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Good grief wire prices!!!

M

Mr.CRC

Jan 1, 1970
0
WTF is going on.

I used to buy 100ft spools of teflon insulated wire for work for about
$30-40 a year or two ago. That was expensive. Prices are doubling
every year or two.

I want some 100ft spools of 22ga teflon hookup wire for my home use, and
the prices range from $66, $77, to $94 for Alpha 5855 at Mouser, Allied,
and DigiKey respectively.

I'm having to consider Ebay, but I don't like to not know the ins.
thickness, stranding, and other details. Some of the MIL stuff has
0.016in insulation, and I like 0.010in.

I wonder if I can do electronics without wire...

I used to buy jacketed surplus cable from junk electronics outlets, then
strip the things to get the conductors.

Maybe I'll have to keep doing it. :-(
 
P

P E Schoen

Jan 1, 1970
0
"Mr.CRC" wrote in message
WTF is going on.
I used to buy 100ft spools of teflon insulated wire for work for
about $30-40 a year or two ago. That was expensive. Prices
are doubling every year or two.
I want some 100ft spools of 22ga teflon hookup wire for my home
use, and the prices range from $66, $77, to $94 for Alpha 5855
at Mouser, Allied, and DigiKey respectively.
I'm having to consider Ebay, but I don't like to not know the ins.
thickness, stranding, and other details. Some of the MIL stuff
has 0.016in insulation, and I like 0.010in.
I wonder if I can do electronics without wire...
I used to buy jacketed surplus cable from junk electronics outlets,
then strip the things to get the conductors.
Maybe I'll have to keep doing it. :-(

I've found McMaster-Carr to be reasonable for wire. They have 100 ft rolls
of PTFE stranded #22 wire with silver plated conductors for $51:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-electrical-wire/=hu8em4

Another good source is Anaheim wire and cable:
http://catalog.anaheimwire.com/viewitems/wires/tfe-wires?forward=1

I was shocked at the high prices for shielded pair wires.

Paul
 
P

P E Schoen

Jan 1, 1970
0
"Owen Roberts" wrote in message
Start POLITICAL RANT MODE
If we actually manufacturerd ANYTHING in America anymore,
the wire would be cheaper.
NO GDP, NO CHEAP...
END POLITICAL RANT MODE

You may be correct, but the bigger issue is why things are rarely produced
in the US anymore. One of the main problems is the combined expectations of
American workers to get a high salary or hourly rate, and a big benefits
package, while at the same time unwilling (or unable) to work hard, and
learn complex skills, and be productive. There is such an incredible "safety
net" in the US that people do not really need to worry about starving or
freezing on the street. There is a culture of laziness and indifference
toward education and ethics, so that it has become acceptable and
comfortable to rely on public assistance with no expectation of personal
responsibility and contribution toward society.

Mexicans can and do work at physically demanding jobs 8 or more hours a day,
while most Americans are not physically fit enough to do so for more than a
few hours. And they economize by sharing living space, and send much of
their income to their truly needy families who would actually starve and
die.

Workers in countries like China have a strong work ethic, and are willing to
work for low wages because the alternative is severe hardship and
starvation. They are willing to use public transportation and live in
dormitories supplied by their companies and only visit their homes on
weekends. They also have a healthy spirit of fair competition which enhances
the productivity of other companies. There are few "corporate raiders" who
take over a company and follow a program which is designed for their own
personal benefit and wealth, while driving the company into bankruptcy and
failure within a few years, at which point they "abandon ship" and go on to
other unethical and greedy conquests.

Paul
 
N

Nico Coesel

Jan 1, 1970
0
Mr.CRC said:
WTF is going on.

I used to buy 100ft spools of teflon insulated wire for work for about
$30-40 a year or two ago. That was expensive. Prices are doubling
every year or two.

I want some 100ft spools of 22ga teflon hookup wire for my home use, and
the prices range from $66, $77, to $94 for Alpha 5855 at Mouser, Allied,
and DigiKey respectively.

I'm having to consider Ebay, but I don't like to not know the ins.
thickness, stranding, and other details. Some of the MIL stuff has
0.016in insulation, and I like 0.010in.

I wonder if I can do electronics without wire...

A lot of people are moving to aluminium wiring. Unfortunately
aluminium is hard to solder so we are screwed.
 
R

Rich Webb

Jan 1, 1970
0
"Owen Roberts" wrote in message




You may be correct, but the bigger issue is why things are rarely produced
in the US anymore. One of the main problems is the combined expectations of
American workers to get a high salary or hourly rate, and a big benefits
package, while at the same time unwilling (or unable) to work hard, and
learn complex skills, and be productive.

That's odd. The Bureau of Labor statistics show overall rising
productivity, almost doubling since 1980. Using a shovel is easy.
Learning to use a backhoe is hard but it's more productive.
There is such an incredible "safety
net" in the US that people do not really need to worry about starving or
freezing on the street.

Yep, all those lucky duckies eating government cheese. What a sweet
life! I'm a'gonna quit my job and go on welfare.
There is a culture of laziness and indifference
toward education and ethics,

and logic and reason.
so that it has become acceptable and
comfortable to rely on public assistance with no expectation of personal
responsibility and contribution toward society.

Yeah dog, gimme them food stamps. No more arugula for me, nosiree bob.
Mexicans can and do work at physically demanding jobs 8 or more hours a day,
while most Americans are not physically fit enough to do so for more than a
few hours. And they economize by sharing living space, and send much of
their income to their truly needy families who would actually starve and
die.

I mean, hell, our moochers can sleep twelve to a bed, too. And then you
don't need to buy as much heat in the winter. Win!
Workers in countries like China have a strong work ethic, and are willing to
work for low wages because the alternative is severe hardship and
starvation.

Yep, a minimum wage just makes them bums lazy. Once they're staving a
little, they'll work for whatever they can get, you betcha.
They are willing to use public transportation and live in
dormitories supplied by their companies and only visit their homes on
weekends.

And pee where they're standing, too, don't forget that. After a while
they learn to hold it in. No more wasteful bathroom breaks on company
time.
They also have a healthy spirit of fair competition which enhances
the productivity of other companies.

Also the spirit of solitary, poor, nasty, brutish and short.
There are few "corporate raiders" who
take over a company and follow a program which is designed for their own
personal benefit and wealth, while driving the company into bankruptcy and
failure within a few years, at which point they "abandon ship" and go on to
other unethical and greedy conquests.

Oh pshaw, that's the Invisible Hand at work.
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
WTF is going on.

I used to buy 100ft spools of teflon insulated wire for work for about
$30-40 a year or two ago. That was expensive. Prices are doubling
every year or two.

I want some 100ft spools of 22ga teflon hookup wire for my home use, and
the prices range from $66, $77, to $94 for Alpha 5855 at Mouser, Allied,
and DigiKey respectively.

I'm having to consider Ebay, but I don't like to not know the ins.
thickness, stranding, and other details. Some of the MIL stuff has
0.016in insulation, and I like 0.010in.

I wonder if I can do electronics without wire...

I used to buy jacketed surplus cable from junk electronics outlets, then
strip the things to get the conductors.

Maybe I'll have to keep doing it. :-(
PTFE is in short supply from about a year ago. The Chinese undercut the
flurospar market, owned it, then they fucked up (mine explosion) and
there was nobody to take up the slack. You have to love that "most
favored nation." Hey, thank you Shrub.

And you know the deal with copper. These fucking speculators bid up the
price on the options market. Commodities will never be under control
until it is required that your option volume be related to the amount of
copper you actually bought over some period of time. There are
legitimate reasons for options markets, but not for naked bidding.

It doesn't mention PTFE specifically, but fluorspar is an ingredient
that is in the PTFE food chain.
 
M

Mr.CRC

Jan 1, 1970
0
Nico said:
A lot of people are moving to aluminium wiring. Unfortunately
aluminium is hard to solder so we are screwed.


It's not hard to solder with a SnZn alloy and flux from Indium Corp.

I soldered some Al voice coil wires to flex PCBs that I redesigned for
an electro-hydraulic arbitrary engine valve actuator and the solder
flowed like butter onto the Al and the tin plated Cu.

The only trouble is, the wire isn't cored and the flux is corrosive and
nasty toxic. So it wouldn't be suitable for general use.


But there is also no light gauge Al hookup wire (AFIK) for connecting
stuff to little 0.025in square pin contacts etc.
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
You do realize there is a difference between MFN that has to be renewed
and permanent MFN?

"US Grants China Permanent Most Favored Nation Status

On December 27, 2001, US President George W. Bush decided to grant China
permanent trade status, formerly called the “most-favored-nation
treatment.” Bush’s proclamation ended a long history of an annual review
in the US Congress of China’s permanent trade status, removing a major
obstacle to the development of bilateral economic relations and trade
between the US and China. "

It is best not to argue with progressives since they have the facts to
back up their statements. I invite you to leave the dumb shithead neocon
tea-bagger club and join the elite educated progressives.
 
You do realize there is a difference between MFN that has to be renewed
and permanent MFN?

Only in that the permanent MFN doesn't require renewal. The "damage" had
already been done. ...but you don't care about facts, as long as the right
guy gets the credit.
"US Grants China Permanent Most Favored Nation Status

On December 27, 2001, US President George W. Bush decided to grant China
permanent trade status, formerly called the “most-favored-nation
treatment.” Bush’s proclamation ended a long history of an annual review
in the US Congress of China’s permanent trade status, removing a major
obstacle to the development of bilateral economic relations and trade
between the US and China. "

It was long a done deal. Both parties were on board. Sorry, moron.
It is best not to argue with progressives since they have the facts to
back up their statements. I invite you to leave the dumb shithead neocon
tea-bagger club and join the elite educated progressives.

It's best not to argue with progressives (communists) because they never use
facts.
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
Only in that the permanent MFN doesn't require renewal. The "damage" had
already been done. ...but you don't care about facts, as long as the right
guy gets the credit.


It was long a done deal. Both parties were on board. Sorry, moron.


It's best not to argue with progressives (communists) because they never use
facts.
Again, you are totally unclear on the topic at hand. Shrub could have
chosen to go with the yearly renewal which dicked your Chicom buddies
around every year. But no, Shrub, being a Republican and thus totally
corrupt, sold out the US and went for permanent MFN.

Whenever the US has sold out to China, it was always done by the GOP,
starting with Nixon who fucked over Taiwan. You can't deny the facts.

Turn off that FNC because it makes you stupid.
 
S

Spehro Pefhany

Jan 1, 1970
0
At home in the lab I need at most, a few hundred feet of Teflon wire
every year. I go to E-bay and get it real real cheap. Often it's
obviously "cut out of" some previous application (in fact I like
different colors so I often end up with hunks of multicolor
harnesses), other times for just a little more money it's still on the
original spool. Good enough for my projects at home.

At work it's different. Project didn't order enough spare conductors.
25 pair bundles have to be ordered, a few thousand feet continuous.
Lead time on Tefzel like this is typically 9 months to a year. Yep, 9
months to a year. On most every project, the long pole in the tent is
the Tefzel lead time.

Tim.

We use a lot of the PTFE-Polymide-PTFE wire- as you say, long lead
times. Lots of folks are scared of Tefzel since this:

http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/sr111/photo.shtml



Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
 
Again, you are totally unclear on the topic at hand. Shrub could have
chosen to go with the yearly renewal which dicked your Chicom buddies
around every year. But no, Shrub, being a Republican and thus totally
corrupt, sold out the US and went for permanent MFN.

Clinton could have decided not to deal with China at all. The Democrats could
have blocked it at *any* time. You really are dense.
Whenever the US has sold out to China, it was always done by the GOP,
starting with Nixon who fucked over Taiwan. You can't deny the facts.

Now you're just lying. But that's expected from lefties.
Turn off that FNC because it makes you stupid.

You must watch a *lot*.
 
J

Jamie

Jan 1, 1970
0
Spehro said:
We use a lot of the PTFE-Polymide-PTFE wire- as you say, long lead
times. Lots of folks are scared of Tefzel since this:

http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/sr111/photo.shtml



Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
Hmm
We make Tefzel products, I have no idea if our products were in that
that incident?

As for the PTFE (FEP) products, there is usually a maximum amount of
material that can be processed per year in the US. The trick is to get
your share and maybe some of the competitions share, before you hit the
limit.

Then there is the import markets which also has a limit..

Jamie
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
Nixon got China in the United Nations, but the backroom deal was to kick
out Taiwan. Were you home schooled by tea baggers?

-------
Oct 25, 1971:

In a dramatic reversal of its long-standing commitment to the
Nationalist Chinese government
of Taiwan, and a policy of non-recognition of the communist People's
Republic of China (PRC),
America's U.N. representatives vote to seat the PRC as a permanent
member. Over American
objections, Taiwan was expelled.
The reasons for the apparently drastic change in U.S. policy were not
hard to discern. The
United States had come to value closer relations with the PRC more than
its historical
commitment to Taiwan. U.S. interest in having the PRC's help in
resolving the sticky
Vietnam situation; the goal of using U.S. influence with the PRC as
diplomatic leverage
against the Soviets; and the desire for lucrative economic relations
with the PRC,
were all factors in the U.S. decision. Relations with the PRC thereupon
soared,
highlighted by President Richard Nixon's visit to China in 1972. Not
surprisingly,
diplomatic relations with Taiwan noticeably cooled, though the United
States still
publicly avowed that it would defend Taiwan if it were attacked.
 
Nixon got China in the United Nations, but the backroom deal was to kick
out Taiwan. Were you home schooled by tea baggers?

Ah, you admit that you're full of shit, now what to move the goal posts. Too
bad, you've already been outed as an idiot.
-------
Oct 25, 1971:

In a dramatic reversal of its long-standing commitment to the
Nationalist Chinese government
of Taiwan, and a policy of non-recognition of the communist People's
Republic of China (PRC),
America's U.N. representatives vote to seat the PRC as a permanent
member. Over American
objections, Taiwan was expelled.
The reasons for the apparently drastic change in U.S. policy were not
hard to discern. The
United States had come to value closer relations with the PRC more than
its historical
commitment to Taiwan. U.S. interest in having the PRC's help in
resolving the sticky
Vietnam situation; the goal of using U.S. influence with the PRC as
diplomatic leverage
against the Soviets; and the desire for lucrative economic relations
with the PRC,
were all factors in the U.S. decision. Relations with the PRC thereupon
soared,
highlighted by President Richard Nixon's visit to China in 1972. Not
surprisingly,
diplomatic relations with Taiwan noticeably cooled, though the United
States still
publicly avowed that it would defend Taiwan if it were attacked.

You deal in lefty lies. When caught, change the subject. That's a lefty.
 
J

josephkk

Jan 1, 1970
0
You do realize there is a difference between MFN that has to be renewed
and permanent MFN?

"US Grants China Permanent Most Favored Nation Status

On December 27, 2001, US President George W. Bush decided to grant China
permanent trade status, formerly called the “most-favored-nation
treatment.” Bush’s proclamation ended a long history of an annual review
in the US Congress of China’s permanent trade status, removing a major
obstacle to the development of bilateral economic relations and trade
between the US and China. "

It is best not to argue with progressives since they have the facts to
back up their statements. I invite you to leave the dumb shithead neocon
tea-bagger club and join the elite educated progressives.

Liberals/progressives knowledgeable? Hardly. They are even worse
shitheads than neocons.

?-)
 
J

josephkk

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hmm
We make Tefzel products, I have no idea if our products were in that
that incident?

As for the PTFE (FEP) products, there is usually a maximum amount of
material that can be processed per year in the US. The trick is to get
your share and maybe some of the competitions share, before you hit the
limit.

Then there is the import markets which also has a limit..

Jamie
Aren't nutter tree hugger regulations great?

?-)
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
You actually can lead a horse to water. However, you can't give a tea
bagger knowledge and expect them to understand it.

I have bitched slapped you three times, yet you think you have won. Time
to put down that meth pipe.
 
M

miso

Jan 1, 1970
0
Look at Rhodes scholars and Nobel prize winners. All lefties.
 
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