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You need to be a little more specific.
It's difficult to use anything except cameras for overall surveillance.
Are you talking about tagging items, and having a detector at the exit door?
We need more information about your specific goal.
It's difficult to use anything except cameras for overall surveillance.
Are you talking about tagging items, and having a detector at the exit door?
We need more information about your specific goal.
Google 'RFID' and start reading, tons of info out there about how they work and the tech behind them...
Raven Luni
- Oct 15, 2011
- 798
- Joined
- Oct 15, 2011
- Messages
- 798
Tricky one to answer - you never know if someone wants to build something or bypass it (not accusing you of course)
working in security I can tell you this.
security is only as good as the staff.
if you have for example a problem with gum going missing then it would be better to put cameras up. the reason for this is that it takes way too much time to put a magnetic strip on each of the packets.
if however its something that is costly and small try a glass cabinet locked.
the anti theft measures that are used by shops are only as good as the guy on the front door. I could come in and fit your shop out with several thousand dollars worth of equipment, but if joe blow on the front door isn't willing to say "OI empty your pockets" then all is in vain.
security is only as good as the staff.
if you have for example a problem with gum going missing then it would be better to put cameras up. the reason for this is that it takes way too much time to put a magnetic strip on each of the packets.
if however its something that is costly and small try a glass cabinet locked.
the anti theft measures that are used by shops are only as good as the guy on the front door. I could come in and fit your shop out with several thousand dollars worth of equipment, but if joe blow on the front door isn't willing to say "OI empty your pockets" then all is in vain.
In the end a lot of this governed by local laws as well... I would have to refresh my memory but I believe from the last time I looked into it, the 'door' sensor tags do NOT meet the threshold of 'probable cause' for theft in many jurisdictions and thus you risk being sued back if you depend on them and the person is not cooperative... Meaning the guy walking out the door could tell you to "#$%%*($^" and keep walking and 'legally' you have zero recourse available to you that wouldn't open you up to a liability... Cameras, mirrors or what not on the other hand that allow an employee to actually 'witness' the crime do meet the probable cause threshold...
with regards to coca colas comment: heck yeah there is alot of crap involved. a perfect example is if someone steals from shop A and escapes but the door sensor at shop B goes of and he/she is caught, even though the tag is still on the item and you can assume theft, you cannot prove it was stolen from that shop. this leads to how to charge someone, the charge has to have a location, e.g. woolworths. but if the item was originally from walmart and the criminal is not willing to admit to where it was from then police usually drop it.
in Australia we do have this little side rule I love using though. if I am as close to certain as I can be, but know that the possibility of this even making court is small we stop their rights to enter or remain on site, as most shopping centres are private land this means they are trespassing.
once again though it relies on the guy on the front door stopping said person from re-entering.
ibhubesi if I were you i would invest in getting either a security firm or even talk to the local police about possible measures that can be taken to help prevent further theft.
just as a start though as most shops are private you can put your own rules on the front door, within reason. the list usually starts with we reserve the right to check all bags upon exit OR please leave your bag at the front door (the second is not wise as it leads to liability if someone else takes it)
alarm all exits so there is only one way out.
put the scariest looking person on the front door, make them polite and experienced and have them check all bags. failure to show a reciept means further investigation. check ALL bags. even if they come through the checkout check their bag.
training training training. the anti theft measures are absolutely no good without the guy on the front door to stop them, cos a tag definately won't
in Australia we do have this little side rule I love using though. if I am as close to certain as I can be, but know that the possibility of this even making court is small we stop their rights to enter or remain on site, as most shopping centres are private land this means they are trespassing.
once again though it relies on the guy on the front door stopping said person from re-entering.
ibhubesi if I were you i would invest in getting either a security firm or even talk to the local police about possible measures that can be taken to help prevent further theft.
just as a start though as most shops are private you can put your own rules on the front door, within reason. the list usually starts with we reserve the right to check all bags upon exit OR please leave your bag at the front door (the second is not wise as it leads to liability if someone else takes it)
alarm all exits so there is only one way out.
put the scariest looking person on the front door, make them polite and experienced and have them check all bags. failure to show a reciept means further investigation. check ALL bags. even if they come through the checkout check their bag.
training training training. the anti theft measures are absolutely no good without the guy on the front door to stop them, cos a tag definately won't
Even so, rules can not violate rights and laws... If the guy leaving the store says "%^%$^#%" to the request by the door guard there is little you can do, they don't have to submit to a search or even a check, regardless of what a sign says... And this can be a huge liability, if the door guy pursues and 'accuses' you of theft and you did not steal you just slandered him and he can sue...
The reason door tags and door security work is because of intimidation, pressure and a lack of knowing better... Most people will waive their rights and allow the search vs the fear of escalating the situation... Same tactic is used by police all the time to make you waive your rights "Can I come in and talk to you" say yes and you just gave permission to enter without a warrant and the list could go on an on...
Trespass is about the only legit legal thing stores can push without proof of a crime, and not potentially face a backlash... This is why almost all big chain stores have a 'no conflict' and 'no pursuit' policy against shop lifting...
yup totally agree. thats where experienced door people come in.
you know when to push the subject and when to leave it alone.
you also know when to go look at the footage for proof.
the slander thing is not the best, NEVER EVER accuse anyone of stealing, instead inform them that upon entry they accepted the fact we could search bags, failing to allow us to do so negates their right of entry which makes the entire time they were in the shop trespass.
having said that though coca you are US I am Aus we do have a few different laws.
depending where the original thread starter is from my advice is talk to the police or a local security firm. most people will come and and give a quote detailing what you should install. the police here in qld have a volunteer group that go around showing businesses what to look out for, some even even offer advice on security setup (that is the part I hate, they are volunteers not even security guards little own police).
at least getting the word out that you are taking theft very seriously is the best way of stopping it. a few arrests with someone caught in the act and word gets out fast.
you know when to push the subject and when to leave it alone.
you also know when to go look at the footage for proof.
the slander thing is not the best, NEVER EVER accuse anyone of stealing, instead inform them that upon entry they accepted the fact we could search bags, failing to allow us to do so negates their right of entry which makes the entire time they were in the shop trespass.
having said that though coca you are US I am Aus we do have a few different laws.
depending where the original thread starter is from my advice is talk to the police or a local security firm. most people will come and and give a quote detailing what you should install. the police here in qld have a volunteer group that go around showing businesses what to look out for, some even even offer advice on security setup (that is the part I hate, they are volunteers not even security guards little own police).
at least getting the word out that you are taking theft very seriously is the best way of stopping it. a few arrests with someone caught in the act and word gets out fast.
Thanks Cocacola and Donkey for your inputs. On my side I have found an invester who says I must develop an anti shoplifting system that would be different or put a challenge to the existing system. I wanted first to know how the current system works maybe I can find a way to innovate or develop it. I've been in the private security industry for 5 years now I know some loop holes that needs to be strengthened conserning tags I just need some information on the technical side of tag system. Thanks for the information the magic word I needed was "RFID" as mentioned by Cocacola earlier. Thank you.
Mongrel Shark
- Jun 6, 2012
- 260
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2012
- Messages
- 260
RFID is gutless. Like donkey says, relies on the door person. The ones at my local BigW go off every second time someone goes through. Nobody even pays any attention. Happened to me a few weeks back. I turned around to offer my bags for inspection, to clear my seemingly tarnished reputation, and the staff told me it was false alarm and go away please. Might as well have invited me to come back and steal stuff... Lucky for them all their stuff is junk not worth stealing (JK)
Dye tags that go off outside the store are a little better. Depends on the value of the merchandise.
If I wanted to improve upon whats around already. I'd be looking into micro GPS tracking, with on-board energy harvester.... Have it start sending a signal when it leaves the store.... If done right it could help you get a warrant too. Get a shoplifters house raided and they will probably have lots of stuff they shouldn't...
The big hurdles would be power supply, combined with small size and hard removal. Even dye tags don't like pocket blow torch.... Tin foil can "foil" a lot of anti theft too..
Good cameras, good staff and maybe facial recognition would be my choice. Best value for money IMO.
Ultimately, the only way to totally stop shoplifting is to keep everything behind the counter, or in lock up cabinets...
Dye tags that go off outside the store are a little better. Depends on the value of the merchandise.
If I wanted to improve upon whats around already. I'd be looking into micro GPS tracking, with on-board energy harvester.... Have it start sending a signal when it leaves the store.... If done right it could help you get a warrant too. Get a shoplifters house raided and they will probably have lots of stuff they shouldn't...
The big hurdles would be power supply, combined with small size and hard removal. Even dye tags don't like pocket blow torch.... Tin foil can "foil" a lot of anti theft too..
Good cameras, good staff and maybe facial recognition would be my choice. Best value for money IMO.
Ultimately, the only way to totally stop shoplifting is to keep everything behind the counter, or in lock up cabinets...
Thanks Mongrel Shark security tags are not 100% effective they are easily breached. Like in my case the client always find hundreds of broken tags in his store it seems as if the thugs took clothes to the fitting room and break the tags and then went out of the store without being dictated by the scanners at the door. Dye tags which you mentioned might be the way to go. I'll have a look at them.
Thanks.
Thanks.
being a security officer I can tell you straight of its a few factors to take into consideration.
first of all is the cost.... do you really want to spend $1000 to protect a pack of gum?
second of all time, if you do put something on the said gum will the time it takes actually be worth it? you are paying someone for this.
third is reliability this is 2 fold will the said device work EVERYtime or at a high percentage? and will there be false triggers like mobile phones setting it of?
I still find the easiest way is to have shelf stackers with a phone, they go up and down aisles. If someone is acting odd they are followed while the shelf stacker seems to be doing nothing more than his/her job. if the suspect is seen doing something wrong you can be there straight away and not have to wait for a staff member to be present. If they get to the checkout (which is usually behind a bench) they can easily run off even with the dye packs.
the biggest lesson I have learnt about security is it is NOT meant to stop someone from committing a crime. it is meant to deter them. fort knox holds a few billion dollars worth of gold, if I promised 1000 people 1million each I am positive we could get in, having said that when people look at the security surrounding fort knox (which includes use of lethal force) you find that getting 1000 people to help you out is a little hard.
first of all is the cost.... do you really want to spend $1000 to protect a pack of gum?
second of all time, if you do put something on the said gum will the time it takes actually be worth it? you are paying someone for this.
third is reliability this is 2 fold will the said device work EVERYtime or at a high percentage? and will there be false triggers like mobile phones setting it of?
I still find the easiest way is to have shelf stackers with a phone, they go up and down aisles. If someone is acting odd they are followed while the shelf stacker seems to be doing nothing more than his/her job. if the suspect is seen doing something wrong you can be there straight away and not have to wait for a staff member to be present. If they get to the checkout (which is usually behind a bench) they can easily run off even with the dye packs.
the biggest lesson I have learnt about security is it is NOT meant to stop someone from committing a crime. it is meant to deter them. fort knox holds a few billion dollars worth of gold, if I promised 1000 people 1million each I am positive we could get in, having said that when people look at the security surrounding fort knox (which includes use of lethal force) you find that getting 1000 people to help you out is a little hard.
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