production from there.

They are also good when re-evaluating a product for a cost of
manufacture reduction cycle.

I can get hand crafted transformers from there at a couple bucks
each in short or large quantities, and over here, it would be at least
ten dollars each.

BIG difference. Where are all of the transformer technician experts
at, crying about their lost jobs? I don't see it.

Yet knowing transformer and choke design for high frequency
switching power applications is a more and more rare thing in this
country. It wasn't China's fault though. The American electronic
industries don't pay their production and technician staff well
enough, and quality has suffered here, and cost of manufacture has as
well.

American made products are very expensive, if made by well paid
workers. I have found them to be very expensive even if not made by
well paid workers. Quality does suffer, however.

One reason why mil spec went south, and COTS is now acceptable for
many items on and in military gear. Inspecting a PCB assy with a
hundred solder joints 200 times IS overkill.

 

[DarkMatter]

Oh my? That's surely high tech stuff!

Yes, it is.

Learn some engineering and get a real job DimBulb!

You're a goddamned Usenet retard, Keith R. Williams.

 

[DarkMatter]

Oh my! That's just what I want to do for a living. Plug
formulas into a computer and wind transformers. DimBulb, that
isn't all there is to engineering.

Did I say it was? No. Again you sport your infamous, lame lack of
ability to comprehend what you have read.

 

[DarkMatter]

DimBulb, try to get with the tech program! The easily
transported jobs will go east. There are plenty of skilled jobs
and there will be more.

Actually, dipshit, they GO west. They end up in an eastern
location.

I wouldn't expect a retarded twit like you to have a grasp on that,
however, since you have no grasp on anything else either.

I also expect that you won't get this one either.