Maker Pro
Maker Pro

Grid Tie Inverter Project

J

Jim Rojas

Jan 1, 1970
0
I am working on a project that involves connecting solar, wind,
microhydro power into a grid tie system, without the huge expense of the
GTIs. Can anyone help me with a circuit diagram I am working with? Are
there any electrical engineers out there?

Thank you

Jim Rojas
 
B

Bill

Jan 1, 1970
0
I am working on a project that involves connecting solar, wind,
microhydro power into a grid tie system, without the huge expense of
the GTIs. Can anyone help me with a circuit diagram I am working
with? Are there any electrical engineers out there?

Ask your electric company. They have many electrical engineers who are
familiar with electric power considerations.
 
B

Bill

Jan 1, 1970
0
"Jim Rojas" wrote in message
Here is a link to the diagram I am working with:

http://www.tech-man.com/gti/220vgti.jpg

The problem is with phase 2. It blows the fuse right away.

And what does "phase" 2 look like on your oscilloscope?

What does "phase"1 look like on your oscilloscope?

I think you have some reading to do...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase

From the following link...
"A 60 hertz sine wave is synthesized that is in phase with the line
and they use PWN and a transformer to generate a high + and a high -
bus which is then ramped inphase from the high + bus to the low - bus,
through zero at a slightly higher voltage than the line so it feeds
the line. It must also detect when the array declines and change the
pulse widths to maintain the feed to the grid at the max while letting
the house eat what it wants as well. It also has the ability to feed
the line if you do not need the power and the sun declines and the
array does not put out the full voltage. Complex little devices, but
just a few LSI chips inside."...
http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/4482/Grid-Tie-Inverter-Design

You can get started with learning microcontroller programming here...
http://www.parallax.com/Store/Micro...ortField/0/Level/a/ProductID/327/Default.aspx

The "Basic Stamp" "What's a Microcontroller?" kit is also sold at
Radio Shack. This is the easiest microcontroller to learn on.

Then from there you can go to a Parallax Propeller Microcontroller
which can be programmed in assembly language. Here is a kit for
that...
http://www.parallax.com/Store/Micro...ortField/0/Level/a/ProductID/415/Default.aspx
 
J

Jim Rojas

Jan 1, 1970
0
Roy said:
THE PROTEUS THAT POSTED THIS REPLY IS A FAKE

HE IS A SICHOPHANTIC USENET ABUSER
A TROLL IN EVERY SENSE OF THE WORD

I AM SEEKING JUSTICE AND LAW ENFORECEMENT TO END HIS CAMPAIGN OF
HARASSMENT AND ABUSE AGAINST THIS GROUP MEMBERS AND IT'S VISITOR

PLEASE HELP TO UNVEIL WHO HE IS AND END HIS ABUSIVE FOLLY IN THIS
GROUP

It seems every newsgroup has its share of idiots & trolls.

Thank for for the info.

Jim Rojas
 
J

Jim Rojas

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bill said:
"Jim Rojas" wrote in message

And what does "phase" 2 look like on your oscilloscope?

What does "phase"1 look like on your oscilloscope?

I think you have some reading to do...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase

From the following link...
"A 60 hertz sine wave is synthesized that is in phase with the line and
they use PWN and a transformer to generate a high + and a high - bus
which is then ramped inphase from the high + bus to the low - bus,
through zero at a slightly higher voltage than the line so it feeds the
line. It must also detect when the array declines and change the pulse
widths to maintain the feed to the grid at the max while letting the
house eat what it wants as well. It also has the ability to feed the
line if you do not need the power and the sun declines and the array
does not put out the full voltage. Complex little devices, but just a
few LSI chips inside."...
http://cr4.globalspec.com/thread/4482/Grid-Tie-Inverter-Design

You can get started with learning microcontroller programming here...
http://www.parallax.com/Store/Micro...ortField/0/Level/a/ProductID/327/Default.aspx


The "Basic Stamp" "What's a Microcontroller?" kit is also sold at Radio
Shack. This is the easiest microcontroller to learn on.

Then from there you can go to a Parallax Propeller Microcontroller which
can be programmed in assembly language. Here is a kit for that...
http://www.parallax.com/Store/Micro...ortField/0/Level/a/ProductID/415/Default.aspx


We are trying to keep this simple. No controllers, software, chips, etc.
This circuit works fine only on one phase. We are trying to balance out
the circuit so it provides power on 220v, or else the energy savings
will be greatly reduced.

I am not an engineer. I am just a hobbyist interested in cutting down my
power consumption. I live in Florida. All our major appliances run off
220VAC. We have no natural gas, or propane to help out here.

I can't use solar power because I have 2 giant trees on my property that
block the sun for 6-7 hours. I can't use wind because it seldom gets
over 5MPH.

I am experimenting with a 3 phase electronic speed controller (ESC). I
have a 5HP 3 phase motor, to which the ESC will allow the 3 phase motor
to run on 12-24VDC 2-4Amps, with no load.

I will first try to run it using belts to see how the load is affected.
If this proves to be too much drag, I will try a Hatem cogging wheel
using Neodymium magnets.

The whole idea is to use either a series of automotive alternators or
permanent magnet motors to generate large amounts of DC power.


Jim Rojas
 
J

Jim Rojas

Jan 1, 1970
0
Roy said:
Yes and complacent scardy cats like you ignore it until it is
happening to you.

I am not new to Usenet. I have seen my share of these guys over the past
15 years.

Jim Rojas
Technical Manuals Online!
http://www.tech-man.com
8002 Cornwall Lane
Tampa, FL 33615-4604
813-884-6335
 
J

Jim Rojas

Jan 1, 1970
0
Proteus said:
You're doing pretty well for not being an engineer. You can combine
waves however you are going to blow your own inverter when two sources
of power are present. Plus your DC source is coming from the same
source, so it won't do any good to supply dual phase for your household.
One more problem, you triggering the gates, you might end up with Square
wave rather than sine wave.

I AM PROIDIOT

The design is not mine. I found it on
http://www.neo-aerodynamic.com/GridTieInverter.html

I added the second circuit below, because that's what I need it to do. I
am hoping some of you brilliant minds out there can help clean it up so
everyone can use this.

Jim Rojas
 
J

Jim Rojas

Jan 1, 1970
0
Roy said:
I am not a newby either.
Have you ever had one of them call you and leave a disturbing message
on your voicemail?
Roy Q T

I have voicemail on my house line and on my cell. I never use it. If its
impotant, they will call back. My cell phone has a call block app, which
logs the call. They can call me once, after that it gets zapped. I use
Phonetray Free on my house line. I set it up to stop bill collectors
looking for someone else. Many times I get 10 to 30 calls a day. My
computer answers the call, gives a disconnected, block call, no
telemarketing, etc. message, and logs the call. It's great software if
you want to build a case against harassing phone calls.

If you feed the troll, he will come back for more. Ignore these people,
also add them to your usenet block list if needed. Their posts will
become invisible to you.

Jim Rojas
 
I have voicemail on my house line and on my cell. I never use it. If its
impotant, they will call back. My cell phone has a call block app, which
logs the call. They can call me once, after that it gets zapped. I use
Phonetray Free on my house line. I set it up to stop bill collectors
looking for someone else. Many times I get 10 to 30 calls a day. My
computer answers the call, gives a disconnected, block call, no
telemarketing, etc. message, and logs the call. It's great software if
you want to build a case against harassing phone calls.

If you feed the troll, he will come back for more. Ignore these people,
also add them to your usenet block list if needed. Their posts will
become invisible to you.

Roy is one of the biggest trolls on the Usenet. He is the original "Proteus".
 
SO YOU ADMIT YOU ARE ONE OF ABOUT 3 TROLLS ACCOSTING THIS GROUP
INCLUDING USER ROY
WITH OFFENDING AND ANNOYING FAGGOTY CRAP

No, Roy. *YOU* are the troll. I'm educating the newbs so they too can avoid
you.
TELL US
WHAT IS YOUR REAL NAME KEITH

You really are stupid if you think IKWYABWAI is a real argument. Well, you
really are stupid.
 
NO YOU ARE ACTONG STUPID

*I* am "ACTONG" stupid, Roy?
I AM PROTEUS AND YOU SHOULD ADDRESS ME AS THAT ALONE
USER ROY IS A BIPEDAL HUMANOID LIKE YOU
NOT ME

You're a liar, Roy. I thought you were giving that crap up?
FYI NEITHER ON OF US IS A "TROLL"

I am not a troll, however you most certainly are.
IF THEY STOP HARASSING AND POSTING ABUSIVE CRAP TO US
WE WILL NOT HAVE NEED TO ACT THIS WAY IN DEFENSE

Stupid is not a defense, Roy.
YOU ARE EITHER AN ASSOCIATE IF NOT ONE OF THE OFFENDING TROLLS THAT
NAMECALL AND FLAME ALMOST EVERY POST LISTED IN
ALT.ENGINEERING.ELECTRICAL

That would be you, Roy.
I CAN GUESS WHY YOU DEFEND THEM

I am not defending anyone, Roy.
BUT YOU WILL ONLY PAY TOO AS AN ACCOMPLICE TO THEM

Wow, you're a big man, Roy Quijano. You can threaten people a thousand miles
away, from the safety of your own home.
 
NO ONE HAS BEEN THREATENED

Stop lying, Roy.
NO HUMANS HAVE BEEN HARMED IN THIS PROCESS

You have been harmed, Roy.

Another threat.
I AM JUST CAREFUL AND WATCHFUL

You can't even get your caps unlocked.
THAT IS WHAT MY PROGRAM DOES

More lies from Roy.
THE DEEP PROBE AND ANAL APERTURE STUFF I CALCULATED AND ADDED TO THIS
PROTOCOL FROM THE DEMEANOR OF THE ABUSIVE TROLLS AND OFFENSIVE
ANONYNOUS USERS I ENCOUNTERED

Roy, you were just bitching about others' language. Perhaps you should listen
to yourself.
YOU ARE NOT ON THAT LIST
BUT
YOU KEEP ADDRESSING ME AS MR. QUIJANO

I didn't address you as "Mr. Quijano", Roy Quijano.
YOUR DATA IS FLAWED

You're lying again, Roy.

However, my purpose has been served. You, Roy Quijano, have shown yourself to
the new posters here as the troll that you are.
YOU MUST STOP MAKING THE PARTICULAR MISTAKE

No mistake, Roy.
YOU HAVE NOT BEEN DECIEVED BY ME
Hardly.

EMPLOYING YOUR WAY NO ONE WINS

As long as you troll this group, no one wins, Roy.
I AM PROTEUS

You are a liar, Roy.

That all said, my function here is complete.
 
J

Josepi

Jan 1, 1970
0
You are wasting your time with this oversimplified design. Even the
schematic is drawn backwards.

Stay away from these dangerous idiots.

Buy something commercial. Years and years of research on the power circuits,
commutation circuitry, spike protection,waveform shaping, CPU algorythms and
communications protocols have been put into these devices. Develop a new
nuclear generator. It would probably be easier for you.




The design is not mine. I found it on
http://www.neo-aerodynamic.com/GridTieInverter.html

I added the second circuit below, because that's what I need it to do. I
am hoping some of you brilliant minds out there can help clean it up so
everyone can use this.

Jim Rojas
 
J

Josepi

Jan 1, 1970
0
I have been to criminal court several times over bS like this. There is
nothing you can do about it online.

Turn you computer off, go elsewhere or shut the **** up and get on with your
real life, if you have one.

You have become the troll.


I am not a newby either.
Have you ever had one of them call you and leave a disturbing message
on your voicemail?
Roy Q T
 
J

Jim Rojas

Jan 1, 1970
0
Josepi said:
You are wasting your time with this oversimplified design. Even the
schematic is drawn backwards.

Stay away from these dangerous idiots.

Buy something commercial. Years and years of research on the power circuits,
commutation circuitry, spike protection,waveform shaping, CPU algorythms and
communications protocols have been put into these devices. Develop a new
nuclear generator. It would probably be easier for you.




The design is not mine. I found it on
http://www.neo-aerodynamic.com/GridTieInverter.html

I added the second circuit below, because that's what I need it to do. I
am hoping some of you brilliant minds out there can help clean it up so
everyone can use this.

Jim Rojas

Let me ask you a question.

Can 2 250-500 watt ($100-$200) inverters share the same input DC power,
but yet be plug into 2 different phases?

My house runs on all electric. The bills in the summertime peak at $400
a month. I would gladly spend $2000 on GTI's if they can be plugged in
to my 220v panel on both phases.

Jim Rojas
 
J

Josepi

Jan 1, 1970
0
The answer is "It depends"

The AC output needs to be isolated from the DC by a transformer in the
inverter other wise none of the leads should be tied together. This would be
like crossing the terminals on your DC supply when certain triacs or gates
are firing inside.

The phasing of the units need to be in synchronisation. Grid tie units
require a "grid" to syncronise to. If they are out sync you would get 240
Vac sometimes and zero other times as the phses wander in timing to each
other.

Firings of noise inverters can maltrigger the other unit. This would be
similar to "bad power".

The factory would need to be consulted. It may be cheaper and more reliable
to us ea 120 // 120/240Vac step up transformer.

If your bills are $400 per month I doubt if anything you buy under $10K will
run that load.

2 x 500watt inverters make a total of 1000 watts. Now you are generating 10
cents worth of energy every hour. You could run a small stereo or computer
but nothing that heats anything.

1000 watts coming from a 12 volt battery = 1000W / 12V = 83 Amperes. You
will need some heavy copper cables and and more than a car battery. It will
be dead in a short time. See "Peukert factor"

Generating your own electrical energy will never be as cheap as the grid.




Let me ask you a question.

Can 2 250-500 watt ($100-$200) inverters share the same input DC power,
but yet be plug into 2 different phases?

My house runs on all electric. The bills in the summertime peak at $400
a month. I would gladly spend $2000 on GTI's if they can be plugged in
to my 220v panel on both phases.

Jim Rojas
 
Top