J
James Meyer
- Jan 1, 1970
- 0
An atomic clock or Laser may be required.
--
Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
Jim
An atomic clock or Laser may be required.
--
It's velocity-dependent. You need to specify the relative direction aswrote (in said:Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
I think that the LDRS uses such a system.There was a thread about this right here in this newsgroup a while back.
IIRC, it is not at all obvious that this is the best approach or that it
will even work.
--Mac
Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
Jim
What was the consensus concerning why doppler shift woldn't work?
[...]
Right. It might be difficult to get an oscillator that's sufficiently
g-insensitive to make this work.
An atomic clock or Laser may be required.
--
Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
---
If the observer is aligned axially with the direction of travel of the
transmitter,
fC
f' = ---------
C +/- v
where f is the frequency of the CW carrier radiated by the transmitter
f' is the oserved frequency
C is 3.0E9 m/s, and
v is the velocity of the transmitter.
So, at with v = 200MPH (89.3 m/s)
2.4E9Hz * 3.0E9m/s
f' = --------------------- = f +/- 71Hz.
3.0E9m/s +/- 89.3m/s
[...]
Right. It might be difficult to get an oscillator that's sufficiently
g-insensitive to make this work.
An atomic clock or Laser may be required.
--
Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
Jim
Around 700 Hz. So if the oscillator pulls 70 Hz at max g-force, the
velocity error is 10%. 70 Hz is 0.03 PPM. You won't find a small
oscillator that will hold 0.03 PPM with even 1G of acceleration
change.
The amount of Doppler shift at any sane velocity is less than theHowever, it's head and shoulders above an accelerometer approach.
What was the consensus concerning why doppler shift woldn't work?
[...]
Right. It might be difficult to get an oscillator that's sufficiently
g-insensitive to make this work.
An atomic clock or Laser may be required.
--
Bullshit. 2.4 GHz rf sources are readily available. What's the doppler
shift at that frequency for 200 MPH velocities?
Jim
Around 700 Hz. So if the oscillator pulls 70 Hz at max g-force, the
velocity error is 10%. 70 Hz is 0.03 PPM. You won't find a small
oscillator that will hold 0.03 PPM with even 1G of acceleration
change.
So if you flip it over on the bench it will change twice that?
I think you could do this, by phase locking the onboard oscillator, to aRich Grise said:The amount of Doppler shift at any sane velocity is less than the
stability/accuracy of any practical oscillator.
Cheers!
Rich
I think that the LDRS uses such a system.
It is how they get accurate measurements on the 1200MPH models some of
these guys have.
Jim
On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 08:17:06 -0800, the renowned John Larkin
So if you flip it over on the bench it will change twice that?
Roger Hamlett said:I think you could do this, by phase locking the onboard oscillator, to a
distant radio station. Given you are looking for vertical motion, which
would be perpendicular to the radio signals, this should give the required
stability.
I don't think the accelerometer is a bad idea, its a senior project
afterall, here are some suggestions
1) You could limit the r/c car to travel on a smooth flat surface
2) Use a big heavy slow r/c car and soft mount your electronics on the
car with foam
3) If you want to get carried away add a analog devices gyro to your
dual axis ADXL202 accelerometer and you have a complete 2 dimensional
inertial navigation system which is a very good learning experience.
Basic idea is the gyro tells you what direction your pointing in the
then you determine your acceleration in that direction with the dual
axis accelerometer you are using. Integrate that to get your velocity
and position.
4) Take 64 or so readings of the gyro and accelerometers and average
them before using them, this will lower the noise level. Since your
integrating the accelerometer outputs, any noise left will tend to
averaged out (its the constant offsets that kill you)
The drift of analog devices gyros are good to about 70deg/hour (after
some simple calibration), so you should have plenty of accuracy for a
few minute demo before the car gets lost and doesn't know where it is.
The car should be able to drive itself around a simple maze in this
time too.
There are lots of GPS receivers with much more frequent updates. TheyAll of the GPS receivers that I am familiar with will give you a speed
calculation once per second, not very practicle for an R/C vehicle moving in
fits and spurts.
If I went with a GPS approach, would a GPS have enough precision to
resolve between an rc car moving pretty short distances, on the order
of a tens of feet maybe?
If the resolution is there, it seems plausable that changes in position
could be timed.