Cell phone app for IR Remote control code capture?

[N_Cook]

I've found references to their use as remote controls but now that LIRC does
not seem to be supported these days. Are phone cameras sensitive enough to
R/C IR in their own right ?
I've recently been playing with USB-RS232 converter and Termite (has 14400
Baud setting option ie 36KHz/10 x4 ) capturing of codes via IR receiver/
carrier stipper , works well enough for my purposes but if
there was an off-the-shelf phone-app that outputted the pulse train codes as
HEX test file or something, it might be more generally a simple and useful
tool.

 

[William R. Walsh]

I remember at least one application for Windows CE Pocket and Palm-size PCs
that could output IR codes (or learn new ones) via the IR hardware that most
of those things had. I've not seen anything like that for a Smartphone.

Most phone and digital cameras have an IR filter built in to prevent IR from
interfering with normal picture taking. In some digital cameras, you can
remove this filter. I'm not sure if this is possible for the much smaller
cameras used in phones. I also don't know if the camera's frame rate is
sufficient to capture an IR bitstream.

William

 

[mike]

I remember at least one application for Windows CE Pocket and Palm-size PCs
that could output IR codes (or learn new ones) via the IR hardware that most
of those things had. I've not seen anything like that for a Smartphone.

Most phone and digital cameras have an IR filter built in to prevent IR from
interfering with normal picture taking. In some digital cameras, you can
remove this filter. I'm not sure if this is possible for the much smaller
cameras used in phones. I also don't know if the camera's frame rate is
sufficient to capture an IR bitstream.

William

I'd guess that if the phone can send IR, it can also receive it.
I don't have anything newer than a Trio 850 4G phone that can.
So, if your device can't resend the codes, might as well capture
them on a device that can send them.

As for the questions you did ask ;-)
The typical IR remote is plenty strong to get thru the IR filter
in a typical digital camera. All you gota do to verify that is to
monitor the camera and poke a remote at it.

I expect that the camera frame rate is way to slow to capture the timing.
But that isn't to say that there might be some clever way for a driver
to synchronize it for the purpose. I think you'd have better luck
accessing the IR port.

I saved a bunch of stuff from 2000, but all the links seem to be broken.
Only thing left is a program that claims to turn a HP95lx into a learning
remote.

I have some interpreted basic code that can capture signals from
the IR port on a Palm. Used it to read the smart utility meter.
Probably way to slow to work to decode a remote.

 

[William Sommerwerck]

I'd guess that if the phone can send IR, it can also receive it.

The sensor could -- but there would have to be hardware and software designed
for reception.

I expect that the camera frame rate is way too slow to
capture the timing.

I believe IR remotes operate in the 100kHz range.

 

[N_Cook]

I remember at least one application for Windows CE Pocket and Palm-size PCs
that could output IR codes (or learn new ones) via the IR hardware that most
of those things had. I've not seen anything like that for a Smartphone.

Most phone and digital cameras have an IR filter built in to prevent IR from
interfering with normal picture taking. In some digital cameras, you can
remove this filter. I'm not sure if this is possible for the much smaller
cameras used in phones. I also don't know if the camera's frame rate is
sufficient to capture an IR bitstream.

William

The 4 digital cameras I tried all showed a flickering response to ordinary
IR remotes. When its dark tonight I'll try passing a transmitting IR over
one and see if it leaves an interpetable image over the 2 seconds of open
"shutter". As long as it/smart phones have the response time to pick up some
semblance of the typical 36KHz/10 of the coded bit length of 0.278mS rather
than the full 36 KHz pulses then there is a chance.
At the other end , the Hex coding would need gating with 36KHz into a
learner remote or something for normal use.

 

[mike]

The sensor could -- but there would have to be hardware and software
designed for reception.

The way I checked mine was to power up a Dell Axim X51v and send the phone
a file by IR. It beeped and saved the file.
I'd call that conclusive for the Trio 850.
Actually making use of that in user space is unlikely.
If you have the tools to write driver code, should be pretty easy.

I believe IR remotes operate in the 100kHz range.

Some, but much consumer stuff is/was around 38KHz.
There are some "standards" that don't seem to be well followed.

More info on the end objective would be helpful.

 

[N_Cook]

Well sort of worked. I didn't think of using the timer, at the time, and
restricted to about metre in front of lens and not being able to move the
R/C fast enough. Tasteful purple streaks. The one I used I'd previously
DSO'd and the first 6 .278mS bits of two 1s were clear , ie 100100 but the
remaining 90 bits blurred into 1 over about 1/25 of the frame width ,
partially because out of bad focus and perhaps overloading of the sensor.
Just for interest I will try again using timer mode and suspending the
camera so it will rotate about 4 revs per sec and hold the R/C about 3m away
and repeatedly pressing the button should catch enough part traces if not
one across the whole frame, raising and lowering the R/c also.
For timing and not just code sequence for anyone without a DSO perhaps feed
1KHz to another Tx LED mounted above the R/C in question. Whether a
smartphone camera would have short enough response time for a static use and
so a simple app is moot.

 

[N_Cook]

The way I checked mine was to power up a Dell Axim X51v and send the phone
a file by IR. It beeped and saved the file.
I'd call that conclusive for the Trio 850.
Actually making use of that in user space is unlikely.
If you have the tools to write driver code, should be pretty easy.

Some, but much consumer stuff is/was around 38KHz.
There are some "standards" that don't seem to be well followed.

More info on the end objective would be helpful.

Axim would seem to have "Wifi capability and Infrared port included"

My scenario is that you have a useless bit of old or rare kit with no source
of OEM r/c , URCs don't work, so the kit is effectively dead. But you find
that someone in another part of the world has a r/c , but how to send the
codes using readily available kit and no technical ability.

 

[mike]

Axim would seem to have "Wifi capability and Infrared port included"

Nice thing about the axim is that it supports multiple IR protocols
and can talk to windows mobile or palm. No experience with android.

This claims to work with a number of older PDA's. Not clear what the demo
restrictions are.
http://www.mobyware.net/dell-axim-x51-device-222/remotecontrol-ii-pro-download-free-15449.html

My scenario is that you have a useless bit of old or rare kit with no source
of OEM r/c , URCs don't work, so the kit is effectively dead. But you find
that someone in another part of the world has a r/c , but how to send the
codes using readily available kit and no technical ability.

No technical ability is a problem...You're at the mercy of the technical
capability on the other end.

There exist universal remote controls with learning ability.
Mail one to him for programming.

You seem to be resistant to disclosing exactly what "kit" you are
dealing with.
Somebody may have a solution if they knew the problem.

 

[mike]

On 4/9/2013 1:58 AM, mike wrote:

http://www.mobyware.net/dell-axim-x51-device-222/remotecontrol-ii-pro-download-free-15449.html

The manual at the link has a BUNCH of very good info on how the IR codes
work.
Page 102 lists some sources

You can find thousands of these CCF IR hex codes and layout files with
included CCF IR hex codes
at:
http://www.google.com/search?q=pronto+ccf+hex+0000
http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/files/rcfiles.cgi?area=pronto&db=discrete
http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/files/rcfiles.cgi?area=pronto&db=devices

 

[whit3rd]

I've found references to their use as remote controls but now that LIRC does

not seem to be supported these days. Are phone cameras sensitive enough to

R/C IR in their own right ?

Not a great idea to use IR directly. Smart phones with Bluetooth and/or WiFi can
be used to send other kinds of remote signals, and servers and radio/IR bridges
can fill in the gap with any kind of translation you can imagine.

IRDA type hardware was in some Palm phones, but those aren't terribly current.
Palm was swallowed by HP and mainly sold off (to LG).