Generator recomendations

[vaughn]

I'm back with a little time, This oil spill is wreaking havoc on life and
business.

Sorry to hear about that, the whole situation stinks.

But a little slower now.

With business, that is not always a good thing.>

I don't disagree with that. (you need a plan)

But I haven't seen one yet

It is only since we have had such an attack on the American way

Sorry, that that's just nonsense talk. Please be more specific.

of life, the freedoms we have

In my lifetime, there is no administration that has mounted such an attack on
personal liberties as the last one. We saw citizens being unlawfully and
secretly spied on, we saw citizens and others locked up without charges and
without access to legal council and we saw the horribly misnamed "Patriot Act"
that threatens our liberty. Why did you folks wait until GWB left office to
start making noise?

, and capitalism

Specifics please?

I believe people should have the right to succeed or fail without undo>
influence of government. Although I do know, the importance of law> to allow
businesses to have a framework of rules to work with each other, (contract
law)
Agree

I think the Tea party has the right ideas about small government, less taxes,
and pro growth. I have attended several Tea Parties and recruit on anyone I
can to come and see what we are about. The Tea Party is fighting a war of
ideas, our president has the wrong ideas for America.

So far, I am still waiting to hear any coherent ideas form the Tea Party. So
far, all I am hearing from them is unfocused anger. Sorry, but if you are
looking for my vote, you will need to show me far more than your anger.

Add to that, this is the first year I have ever sent political donations to
candidates

Why? Specifically, what do you expect those folks to do?

I see maybe five fixes for social security,

1-Raise the retirement age-- this has already been started and it is probably
the easiest.
2-Reduce benefits-- yes a huge lobby against that, somewhat greedy in my
mind. I need to pay for them because they passed a program that allowed them
not to pay in enough during there working years to support themselves. Yes,
this was done before I
was born. But I still must pay.

Actually, the problem is mostly in our generation. Until recently, Social
Security has been generating a huge budget surplus that the rest of the
government has been using to help pay for the budget deficit. Only in the last
year or so have they actually started to cash in some of those bonds.

3-Increase workers SS taxes, already 12.% there has got to be a limit. Yes, I
know it is 6.2% for employee and 6.2% for employer, but all comes from the
labor of the worker.

No argument there.

4-Means testing-- If you have saved and built a large nest egg (savings) that
generates a retirement income for you then you SS check will reduded or
eliminated.

I don't agree with that one. That gives a negative incentive for savings, in a
country where we already don't save near enough.

Also known as penalizing workers that save for there future. Especially hard
on middle class workers that scrimped and saved there whole life and have
savings and then to get penalized because they tried to get ahead. (that would
be me

And me.

5--- Eliminate any COLA's until the program is on a solid footing.

I am very lukewarm on that one. I have lived through double-digit inflation and
know what it does!. That would make retiring a very risky business. Do the
math! Do a spread sheet and see what a few years of 10% inflation would do to
you if you had a truly fixed income, but the entire working class were still
getting regular pay raises that were denied to you. Remember, inflation is
also a huge drain on the spending power of your savings, so savings are scant
protection against inflation.
In general, we are on the same page when it comes to SS, even though I stand to
lose in the short term from any reforms.

....

or helped in anyway to reduce the size of government.

All Presidential candidates pretend to want to reduce the size of government.
Has any ever actually done it?

"Reducing the size of government" is one of those slogans that I tend to listen
to with great skepticism.

boy from Michigan living in Florida.

I live in SE Florida and am originally from Detroit.

Vaughn

 

[vaughn]

A set of relays operated by a (battery operated) timer could sequence the
freezer operations.

Not a bad idea (if you really must automate the process) But why "reinvent the
wheel"? You can buy compressor delay timers at any good AC & refrigeration
parts place.
http://www.icmcontrols.com/products/category.php?cat_pk=11 Just get adjustable
ones, or get an assortment of different time delay times.

Vaughn

 

[vaughn]

Of course what happened on this rig started during the previous
administration.

And of course, bith our previous President AND Vice President were both involved
with the oil industry befor they took office. In retrospect, Obama probably
didn't give the MMA enough scruitny, Since there has been no particular
political noise coming form that sector, it is easy to see how we have been
lulled into complacency. (Full Disclosure: I have always been generally in
favor of oil drilling, assuming all proper precautions are taken)

Cozy relationships with the industry being regulated are nothing new, in fact
this validates my point that oversight would be questionable at best. As to
these spot tours of rigs, I'd sure like to see how often this one was "toured"

Me too.

Vaughn

 

[Malcom \Mal\ Reynolds]

That is the theory. To the best of my knowledge, I haven't heard of anyone
form
MMS being on that drilling rig. Kind of hard to monitor things that way.

They don't live on the rig. They firstly are responsible for all
offshore leases; second, they review and approve/disapprove all plans
for the proposed well as well as inspecting or reviewing the
materials, tubules, used on the well. Finally they make spot tours of
the rig and check to ensure that the proposed drilling and materials
schedule are followed.



I know that there hasn't been any mention of MMS and it certainly
sounds as though the government doesn't want to publicize the fact
that a government agency is any way involved in the management of the
well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minerals_Management_Service

And scroll down to the list of MMS personnel that found plus jobs in
the industry and the various items that MMS did not enforce. It is
quite obvious why OBama has made no mention of the agency.

Cheers,

John B.
(johnbslocombatgmaildotcom)[/QUOTE]

Of course what happened on this rig started during the previous administration.
Cozy relationships with the industry being regulated are nothing new, in fact
this validates my point that oversight would be questionable at best. As to
these spot tours of rigs, I'd sure like to see how often this one was "toured"

--

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[(PeteCresswell)]

Per vaughn:

I am very lukewarm on that one. I have lived through double-digit inflation and
know what it does!. That would make retiring a very risky business. Do the
math! Do a spread sheet and see what a few years of 10% inflation would do to
you if you had a truly fixed income, but the entire working class were still
getting regular pay raises that were denied to you. Remember, inflation is
also a huge drain on the spending power of your savings, so savings are scant
protection against inflation.

I have never heard it expressed, but it seems to me one can view
inflation as an involuntary wealth transfer: from the people on
the bottom to the people above them economically.

To wit: those with steady jobs don't get their taxes raised to
cover the deficit - because any politician running on a platform
of "We need to raise taxes and cut entitlements" doesn't have
even the smallest chance of being elected - much less nominated.

Instead, in lieu of responsible fiscal policy, the deficit is
gradually repudiated through inflation.

Those employed people feel minimal pain because their wages rise
with inflation.

Those on fixed incomes are ruined and die in poverty.

Like Pogo said: "...the enemy is us..."

 

[vaughn]

I have never heard it expressed, but it seems to me one can view
inflation as an involuntary wealth transfer: from the people on
the bottom to the people above them economically.

Not entirely. Inflation can be thought of as "the working man's friend"
because wages tend to rise with inflation while fixed interest debt melts away!
Just think what a few years of 10% inflation does to your fixed mortgage. A
payment that was (perhaps) up to 50% of your income dwindles away to mere pocket
change in just a few years.

That is a transfer of wealth in the downward direction.

To wit: those with steady jobs don't get their taxes raised to
cover the deficit - because any politician running on a platform
of "We need to raise taxes and cut entitlements" doesn't have
even the smallest chance of being elected - much less nominated.

True enough.

Instead, in lieu of responsible fiscal policy, the deficit is
gradually repudiated through inflation.

For savers, inflation is an invisible tax. The government is literally reaching
into your savings account and stealing value. Yes, interest rates do tend to go
up in inflationary times, but the interest never totally offsets inflation so
you still lose value...PLUS YOU MUST PAY INCOME TAX ON THE INTEREST. It is a
terrible deal.

Those employed people feel minimal pain because their wages rise
with inflation.
Exactly

Those on fixed incomes are ruined and die in poverty.

Except for SS payments (which are indexed) that is too true.

That is why I am delaying drawing SS benefits, to make the SS part of my future
income as large as possible; specifically because SS is indexed for inflation.
I have seen double-digit inflation and know what happens. At the end of the
Clinton administration, it looked like inflation may have been tamed for the
rest of my life, but the GWB deficit quickly changed that outlook.

Vaughn

 

[Bob F]

Not a bad idea (if you really must automate the process) But why
"reinvent the wheel"? You can buy compressor delay timers at any
good AC & refrigeration parts place.
http://www.icmcontrols.com/products/category.php?cat_pk=11 Just get
adjustable ones, or get an assortment of different time delay times.

He needs to operate the units at different times, not just separate the startup
surges, I suspect.

 

[amdx]

I'm looking for a real breakdown of diesel vs. propane, in the
15-25KW range. Obviously, [for a given fuel cost] there will be
some # of hours, below which propane wins and above that, diesel does.

I need to be able to quantify that. Has anyone seen a case study?

--
A host is a host from coast to [email protected]
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

Well, on that and a different subject, I looked at Miller welders today.
The Bobcat 250 is $3,474 + $244tx = $3,718 9500 watts continuous,
11,000 peak. Only $300 more than the Honda and an extra 3500 watt
capability.
Disadvantages , it is louder, uses more fuel, slightly more costly (unless
I mail order out of state, no taxes)
Advantages, more capacity, It's a welder, should hold value, can be sold as
a little used welder.

Any opinions?
Mike

 

[vaughn]

Disadvantages , it is louder, uses more fuel, slightly more costly (unless I
mail order out of state, no taxes)
Advantages, more capacity, It's a welder, should hold value, can be sold as a
little used welder.

Any opinions?

It depends on lots of things. First, how often do you need a portable welder?
If the answer is "never" or even "rarely" then why pay more? Second; what about
the engine? For example: is it name brand or Chinese? What kind of reputation
does that engine have in the industry?

Regardless, you will likely need to search beyond this group for reviews on that
unit.

Vaughn

 

[amdx]

It depends on lots of things. First, how often do you need a portable
welder? If the answer is "never" or even "rarely" then why pay more?
Second; what about the engine? For example: is it name brand or Chinese?
What kind of reputation does that engine have in the industry?

Regardless, you will likely need to search beyond this group for reviews
on that unit.

Vaughn

Good questions, for the gas unit it looks like you can pick between a
Kohler or a
Subaru engine, I don't have info on any price difference.
They offer a Kobota diesel, again no price info. I have been told the
diesel is a
great engine, but That eliminates using the fuel in my vehicles if we had a
long power
outage.
As for the welder, not something I need, but I thought it would bring a
better resale
price if the we end up closing the business. I think $200 now could easily
be made
up selling a welder/generator later.
I still need to do some on line shopping I might find it cheaper and avoid
the sales tax.
Later, Mike

 

[(PeteCresswell)]

Per vaughn:

Except for SS payments (which are indexed) that is too true.

Somebody who knows: correct me... but my understanding is that
they're cooking the books on SS COLA by exempting fuel and food
from the cost-of-living computation.

 

[vaughn]

Somebody who knows: correct me... but my understanding is that
they're cooking the books on SS COLA by exempting fuel and food
from the cost-of-living computation.

I am not sure of the details, but yes, they are "cooking the books". Of course,
if they stopped their shenanigans, then the SS fund would be in trouble that
much quicker.

Vaughn

 

[amdx]

Frankly I doubt what you say, if for no other reason then that the
guys most intimately involved, the drillers and the floor crew are all
well aware of what will likely happen to them in the event of a blow
out. And it did.

Another point is that before drilling in U.S. waters there a lot of
regulations that must be complied with: Here is a part of a e-mail I
received from a friend who is a Rig Supervisor (company man) in the
off shore drilling business:

quote:

Any oil company operating in the USA deals with governmental
regulations, similar to Indonesia but much more strict. They have to
be a bona fide company to acquire a lease to explore on. PT
Holeinthewall would definitely get turned down. Then before they
drill, they have to submit their plans to a government body called MMS
(Mineral Management Service). It used to be the USGS (United States
Geological Service) but MMS was created about 1982, when I was in the
US taking some seminars in Texas and Louisiana. Although they have a
lot of dead beats working for them, much like any government
department, that drilling program is well screened and scrutinized
before an oil company can start drilling. Any changes to that drilling
program have to be approved first. During the drilling, MMS does
'surprise' helicopter trips to rigs to check to see if the required
casing, BOP, drilling equipment has been tested before it's tested
expiry dates. They are serious! I did a well control school in
Lafayette and a lot of the questions on the exam pertained to US rules
and regulations. Didn't mean anything to me because I was never going
to work in the USA, but I had to memorize them to pass.

Unquote:

You will notice that there has been no mention of the MMS in the
president's news announcements.

This is not to say that there were no mistakes but I doubt that it was
the drilling crew that deliberately made them and the government was
responsible for oversight, and likely did carry out the inspections
that were required.

John B. Slocomb
(johnbslocombatgmaildotcom)

The president has backed up what I have been saying for three weeks.
BP does not want to drill 50 miles off shore in 5000 ft of water!
It is very expensive to get that oil, they would much rather drill for
cheaper oil on land or in shallow water. The environmentalist and nimbys
have forced the deep water drilling. Here's what the president had to say
in the June 8 interview with Matt Lauer,
PRESIDENT OBAMA: -- on new drilling. The production wells that are already
pumping oil, those don't seem to be the problem. The problem has to do with
actually drilling and starting a new well. So we've put a moratorium on new
wells. Shallow wells aren't a problem because the risers essentially come up
above the water. So if something like this happened in a shallow-water well,
then folks would just get up on the platform and they would start fixing it
and it would be shut down fairly quickly.

What we don't have right now is an assurance that in these incredible
depths, a mile down, and then they're drilling another three miles down to
get to oil --

Is this some common sense creeping into the administration?

Mike

 

[Malcom \Mal\ Reynolds]

Per vaughn:

Somebody who knows: correct me... but my understanding is that
they're cooking the books on SS COLA by exempting fuel and food
from the cost-of-living computation.

If that's so, the COLA would tend to be negative, at least for the the last year
or so, and guess what, it was.

 

[vaughn]

But that smells too much like a union probably.

Careful! There are laws that cover anti-competitive behavior by business.
Labor can organize and bargain collectively, but business can't always do the
same thing. Don't know if that applies to a fishermen.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competition_law

Vaughn

 

[Malcom \Mal\ Reynolds]

Hard to say. I know it's been tried and there are some fishing
collectives, but getting boat captains to agree on anything is like
hearding cats. They are all lords of their domain -- even more so than
farmers or ranchers ! At the moment there is a loose association that
sends the five or so captains to do the negotiation for the whole PNW
crab prices (my captain being one this year).

I think what would help is a fund that each boat pays into so when the
price is too low, we can all hold out 'go on strike' if you will. That
fund is used to help the guys make payments during negotiation.

THe big guys know if we threaten to hold out for a better price enough
fishermen will have to fold and go fishing just to make payments so we
have very little negotiation room.

But that smells too much like a union probably.

Darwins "Evolution of the Species" Also applies to business. Shame that the
Captains will be the last to find that out.

 

[Bruce in alaska]

Careful! There are laws that cover anti-competitive behavior by business.
Labor can organize and bargain collectively, but business can't always do the
same thing. Don't know if that applies to a fishermen.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competition_law

Vaughn

Absolutely, it applies to fishermen, and Fish Buyers... There have been
some really BIG lawsuits over Price Fixing in the Fish Biz, up here in
alaska. Collusion can get you a nice stay in the GrayBar Hotel.

 

[Malcom \Mal\ Reynolds]

Absolutely, it applies to fishermen, and Fish Buyers... There have been
some really BIG lawsuits over Price Fixing in the Fish Biz, up here in
alaska. Collusion can get you a nice stay in the GrayBar Hotel.

Of course, co-operatives, such as Blue Diamond and Sunkist are exempt

 

[vaughn]

When they are done, you see half the apples on the ground and the
adjacent rows of Strawberry bushes have been all ruined by the ladders
and workers stepping on them. The contract proved meaningless.

If your feelings are correct, then the whole mess is YOUR fault, because
you like apples.

What were you thinking when you developed a taste for apples? Obviously
not much. Next time, act more responsibly.

Fun discussion, but a terrible example. In that case, the "apple lover"/ grove
owner clearly failed in his duty to check on the performance of the crew he
hired. He certainly shares in the blame.

All of our decisions have "externalities" connected to them. Like it of not,
when we choose to burn more fuel, we are choosing to help pollute our world just
a bit more, are choosing to increase the trade deficit, choosing to increase the
power of some folks who really don't like us, and even choosing to do some good
things like employing folks in the oil industry who might not otherwise have a
job.

We share some of the blame for creating the economic environment that led to the
Gulf disaster.

Vaughn

 

[Malcom \Mal\ Reynolds]

Yeah you guys have me thinking. I was only involved in the price
negotation for the dungie opener in the periphery. Mostly just what
Captain Tyler was bitching and yelling about, but it seems to me that the
buyers all came together and presented a price, and the five captains
countered with another price. Then a bunch of people yammered and gave
data on the sample pots and the projected numbers and so on.

it seems to me that 3-4 giant buyers were colluding together by
presenting a single price, and the captains were representing the
hundreds of small boats countering with another. Eventually the captains
had to agree to a price rather than let the arguing go on because they
knew that the guys they represent couldn't hold out much longer due to
bills that needed paid. While the big buyers seemed fine with waiting
longer, knowing that enough boats would be forced break early (go
fishing) and that would trounce the whole process. This price, once set,
was the price paid for every crab up and down the coast for all buyers
and by all the boats for at least 3 states. Then the price changes
naturally 2-3 weeks into the season, but the seasoning opening price sets
the initial buy (when the pots are the fullest and the best crab are
being brought in).

like this year we pulled 72k lbs in the first week or so
http://www.theoceanharvest.com/content/dungeness-season-2009-2010-so-
many-crab

which is crazy good for a 34 foot boat -- we had to deck load nearly each
trip. So that initial price can make or break a season for sure.


Next year I'm going to get the Capt to put me in as an observer and maybe
i'll learn more about what's going on. The whole thing seemed fishy to
me (pun intended)

cheers

-zachary

wow this thread certainly felt some drift huh? no matters it's good
stuff.

Personally, while I can think of any number of ways to change what is happening,
in such a manner to benefit the fishermen, the best observation I can make that
would undoubtedly be the most cost effective, would be to approach any and all
Universities that are convenient and find one or more professors in one or more
areas (business, law, economics, even food) and see if they are in any way
interested in studying the problem and suggesting tactics to use or paths to
take...they might even assign the problem as a class project or give you a
couple of interns.

Couldn't hurt, might help.

But then again there are so many ways to counter the buyers (just out of
curiosity, are the buyers just American or do they include European and Asian?)

--

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blandit.