fuses on speakers

[exxos]

Hi all,

I ran a amplifier via a fuse on the speaker and while the audio was loud it
wasn't as loud as it should be, I took the fuse out (soldered over it) and
the sound was much greater. For testing I also was running the mains input
via a 2A variac (which I also took out). The speaker fuse was a regular
1.25" 2A and Variac was a small 2A type. Current was the mains was just over
1A so I don't think the Variac was causing problems there... Which leaves
the fuse limiting the power ?! I did manage to blow the fuse so power in
watts must have been over 200watts....

Anyway, has anyone heard of strange things as fuses limiting audio power ? I
seem to recall reading a article a while ago that fuses on speakers was a
bad idea or something... Also I recall seeing speaker fuses listed *as*
speaker fuses... I wonder if they actually have to be a special type...
anyone come across anything like this ?

Cheers,
Chris

 

[Don Bruder]

Hi all,

I ran a amplifier via a fuse on the speaker and while the audio was loud it
wasn't as loud as it should be, I took the fuse out (soldered over it) and
the sound was much greater. For testing I also was running the mains input
via a 2A variac (which I also took out). The speaker fuse was a regular
1.25" 2A and Variac was a small 2A type. Current was the mains was just over
1A so I don't think the Variac was causing problems there... Which leaves
the fuse limiting the power ?! I did manage to blow the fuse so power in
watts must have been over 200watts....

Anyway, has anyone heard of strange things as fuses limiting audio power ? I
seem to recall reading a article a while ago that fuses on speakers was a
bad idea or something... Also I recall seeing speaker fuses listed *as*
speaker fuses... I wonder if they actually have to be a special type...
anyone come across anything like this ?

Cheers,
Chris

Some fuses (particularly the "slo-blow" type) have the unintended
side-effect of being inductors due to the way they're constructed -
Namely, a bit of fuse-wire coiled on a form of some type.

I would expect these to be a *POTENTIALLY* bad thing for speaker/audio
use - Exact measurement of "how bad" would almost certainly depend on
what frequencies are being sent through them, among other considerations.

"Speaker" fuses are almost certainly constructed so as to be "zero
inductance" - A straight chunk of fuse wire, rather than a coil.

 

[exxos]

Some fuses (particularly the "slo-blow" type) have the unintended
side-effect of being inductors due to the way they're constructed -
Namely, a bit of fuse-wire coiled on a form of some type.

I would expect these to be a *POTENTIALLY* bad thing for speaker/audio
use - Exact measurement of "how bad" would almost certainly depend on
what frequencies are being sent through them, among other considerations.

"Speaker" fuses are almost certainly constructed so as to be "zero
inductance" - A straight chunk of fuse wire, rather than a coil.

hmmm, these ones I am using are a straight wire cap to cap, they are time
delay types aswell, I guess there must be *something* different with speaker
fuses over normal fuses as they are silly money at that.

Chris

 

[CWatters]

hmmm, these ones I am using are a straight wire cap to cap, they are time

delay types aswell, I guess there must be *something* different with speaker
fuses over normal fuses as they are silly money at that.

Fuses have resistance. Sometimes several Ohms. Compare with an 8 Ohm
speaker.

 

[exxos]

Fuses have resistance. Sometimes several Ohms. Compare with an 8 Ohm
speaker.

the 2amp fuses measure 0.1ohms, the 1amp fuses measure 0.3ohms....

Chris

 

[Tomi Holger Engdahl]

Hi all,

I ran a amplifier via a fuse on the speaker and while the audio was loud it
wasn't as loud as it should be, I took the fuse out (soldered over it) and
the sound was much greater. For testing I also was running the mains input
via a 2A variac (which I also took out). The speaker fuse was a regular
1.25" 2A and Variac was a small 2A type.

I don't think that a regular 2A fuse would have much effect on the
sound volume. Based on the data at
http://www.cooperet.com/library/products/GMA_Specs.pdf
it looks like a fast acting 2A fuse has less than 0.1 ohms
resistance and maximum of 250 mV voltage drop (this is when
it is heavily loaded). The other fuse types like slow flow etc..
could have slightly different resistances.

Those resistances of the fue should not have any great attenuation
on the sound. I think the small sound attenuation caused by the
fuse itse sould not be easily heard on the sound volume...
the difference in sound volue would be a smll fraction of decibel,
something so low that you could berely hear it, definately not a
great difference. The fuse may have some other aspects of
sound of the speaker, that coudl be heard or not.

If having the fuse at place has very considerable effect on
the sound volume, I quess that there would be some other reasons
for that than jut the fuse itself. Maybe the old fuse holder is
makign bad connection to fuse, and there is considerable resistance
there... that could have some considerable effect, both on sound
and heating of the fuse holder...

Current was the mains was just over
1A so I don't think the Variac was causing problems there...

Using variac between maisn power and the equipment can have effect
that can be heard. If you do comparisions of with and wihtout fuse,
use the same powering setup (both times with or without variac).

Which leaves
the fuse limiting the power ?! I did manage to blow the fuse so power in
watts must have been over 200watts....

Fuse starts to limit the power considerable when it blows up.
Before that the fuse power limitation is generally quite small..
There is some small resistance, that can get few times higher
bfore the fuse blows.

Anyway, has anyone heard of strange things as fuses limiting audio power ?

I have heard strange things once when there was an old fuse
holder making bad connection and old almost blown fuse in it.
Repairing those got things right. Repairing in this case
included cleaning the fuse holder with help of contact
spray and some mechanical work. And then putting in brand
new fuse.

I
seem to recall reading a article a while ago that fuses on speakers was a
bad idea or something...

Having fuses on the speaker line is not the best idea.
The fuse has some resistance.. and that resistance can change
somewhat depending how hot the fuise gets during the use.

Also I recall seeing speaker fuses listed *as*
speaker fuses... I wonder if they actually have to be a special type...
anyone come across anything like this ?

I don't rememeber seeing anything that is listed as speaker fuses.

 

[CWatters]

the 2amp fuses measure 0.1ohms, the 1amp fuses measure 0.3ohms....

Chris

Just had another look at your OP. Seems you changed two things at once? So
you can't be sure which it was (fuse or variac) that caused the prob. Try
one at a time.

 

[exxos]

Just had another look at your OP. Seems you changed two things at once? So
you can't be sure which it was (fuse or variac) that caused the prob. Try
one at a time.

Yeah, my bad for changing 2 things at once, I think I will have to put the
variac back on and see what happens.... can't see how either could effect
the thing though.... will try and retest tomorrow...

chris

 

[exxos]

I don't think that a regular 2A fuse would have much effect on the
sound volume. Based on the data at
http://www.cooperet.com/library/products/GMA_Specs.pdf
it looks like a fast acting 2A fuse has less than 0.1 ohms
resistance and maximum of 250 mV voltage drop (this is when
it is heavily loaded). The other fuse types like slow flow etc..
could have slightly different resistances.

Yeah, according to my meter I get 0.3 ohms...

Those resistances of the fue should not have any great attenuation
on the sound. I think the small sound attenuation caused by the
fuse itse sould not be easily heard on the sound volume...
the difference in sound volue would be a smll fraction of decibel,
something so low that you could berely hear it, definately not a
great difference. The fuse may have some other aspects of
sound of the speaker, that coudl be heard or not.

I doubt the fuse could have any effect even on audio frequencys up to 20khz
?

If having the fuse at place has very considerable effect on
the sound volume, I quess that there would be some other reasons
for that than jut the fuse itself. Maybe the old fuse holder is
makign bad connection to fuse, and there is considerable resistance
there... that could have some considerable effect, both on sound
and heating of the fuse holder...

its a new fuse holder, even made a point of using 1.25" fuses and holders to
make sure theres a good connection...

Using variac between maisn power and the equipment can have effect
that can be heard. If you do comparisions of with and wihtout fuse,
use the same powering setup (both times with or without variac).

I can't see the variac having any effect, the amplifier only pulls just over
1amp on the bass notes, a 2amp variac... ive measued the voltages from it
and everything seems fine there also..

Fuse starts to limit the power considerable when it blows up.
Before that the fuse power limitation is generally quite small..
There is some small resistance, that can get few times higher
bfore the fuse blows.


I have heard strange things once when there was an old fuse
holder making bad connection and old almost blown fuse in it.
Repairing those got things right. Repairing in this case
included cleaning the fuse holder with help of contact
spray and some mechanical work. And then putting in brand
new fuse.

At my old job we used to repair power supplies, we had a power supply where
a 28V rail was only 12V, 28V one side 12V the other... turns out the fuse
had about 7 ohms across it, we never seen anything like that in the 10 years
we was doing them! the fuse was supplying about 2amps current at that
aswell... a new fuse and everything was fine.

Having fuses on the speaker line is not the best idea.
The fuse has some resistance.. and that resistance can change
somewhat depending how hot the fuise gets during the use.

The only thing which seems odd as it seems to limit the entire audio volume,
you would think if it was limiting something that it would limit the bass
which needs the most power... Even if the variac couldn't supply the current
you would expect it to be the same volume on none bassy tracks.... really
strange, fuse or variac it doesn't make much sence.

I don't rememeber seeing anything that is listed as speaker fuses.

they are normally lised in PA audio sections so unless you look for them you
may not have spotted them ?, I didnt even know until I was looking though a
PA section and they listed fuses for speakers, like £8 each of something
stupid like that :-\

Chris

 

[JANA]

A slow blow fuse would be expected to introduce some losses. Slow blow fuses
are generally of a higher resistance than the fast blow ones. A fast blow
may introduce a very small amount of loss, but it should not normally be
great enough for you to hear it.

--

JANA
_____


Hi all,

I ran a amplifier via a fuse on the speaker and while the audio was loud it
wasn't as loud as it should be, I took the fuse out (soldered over it) and
the sound was much greater. For testing I also was running the mains input
via a 2A variac (which I also took out). The speaker fuse was a regular
1.25" 2A and Variac was a small 2A type. Current was the mains was just over
1A so I don't think the Variac was causing problems there... Which leaves
the fuse limiting the power ?! I did manage to blow the fuse so power in
watts must have been over 200watts....

Anyway, has anyone heard of strange things as fuses limiting audio power ? I
seem to recall reading a article a while ago that fuses on speakers was a
bad idea or something... Also I recall seeing speaker fuses listed *as*
speaker fuses... I wonder if they actually have to be a special type...
anyone come across anything like this ?

Cheers,
Chris

 

[larya]

Please put the fuse back in.....
The fuse protects both the amplifier and speaker from excess power to
the speaker...
I used to work, retired, for a tv station.. During my early years, we
got a call to the audio room of the studio.. One speaker was dead.. It
turned out that the fuse, in the speaker cabinet had blown.... It
turned out that the series capacitor, from the amplifier to the speaker
had shorted out... If it wasn't for the fuse the amplifier would have
seen the speaker and would probably had become damaged as well...
If you want more power then get a larger amplifier and speaker system
but please keep the fuse in the speaker cabinet.. It does service a
purpose...
Larry ve3fxq