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Color code for home alarm wiring

Discussion in 'Security Alarms' started by [email protected], Feb 24, 2006.

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  1. Guest

    I am building a new home and it comes standard with a alarm pre-wire.
    I have over 30 years experience with electronics, but not with alarms.
    I plan to buy a Power 832 or vista-20P and install it myself. Could
    someone provide me the standard wiring color code, or point me to a
    web site.

    Thanks for any help or advise, Bob T
     
  2. You are on your own figuring the wiring out because many prewires i have
    seen are deliberately fooled with to keep DYI from working on it.
    you are going to have to use a ohm meter and meter the wiring out.
    The standard wiring code notmally is red is pos neg is black and white and
    green is the trip loop but iyou can find all different combinations in
    systems.

    goodluck.
     
  3. Crash Gordon

    Crash Gordon Guest

    There's not standard per se. A lot use red/black for power, yellow/green or
    white/green for the loop.

    Every now and then I'll run across some takeover that used the total
    opposite scheme which always drives me nuts as it's not logical to me



    |I am building a new home and it comes standard with a alarm pre-wire.
    | I have over 30 years experience with electronics, but not with alarms.
    | I plan to buy a Power 832 or vista-20P and install it myself. Could
    | someone provide me the standard wiring color code, or point me to a
    | web site.
    |
    | Thanks for any help or advise, Bob T
    |
     
  4. I am building a new home and it comes standard with a alarm pre-wire.
    For most systems the wiring is simple enough. Using 22/4 solid
    cable, red is +12V; black is -12V; white or yellow is zone return
    and green is common. Keypad runs are similar, except that green
    and yellow (or white) are for data.
    You're welcome. I have an online alarm store called
    www.BassBurglarAlarms.com

    --

    Regards,
    Robert L Bass

    Bass Burglar Alarms
    The Online DIY Store
    http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
     
  5. Bob Worthy

    Bob Worthy Guest

    in message

    or stranded. I see more problems with solid down the road, than with
    stranded, but that is open to opinions. Nothing says you have to use one
    over the other.
    of course you do. You advertise it every chance you get here on the
    newsgroup

    called
    Check B B B in Sarasota, Florida.
     
  6. Crash Gordon

    Crash Gordon Guest

    i've always preferred solid over stranded for 90% of my installs...but fail
    to see how you'd color code differently for stranded vs. solid :))

    Years ago ADT wire used to have blue instead of green (I think it was
    green)...boy that through my installers into a tizzy :-0 --- I bought
    hundreds of thousands of feet of it since no one wanted non-standard colored
    wire...what a deal I got!






    |
    | "Robert L Bass" wrote in message
    |
    |
    | > For most systems the wiring is simple enough. Using 22/4 solid
    |
    | or stranded. I see more problems with solid down the road, than with
    | stranded, but that is open to opinions. Nothing says you have to use one
    | over the other.
    |
    | > cable, red is +12V; black is -12V; white or yellow is zone return
    | > and green is common. Keypad runs are similar, except that green
    | > and yellow (or white) are for data.
    | >
    | > > Thanks for any help or advise, Bob T
    | >
    | > You're welcome. I have an online alarm store
    |
    | of course you do. You advertise it every chance you get here on the
    | newsgroup
    |
    | called
    | > www.Bigass Bass Bungler Alarms.com
    | Check B B B in Sarasota, Florida.
    |
    |
    |
     
  7. Bob La Londe

    Bob La Londe Guest

    There are advantages and disadvanatages. I can't say I have seen any
    problems with solid over stranded once an installation is complete. There
    are a couple things that enter in for a prewire during construction. Any
    wire tags that wind up hanging out of doors or windows tend to get torn up
    from opening and closing. The stranded tends to hold up marginally better
    to this abuse. Unfortunatley the stranded is much more limp making it
    difficult to leave a bit of slack up in the wall or ceiling. I use the
    solid because I can make an accordiin bend back and forth in my hand about
    five times and leave it inside the frame of the house. This gives me abut 2
    feet of slack to work with. When I come back to do a tie down I grab the
    wire hanging out of the hole and pull it down. Then I completely cut off
    the stub that was sticking out. This totally eliminates any wire damaged
    from the opening and closing of the door or window.

    It has taken me some time to education the construction supervisors and the
    door and window trim guys I work with but I have most of them pretty well
    trained. I don't know how many 3/8 drill bits I have given away to guys I
    have cornered and explained that I will invoice for charge backs if I have
    to cut a hole in the wall to find my wire, but I have very few problems with
    my installs.

    I even have most of the drywall and lathe guys watching out for my boxes.
    About ten years ago I had a drywall guy cover half dozen boxes on three
    houses in a row. I tried to talk to him about it and all I got was a loud
    guffaw! "Haw Haw HAW!" About the thrid gufaaw he broke the dry wall in two
    walls. He accidentally fell down and when he fell he went right between the
    studs in the first wall and smashed into another wall. When I helped him up
    I might have accidentally walked through another section drywall in the same
    wall with my shoulder so I get to him quickly and help him up. I year or
    two ago I stared telling that story around construction sites for
    contractors I work with regularly. My drywall problems still happen, but
    its almost always an honest mistake now, not just too lazy to measure a box
    and make a cut.

    The funny one, was a lathe guy. About a year ago this guy comae over to a
    house I was prewiring and asked me how much I would charge back for covering
    a box on the outside of a house. I explained that it is difficult to
    precisely locate a box undcer chicken wire and stucco. This often leaves
    you cutting out a larger section of stucco and hoping you can find the box
    in the first cut. If its just a box with conduit and that doesn't have any
    wire in it then its even harder. Then you have to break out an angler
    grinder to make the cut with a masonry blade or a circular saw with a
    diamond blade. A dirty nasty job. If all goes well then you just have to
    get somebody out to patch the stucco. Then you have to come back after the
    stucco patch is done to finsih the job. Including extra travel it can cost
    you several hours of time. Thats if you have the right tools to do the job.
    I don't imagine that many residential low voltage contractors carry and
    angle grinder and a cable locator in their truck. They probably have a tone
    and probe, but it just doesn't work well through chicken wire and stucco.
    Add on that many guys don't label their prewires. They tie down devices and
    then work backwards to determine which wire they tied down. This means that
    before you can located a covered wire you have to identify the other end.
    "So, Mr Lathe guy? What did this electrician charge you to locate his box?"
    Oh, and don't forget while he is doing several extra hours of work because
    of your mistake he is falling behind on this job, and other jobs that should
    be making him money aren't getting done. "Did I tell you about the drywall
    guy who laughed so hard about covering my boxes that he fell down
    accidentally breaking through two walls?"


    --
    Bob La Londe
    http://www.YumaBassMan.com


    LocalNet dialup IMO is a criminal organization.
    Have not used them in years but they continue to bill me.
     
  8. Okitoki

    Okitoki Guest

    Now I have another topic that should raise some eyebrows...

    Why in all of these years do we use +12V and -12V? In electronics, the
    difference is 24Volts!! In Electronics you should use +12V and 0V. But
    they use plus and minus on everything!! On panels, on batteries,
    everything! Could someone technically explain why -12V is used instead
    of 0V's?

    Thanks!
     
  9. Frank Olson

    Frank Olson Guest


    Because.
     
  10. Bob Worthy

    Bob Worthy Guest

    We used to use solid, as a standard, many years ago, when working for a
    national company. I switched, when on one particular type of system, that we
    were installing, required us to keep going into different areas of the
    system and adding more buildings over the years. Eventually, we started
    getting opens on the circuits. It seemed the problem was always at the
    splice point. Not the new one, but the existing ones in the same area.
    Granted, it wasn't the best application, but it was, as is in most of todays
    applications, two wires spliced together with beans, beanies, crimps or what
    ever other term people use. The crimps have very sharp little teeth inside
    to penetrate the outer jacket of the wire. I think that it might be
    possible, that with that style crimp, those teeth just may be scoring,
    notching, or damaging the solid copper core, leaving it weaker than normal.
    When people are back into the splice, where there is always that possibility
    of bending or repeated movement of the wire, the copper could break within
    the jacket at the splice. Maybe we were using the wrong crimps, or maybe we
    should have been using blocks but in any case, the average installer is
    going to use the most popular method and that is crimps. The problem went
    away with stranded wire.
    Agreed

    Unfortunatley the stranded is much more limp making it
    Here in Florida, we don't have that luxury. There is only a 3/4" cap between
    the sheet rock and the cement block and we have to make a block shot
    diagonally from the wall to the window. We need flexibility.

    This gives me abut 2
    Must be nice

    When I come back to do a tie down I grab the
    We have to drill either a 3/4" or 1" hole into the window or door buck and
    curl our service loop up into that. Again, needing the flexibility. The new
    hurricane codes have the doors and windows bolted tight tight tight to the
    sub frame with no caps. Not as easy as the old days.
    Working in S. Florida, where everything is concrete and steel they do.

    Bottom line is that you are right. I am sure there are advantages and
    disadvantages to both from area to area and mostly boils down to preference.
     
  11. Frank Olson

    Frank Olson Guest


    Any of the keypads for the systems you purchase will have the wiring
    colours pretty well labelled. Red (+), Black (-), Green and Yellow for
    "data". The colours aren't really important. What is, is that you
    maintain a uniform "colour code" throughout your installation. We use
    yellow and black for contacts, green and red for negative and positive
    power on devices that require it. On a lot of panels, the keypads use
    the same "aux power" terminals as the other devices on the system (DSC
    happens to be one of the exceptions to this). Using the standard keypad
    colour code suggested by the manufacturer and the wire colours I
    mentioned for other devices' power (red and green), you can very quickly
    differentiate the keypad runs from the rest of the system. This could
    cut your troubleshooting time down by several minutes on the larger
    systems. When it's time to identify your wire runs, you can find more
    information here:

    http://www.yoursecuritysource.com/markingcable.htm.

    Good luck!!

    Frank Olson
    http://www.yoursecuritysource.com
     
  12. do a reference voltage check against the loop ckt and you;ll notice a -12 at
    some point.. also some panels use a reverse current to help supervise a
    circuit (ie.. fire outputs, spkr outputs)
    ((always a reason))
    RTS
     
  13. On the european equiptment i work on in plants 0 voltage is used almost
    exclusive with USA it is always 12v- unless they are following the ICE
    coding standard used in europe which is 0 voltage.
    It is probably another one of those 230vac 50hz vs 120/240 60 hz deals
     
  14. Crash Gordon

    Crash Gordon Guest

    One "feature" I like about solid is when/if it breaks...it breaks..gone,
    switch to the spare pair, with stranded you may have 18 of 19 strands
    broken...leaving one lonely strand holding the circuit.

    Besides, I hate working with stranded...takes longer to do makeups.


    |
    | | >
    | > | > >
    | > > "Robert L Bass" wrote in message
    | > >
    | > >
    | > >> For most systems the wiring is simple enough. Using 22/4 solid
    | > >
    | > > or stranded. I see more problems with solid down the road, than with
    | > > stranded, but that is open to opinions. Nothing says you have to use
    one
    | > > over the other.
    | >
    | > There are advantages and disadvanatages. I can't say I have seen any
    | > problems with solid over stranded once an installation is complete.
    |
    | We used to use solid, as a standard, many years ago, when working for a
    | national company. I switched, when on one particular type of system, that
    we
    | were installing, required us to keep going into different areas of the
    | system and adding more buildings over the years. Eventually, we started
    | getting opens on the circuits. It seemed the problem was always at the
    | splice point. Not the new one, but the existing ones in the same area.
    | Granted, it wasn't the best application, but it was, as is in most of
    todays
    | applications, two wires spliced together with beans, beanies, crimps or
    what
    | ever other term people use. The crimps have very sharp little teeth inside
    | to penetrate the outer jacket of the wire. I think that it might be
    | possible, that with that style crimp, those teeth just may be scoring,
    | notching, or damaging the solid copper core, leaving it weaker than
    normal.
    | When people are back into the splice, where there is always that
    possibility
    | of bending or repeated movement of the wire, the copper could break within
    | the jacket at the splice. Maybe we were using the wrong crimps, or maybe
    we
    | should have been using blocks but in any case, the average installer is
    | going to use the most popular method and that is crimps. The problem went
    | away with stranded wire.
    |
    | > There
    | > are a couple things that enter in for a prewire during construction.
    Any
    | > wire tags that wind up hanging out of doors or windows tend to get torn
    up
    | > from opening and closing. The stranded tends to hold up marginally
    better
    | > to this abuse.
    |
    | Agreed
    |
    | Unfortunatley the stranded is much more limp making it
    | > difficult to leave a bit of slack up in the wall or ceiling. I use the
    | > solid because I can make an accordiin bend back and forth in my hand
    about
    | > five times and leave it inside the frame of the house.
    |
    | Here in Florida, we don't have that luxury. There is only a 3/4" cap
    between
    | the sheet rock and the cement block and we have to make a block shot
    | diagonally from the wall to the window. We need flexibility.
    |
    | This gives me abut 2
    | > feet of slack to work with.
    |
    | Must be nice
    |
    | When I come back to do a tie down I grab the
    | > wire hanging out of the hole and pull it down. Then I completely cut
    off
    | > the stub that was sticking out. This totally eliminates any wire
    damaged
    | > from the opening and closing of the door or window.
    |
    | We have to drill either a 3/4" or 1" hole into the window or door buck and
    | curl our service loop up into that. Again, needing the flexibility. The
    new
    | hurricane codes have the doors and windows bolted tight tight tight to the
    | sub frame with no caps. Not as easy as the old days.
    | >
    | > I don't imagine that many residential low voltage contractors carry and
    | > angle grinder and a cable locator in their truck.
    |
    | Working in S. Florida, where everything is concrete and steel they do.
    |
    | Bottom line is that you are right. I am sure there are advantages and
    | disadvantages to both from area to area and mostly boils down to
    preference.
    |
    |
     
  15. Why in all of these years do we use +12V and -12V?

    You're right. Technically it's wrong but that's the common usage
    and people are used to seeing it that way -- knowing that the
    intended meaning is "12VDC".

    BTW, I get a kick out of people who ask, which wire is positive
    when they're talking about an AC circuit.

    --

    Regards,
    Robert L Bass

    Bass Burglar Alarms
    The Online DIY Store
    http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
     
  16. i've always preferred solid over stranded for 90% of my
    I'm not sure whether you're replying to me or to W. Like you,
    I've always preferred solid core cable for most things. I
    usually used stranded cable for siren speakers and the
    transformer. Most everything else gets solid core cable. I'm
    used to handling it and can manage to strip the stuff without
    nicking the inner conductors (probably what causes problems for
    some of these folks).

    Speaking of color codes though, every so often I'd get a box of
    22/4 stranded cable and for some reason the fourth wire was white
    -- not green. Clearly there's not a different color code for
    stranded but for some reason that's the way it was.
    Quite a few years ago they used to use something called "rainbow"
    wire. It had a clear sheath and I forget how many inside
    conductors, each of a different color. They would run this stuff
    around the basement from one junction box to the next. At each
    box they would splice whatever sensors or key stations (*not*
    keypads) were nearby to the appropriate wires. Once you knew the
    color code you could work on any of their systems.

    These were ancient systems in southern New England. They may or
    may not have actually been ADT originally. They bought out
    several other old companies around the time when Methuselah was
    cutting his baby teeth. :^)

    --

    Regards,
    Robert L Bass

    Bass Burglar Alarms
    The Online DIY Store
    http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
     
  17. Bob La Londe

    Bob La Londe Guest


    I have always been told to use stranded for sound... except that telephone
    audio obviously propogates very well over solid.

    Anything that moves gets stranded.


    --
    --
    Bob La Londe
    http://www.YumaBassMan.com


    LocalNet dialup IMO is a criminal organization.
    Have not used them in years but they continue to bill me.
     
  18. I have always been told to use stranded for sound...
    That last line said it all, Bob. Speakers and other audio gear
    tend to get moved around a lot. Thus they are usually connected
    using stranded cable.

    As for audio propagation, there's zero difference between solid
    and stranded cable. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either
    trying to sell you something, listening to audio salesmen spout
    pseudo-scientific drivel or Olson. None should be believed.

    --

    Regards,
    Robert L Bass

    Bass Burglar Alarms
    The Online DIY Store
    http://www.BassBurglarAlarms.com
     
  19. Mark Leuck

    Mark Leuck Guest

    Actually that isn't true
     
  20. Frank Olson

    Frank Olson Guest


    Heh... I don't need to spout any sort of "drivel" at all when Google is
    a far more accurate record. You do more to confirm your own stupidity
    on a daily basis than I ever could.

    Speaking of cabling for speakers, here's a very interesting article
    someone emailed me.

    http://www.audioxpress.com/reviews/media/504hansen1203.pdf


    Frank Olson
    http://www.yoursecuritysource.com
     
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