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Electronics Workbench Version 7

Discussion in 'CAD' started by Tom Burns, Dec 22, 2003.

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  1. Tom Burns

    Tom Burns Guest

    To all,

    Have any of you formed an opinion of the Electronics Workbench packages?
    That would be Multisim, Ultiboard and Ultiroute.

    I have an opportunity to get version 7 for a decent price (about $3500.00),
    but have not used EWB in the past. I am familiar with OrCAD Capture and
    Layout, but they are VERY expensive to own for home use.

    I need to be able to draw complex digital schematics and have decent board
    layout capabilities for 2 to 8 layer boards with BGA and other common SMT
    packages. Forward and back-annotation capability are a must.

    It looks like the Power Pro version of the Electronics Workbench tools suite
    does this effectively, but it's a fair amount of money to spend without
    having used it.

    Any comments from you guys??

    Thanks
    Tom Burns
     
  2. Active8

    Active8 Guest

    Try the demo first. Beat it hard. I tried (breifly) years ago and
    didn't like it. Someone else in this group did like it, so maybe it
    isn't so bad.

    I hope it works for you.

    BRs,
    Mike
     
  3. Duane Hague

    Duane Hague Guest

    Be warned, I got slightly burnt on EWB-V6.x almost two years ago.
    The final "killer" was when I found that Multisim had an un-documented
    300-pin limit on individual drawing symbols. If you want to use the
    larger BGAs, check carefully. I must say that they were very good about
    a "return & refund".

    Good Luck from Duane
     
  4. Jim Thompson

    Jim Thompson Guest

    You ought to approach EMA-EDA and see if they'll cut you a
    "competitive" deal for PSpice, a clearly superior product.

    ...Jim Thompson
     
  5. We bought a copy a few years ago, but it sat almost unused/unusable because of
    its dongle/limited install security. The dongle only allowed something absurd
    like three installs then quits - not worth the trouble messing with it.

    Gary Crowell


    (__ (__ (_____ (______ TM
    (__ (__ (__ (__ (__ (__
    (__ (__ (__ (__ (__
    (__ (__ (__ (________ V1.64
    (__ (__ (__ (__
    (_____ (____ (__ (__ Freeware CP/CG Calculator
    (____ (______ (__ (c)1996 Gary A. Crowell Sr.

    http://myweb.cableone.net/cjcrowell
     
  6. Tom Burns

    Tom Burns Guest

    Thanks Gary,

    I have that old dongle-based version myself. I wasn't too impressed then
    and didn't the program much. But they have changed so much, and added so
    many new features. You can import OrCAD files, create microvias, specify
    controlled impedance traces, etc. Supposedly do cross-probing from your PCB
    layout to the schematic so you can see what effet your board layout is
    having on signal integrity for high-speed design.

    Oh, and they don't require a dongle anymore.

    I went ahead and sprung for the Power Pro package. It should arrive in a
    few days. I'll post a message on how it compares to OrCAD Capture and
    Layout once I get used to the new version a bit.

    Regards,
    Tom
     
  7. Hi,

    i must say that i am a beginner in the field of simulation.
    I saw more times that Multisim is easy to use and i wanted to try it.
    So i downloaded the Multisim 7 Demo on their site and i must say that
    it is very simple to use and i liked these virtual instruments.
    I saw the price of that software and said, wow it must be good for
    that money.
    On the university, however we have Orcad and i heard that this should
    also be very good.
    So i thought both are good, but Multisim 7 looks more friendly to me
    as a beginner.
    So i really wanted to buy this software.
    Then one day i had to solve a very easy problem; so i solved it first
    on the paper and then i wanted to check what the simulation software
    says about that.
    I built up the circuit and simulated it, but i got a different voltage
    compared to that i calculated.
    So i thought either i made a mistake in building up the circuit or I
    calculated it wrongly.
    I checked the circuit in Multisim 7 more times but everything seemed
    to be correct to me.
    I checked my calculation with Maple and everything seemed to be
    correct.
    So i called Electronics Workbench and first they said me it can only
    be my mistake than one of their engineers asked me if i could send him
    the schematic; so i made a screenshot and sent it.
    Next day i got the response that i made the mistake.
    Let me first explain you which circuit i am talking about, so you can
    follow better.
    The circuit consists of a rotary circuit generator (sorry for my
    englich if it's wrong); the 3 voltages of the generator are rotating
    to the right side and it is a symmetric generator.
    after that you have some loads; and the aim is to calculate a voltage.
    And because you still don't know how the ciruit looks like one of my
    good friends at the unversity made this circuit with Orcad and sent me
    the netlist.
    He said, the netlist is the best way to describe a circuit.
    so here is it:

    * source PRCIR
    R_R2 N01244 N01268 40
    V_V1 N00488 0
    +SIN 0 230 50 0 0 0
    R_R3 N00525 N01222 160
    R_R4 N00980 N01409 80
    R_R5 N00960 N01268 20
    V_V2 N00525 0
    +SIN 0 230 50 0 0 240
    C_C1 N01409 N00960 17.683uF
    V_V3 N00980 0
    +SIN 0 230 50 0 0 120
    L_L1 N01222 N01268 0.190986H
    R_R1 N00488 N01244 250

    And the voltage i want to calculate is the voltage on R1.
    My calculation says: the peek value of this voltage after a long time
    is 314 V.
    But Multisim said sth. about 109V.
    So i got the response from Electronics Workbench next day that i made
    the mistake and i can't build the circuit the way i did, because i had
    to use the implemented rotary current generator from multisim 7 and
    then i get the right results.
    Then i tried it and i really got the results i calculated but i also
    considered that the generator which is implemented in Multisim is left
    turning ( with left turning i mean first voltage phase: 0° ; 2.voltage
    phase: 120° 3. voltage phase: 240°); So it was not the same circuit i
    built up and calculated with Maple.
    So i calculated it with Maple for a left turning generator and i got
    109 V for
    the voltage.
    So Multisim 7 gives me 109 V for right turning and 314 V for the left
    turning generator over R1.
    Maple gives me 314 V for the right turning and 109 V for the left
    turning system.
    My friend from university with the power of Orcad gives me the same
    Maple gives me.
    And i give you the netlist and you can build up the circuit in
    Multisim and check it; and you can calulate it on your own.
    O i forgot to say: I then wrote an email to Electronics Workbench. The
    response was: We don't have to show you that our software works.
    Everybody uses it so it works. We can't help you more or you pay us
    for support.
    So i don't like Multisim and i'll dear go to my university and use
    Oracad but i won't give money for Multisim.

    Have a nice day
    Bye
     
  8. Chaos Master

    Chaos Master Guest

    Stefan Schmidt[] said this in sci.electronics.cad, at 30 Dec
    2003 19:04:39 -0800, in article <>.
    I can prove it. And thus I reply:

    [snip Multisim rant]

    http://www.linear.com/ get LTSpice - one of the best simulators - free

    or

    http://www.catena.uk.com/ SIMetrix - excellent software, expensive (starts at U$$
    2500 last time I checked - and that's for the version without IC design support)
    and somewhat buggy (sometimes, it loses communication between interface/simulator)
    but demo allows you to do quite big circuits. Just get some models (e.g.
    Zetex/Philips/TI libs), load them and you're ready to go.

    or

    http://www.anasoft.co.uk/ SuperSpice - also very good.

    PS: I have NO, NONE, ZERO, 00000, 0.000, 0E+00, 0d0+0, ZIP, ZILCH, NENHUMA,
    NINGUÑA, NOP, NOPE, relations to any software/device manufacturer.
     
  9. If you want free support, by a real analogue design engineer, then I
    will suggest the obvious, SuperSpice:)

    http://www.anasoft.co.uk

    Kevin Aylward

    http://www.anasoft.co.uk
    SuperSpice, a very affordable Mixed-Mode
    Windows Simulator with Schematic Capture,
    Waveform Display, FFT's and Filter Design.

    That which is mostly observed, is that which replicates the most.
    http://www.anasoft.co.uk/replicators/index.html
     
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