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Hammers and guns and Jim and Michael

1946 is prehistory in that context. Sadly, today it would end up in a
very different way.

More nonsense.
All it takes is the corrupt officer calling for reinforcements because
they're under attack by a local terrorist cell, after taking some
measures to escalate the revolt in order to make it look like a terrorist
attack.

Say "baaaa".
In a few hours or less SWAT teams or the military arrive and shoot
everyone carrying a firearm. Case closed.

Nonsense.
 
The links I provided in a way-too-long post show that there
are both organized groups of individuals and individuals
working hard to develop practical 3D printing capabilities
bent towards this aim. Particularly, a lot of time on the
idea of the lower receivers, which are what is the controlled
part of an auto weapon in the US.

I'm kind of curious how all this is going to play out in
countries where guns are much more restricted, though. Even a
single shot capability before the weapon becomes useless
could be enough to change local situations for law
enforcement practices. In the US, probably not so much.

Since spending time actually building a 3D printer and now
having the ability to produce not only very nice and rather
complex project boxes (big boon for me) but also the ability
to print out larger capacity magazines that actually work
well... I am beginning to realize increasingly the potential
impacts of 3D printing. It's not exactly the same situation
as when the Altair 8800 and, later, the IMSAI 8080 appeared
on the scene. (Creating one component to an acceptance of low
cost computers into business -- the other component being
Visicalc on the Apple II.) But there are similarities and
perhaps a promise of some of the kinds of revolutionary
social change, as well.

Very good point. Perhaps even more so. There weren't many companies
that went into the service bureau business with Altairs or IMSAIs but
I see that coming with 3-D printing. One of our layout engineers is
thinking of getting into 3-D printing as a side business.
It will be interesting to see how the next few years play
out.

Sure will. CNC wood milling machines are commonplace now. I wonder
if the cost of CNC metal milling machines will plummet, too.
 
Now give a real reason for needing a gun.

Of course. It's been stated in this thread at least fifty times; self
defense!
The whole reason people
think they need guns to protect themselves is because every grazy
person can get a gun. Its utter fear! And its just a placebo. You
really don't stand a chance against someone who comes at you with a
gun prepared for any defensive move. Anyone who wants to prove
otherwise should walk into a back ally in some shady part of New York
and try to pull the gun when they get mugged.

Speak for yourself. It's not only crazy people who break into homes
or mug people on the street. Idiot, not all crimes are committed by
people with guns. Most are not because there are *very* stiff
penalties for possessing a firearm while committing a felony. However,
being armed *is* a great equalizer. Something between 1 and two
MILLION crimes PER YEAR are stopped with guns.

You simply want to disarm the population because you feel sorry for
the criminals.
About 25 years ago I worked for a couple of Israelis on a project. At
some point they where identifying project hazards. When they came to
bomb attacks they said 'Err.. no, we are in the Netherlands so that is
not a thread'. At that moment I realised that a big part of freedom is
being able to go to bed at night without being afraid some idiot with
a gun or bomb turns up.

Ignorance is bliss. You're apparently the happiest person on the
planet.
Having guns didn't do the people much good. Lots of dead resistance
fighters to name streets after... not to mention the random mass
killings for revenge.

They *DIDN'T* have guns. They were CONFISCATED, moron!
Just wait until some lunatic starts shooting around in the shopping
mall where your family does their shopping. Happened to me... my kids
could have been there but plans changed and I went alone to my parents
later that day. It never ever seemed so long before my parents
answered the phone when I called to check whether they where OK. So
really don't tell me to get my facts right.

Your facts aren't. Your head is so far...
 
J

Jon Kirwan

Jan 1, 1970
0
Very good point. Perhaps even more so. There weren't many companies
that went into the service bureau business with Altairs or IMSAIs

That's because there was no packaged software market. Well,
except for Microsoft's papertape basic. When BYTE Shop showed
up, small businesses starting buying finished units but then
suddenly discovered the lack of packaged application
software. (By that time, CP/M and some additional BASIC
interpreters existed.) An operating system and a language
doesn't help a small business much and instead forces them to
find a "custom" programmer. I made a lot of easy money at the
time because of it. Getting work just required letting BYTE
Shop know you existed so they could sell their hardware
without getting it thrown back at them through their front
window by disgruntled company buyers who couldn't use it.

The enabling application was Visicalc. Every single business
could use it, immediately. However, it was written for the
Apple II, at first (which was only being sold, prior
toVisicalc, as a very expensive game machine -- lowsy
resolution, only 40 characters per line using a standard TV
set for display.) So Apple IIs suddenly started selling like
hotcakes and the Altair and IMSAI soon disappeared from the
market (as also did TRS-80, which provided BASIC but not
Visicalc.) IBM's PC team (there were three internally
competing PC development teams within IBM at the time)
insisted on providing a ROM BASIC and a Visicalc application
because of that success, I think.
but I see that [service bureaus] coming with 3-D printing.

Agreed. People still use copy centers despite the fact that
home printing is also quite common. So even after some time
goes by, I think I fully agree with you. Service companies
will be able to afford higher quality, faster, and bigger
machines as well as some software and support in creating
realizable 3D objects that will print out well.
One of our layout engineers is
thinking of getting into 3-D printing as a side business.

It's crossed my mind, as well.
Sure will. CNC wood milling machines are commonplace now. I wonder
if the cost of CNC metal milling machines will plummet, too.

I think this is going to impact more than a few things. The
freely available software is actually pretty darned good, and
getting better. Commercial software will be still better. But
the main thing will be pre-packaged 3D files you can just
download for a specific purpose.

But there will also be a lot of new copyright and patent law
changes being pushed through Congress in the near future by
large corporations looking to protect their markets and also
protect themselves against other large companies. This is a
frontier, of sorts, and there will be a lot of new
gunslingers out there looking for a shoot-out.

This also happened in the late 1970's and early 1980's, when
rental businesses opened up and rented out software that was
then copied. Companies stood to lose a lot of money and
changed their licensing. But it was new licensing that had
never been tested in court before. Took years, but they
completely changed existing law and transformed what was
considered "normal" before.

Will happen here, too, I suspect. But I can't predict in what
ways.

Jon
 
C

Charles

Jan 1, 1970
0
"Tim Wescott" wrote in message

It was proposed here that hammers kill as many as guns. It does not
hold up to any reasonable degree of scrutiny.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the- u.s.-2010/tables/10shrtbl07.xls

Jim and Michael hate to hear the truth.

Are you guys one or two entities?

I am kill-filed. Will never sleep well again.

The article quoted was about how _rifles_ (not all _guns_) kill fewer
people than hammers (well, hammers and clubs). All rifles are guns, but
not all guns are rifles. Since all of the recent hoopla is about
_rifles_, it makes sense to ask if _rifles_ as a sub-class of guns should
get so much attention when hammers and clubs kill more people than
_rifles_.

If you had actually read the article you would have:

If you had actually read the article you would have noticed this:

In 2011, 323 murders were committed with a rifle and 356 with a shotgun,
while a staggering 496 were committed with hammers and clubs.

And that is simply not true.
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
The FBI should list private citizen justifiable homicide. There aren't
many. Usually a few hundred per year. Documented DGU is quite rare. Most
DGU consists of unverifiable bullshit stories.
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
Do you really believe they can launch 'Cruise Missiles' against each
and every gun owner? Do you believe that our military would carry out
illegal orders against citizens? "I vaz yos following orders!" didn't
work for the German soldiers during W.W.II, and wouldn't work under
martial law. They would be tried for either war crimes or terrorism
after all the dust settles.

Cruise missiles are much too expensive to use to terminate gun owners.
The AC-130 will do the job just fine. Why yes, it can slice USA cinder
block as well as RVN cinder block.
Obama is making a huge stink about guns, yet just signed permanent
Secret Service protection for himself into law. Can't you see the
hypocrisy?
How fucking stupid are you? POTUS is a target. Nobody give a fucking
shit about you. You are not a target. Can't you comprehend this simple fact?

Biden is pushing for 'Smart weapons', yet the Sandy Hook shootings
were done with weapons form hs own home. Can't you see the total
stupidity?

God, the idiots I have to deal with. A smart weapon can only be fired by
its owner. If Nancy Lanza had a smart weapon, her son couldn't shoot it.

Please tell me you don't vote. That would make me feel better about America.
 
Cruise missiles are much too expensive to use to terminate gun owners.
The AC-130 will do the job just fine. Why yes, it can slice USA cinder
block as well as RVN cinder block.

Wow, maybe you shouldn't own guns. You have *way* too many loose
ends.
How fucking stupid are you? POTUS is a target. Nobody give a fucking
shit about you. You are not a target. Can't you comprehend this simple fact?

How fucking stupid are you? Everyone can be a target. Are you saying
that somehow his life is more important than yours? OK, maybe you
have a point. I'm not agreeing to be the lamb, though.
God, the idiots I have to deal with.

You shaved today, right?
A smart weapon can only be fired by
its owner. If Nancy Lanza had a smart weapon, her son couldn't shoot it.

Her son DID shoot them, under HER supervision. Do you think the gun
would have had to be "smart" enough to allow him to shoot it? You
really aren't very bright.
Please tell me you don't vote. That would make me feel better about America.

Of course it would. Lefties really don't want people to vote and
protect those who make it so.
 
The FBI should list private citizen justifiable homicide. There aren't
many. Usually a few hundred per year. Documented DGU is quite rare. Most
DGU consists of unverifiable bullshit stories.

Keep telling the lies. Maybe one day even you will believe them.
 
M

mkr5000

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bottom line --

2/3rds of the American people want to ban assault weapons and have tighter controls on gun ownership.

Common sense wins in the end.

The 2nd amendment needs to be "amended" and our forefathers would be the first to agree.

Those kids had a RIGHT to live their lives -- even more important than our 2nd amendment ABUSE.

Are 30 guns better than 3000? *&%^ing YES.
It's simple math.
 
Bottom line --

2/3rds of the American people want to ban assault weapons and have tighter controls on gun ownership.

A lie.
Common sense wins in the end.

Let's hope so, so that the Constitution remains.
The 2nd amendment needs to be "amended" and our forefathers would be the first to agree.

Another damned lie. Though, given that so many ignorant lefties are
hung up on the 'M' word, they might strike the phrase. Their meaning
is clear.
Those kids had a RIGHT to live their lives -- even more important than our 2nd amendment ABUSE.

So do the 1-2M people that guns save.
Are 30 guns better than 3000? *&%^ing YES.

Nope. Not if I don't have the one I need.
It's simple math.

It really is. Your IQ is 1.
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
Well, your a bloodthirsty sort, aren't you? It's only defense if you
kill someone.

Who is that asshat that does DGU phone surveys? Some shithead from
Florida? This would qualify:
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
Wow, maybe you shouldn't own guns. You have *way* too many loose
ends.

How fucking stupid are you? Everyone can be a target. Are you saying
that somehow his life is more important than yours? OK, maybe you
have a point. I'm not agreeing to be the lamb, though.

If everyone is a target, then nobody is a target. And just what the ****
are you going to do about it. Carry a gun in your hands at all times?
Her son DID shoot them, under HER supervision. Do you think the gun
would have had to be "smart" enough to allow him to shoot it? You
really aren't very bright.

You don't understand how a smart gun works. Then again, you don't
understand much of anything.

The criminal picks the time, target and place. If Adam Lanza picked up
the smart gun, he couldn't sneak up on Mom and blow her away point blank.

When the AC-130 is shooting, it sounds a lot like a belch. Yes, really.
So be prepared.
 
M

mkr5000

Jan 1, 1970
0
Those kids had a RIGHT to live their lives -- even more important than our 2nd amendment ABUSE.


So do the 1-2M people that guns save.


(what guns? cop guns? ask them if they want automatic weapons illegal).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Are 30 guns better than 3000? *&%^ing YES.

Nope. Not if I don't have the one I need.


(need? and which gun is that idiot? what KIND of gun? an AK47 ??)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
and you're right, I did lie -- not 2/3rds, just 62% -- take your own poll fool.


even when you hillbillies KNOW your wrong, your inferiority complex prevents you from admitting it.

screw your guns, your budweiser, your lottery tickets, your GED and your F150.
 
If everyone is a target, then nobody is a target. And just what the ****
are you going to do about it. Carry a gun in your hands at all times?

Your "logic" is quite obvious by its absence. Not everyone needs a
flu shot for flu shots to be effective. No think about it for a
while.
You don't understand how a smart gun works. Then again, you don't
understand much of anything.

Good Lord, you're stupid!
The criminal picks the time, target and place. If Adam Lanza picked up
the smart gun, he couldn't sneak up on Mom and blow her away point blank.

He MOTHER ALLOWED HIM TO USE THE GUNS. The "smart" gun, if such thing
existed, *WOULD* have necessarily had his print in its database. You
*really* are an idiot.
When the AC-130 is shooting, it sounds a lot like a belch. Yes, really.
So be prepared.

You really are one stupid ****. Thanks for confirming what everyone
else here has known for years.
 
So do the 1-2M people that guns save.


(what guns? cop guns? ask them if they want automatic weapons illegal).

Good Lord, you're too stupid to even post.

Victim's (or would be) guns, you stupid twit!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Nope. Not if I don't have the one I need.


(need? and which gun is that idiot? what KIND of gun? an AK47 ??)

If I'm in danger, it really doesn't much matter. Any is better than
none.

Of course you lied. You're a leftist loser. ...and still lying.
even when you hillbillies KNOW your wrong, your inferiority complex prevents you from admitting it.
Idiot.

screw your guns, your budweiser, your lottery tickets, your GED and your F150.

I'd like to see that. All of it.
 
C

Charles

Jan 1, 1970
0
"Jim Thompson" wrote in message


Schuler, Hamilton and Schoen are nutcase leftists who only believe
what's rattling around in their nutcase brains... never to be bothered
by facts. And THEY are the dangerous ones... if THEY were to undergo
a psycho evaluation they'd be denied the right to own a gun.

As you become more shrill and irrational and abusive, it is clear you need
less wine and some reasonable friends, aside from the toadies here.
 
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