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Analogue Video to DTV Conversion ...

A

Arfa Daily

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bit OT but following on from the interesting discussions we had on the 'End
of Analog TV', has anyone come across a commercial stand-alone converter,
that will take in analogue video, and output an RF DTV signal ? Sort of like
a standard UHF modulator, but producing a DTV compatible signal. I know that
such items have been put together by hams for digital ATV transmissions, but
as far as I know, it has all been homebrew stuff.

The reason I am looking for such an item is that I am about to buy a new LCD
TV for the kitchen that I've just done up. I currently have a UHF
distribution system running round the house, which is fed with off-air
signals from the roof antenna, as well as output from the Sky+ sat box /
recorder, and my TiVo box. I would like to be able to watch the Sky and TiVo
signals on that new set in the kitchen. Trouble is, most of the sets now
being sold in the UK, have a built in Freeview digital tuner, and no
analogue capability, so they would not respond to any of the analogue
signals being fed round the distribution system, including my Sky and TiVo.

Seems to me that this is going to be a problem in the future, as many people
feed analogue signals from recorders and sat receivers around their houses,
to watch on portables in the kitchen and bedrooms etc. As these sets get
replaced, even if you continue to feed DTV RF signals around the house, you
are not going to be able to get the additonal signals from your other kit,
that you previously did. That will mean that the only set that you can watch
your Sky signals on, will be the one that is directly video linked to the
box.

I am sure that many people just don't realise what facilities they are going
to lose in the weeks immediately following the closing down of their
analogue service. How many people realise that every portable TV, VCR, DVD
recorder, HDD recorder etc that they now have all around their houses, is
going to need a DTV STB ahead of it ?

Arfa
 
Bit OT but following on from the interesting discussions we had on the 'End
of Analog TV', has anyone come across a commercial stand-alone converter,
that will take in analogue video, and output an RF DTV signal ? Sort of like
a standard UHF modulator, but producing a DTV compatible signal. I know that
such items have been put together by hams for digital ATV transmissions, but
as far as I know, it has all been homebrew stuff.

The reason I am looking for such an item is that I am about to buy a new LCD
TV for the kitchen that I've just done up. I currently have a UHF
distribution system running round the house, which is fed with off- air
signals from the roof antenna, as well as output from the Sky+ sat box /
recorder, and my TiVo box. I would like to be able to watch the Sky and TiVo
signals on that new set in the kitchen. Trouble is, most of the sets now
being sold in the UK, have a built in Freeview digital tuner, and no
analogue capability, so they would not respond to any of the analogue
signals being fed round the distribution system, including my Sky and TiVo.

Seems to me that this is going to be a problem in the future, as many people
feed analogue signals from recorders and sat receivers around their houses,
to watch on portables in the kitchen and bedrooms etc. As these sets get
replaced, even if you continue to feed DTV RF signals around the house, you
are not going to be able to get the additonal signals from your other kit,
that you previously did. That will mean that the only set that you can watch
your Sky signals on, will be the one that is directly video linked to the
box.

I am sure that many people just don't realise what facilities they are going
to lose in the weeks immediately following the closing down of their
analogue service. How many people realise that every portable TV, VCR, DVD
recorder, HDD recorder etc that they now have all around their houses, is
going to need a DTV STB ahead of it ?

Arfa

A DTV modulator is a good deal more complicated than a simple AM
transmitter used for analog video though I expect there may be some
down the road. With the interfacing to computers pretty simple for
many HDTVs, I suspect it will be more common to use the CAT 5 or 6
networking to watch video from a server computer. I've been doing this
for 4 years now. Gigabit is nice for moving files around the network
but it's perfectly fine to watch a file real time from another PC even
while IT is recording another HD show. 10-100 is more than adequate as
the US datasteam is 19 Mbits max. You don't need anything special to
do this as you can use the router / switch you probably have already.
USB 2.0 is adequate as well and those 500gig drives for $80 can hold
100-200 1 hour shows after the commercials are edited out.

 
A

Andy

Jan 1, 1970
0
Andy writes:

Most of the TV made in the last dozen years accept component
video signals as inputs, S-video , for example.

DTV converters put out Channel 3 analog and component video
analog....

VCRs accept component video inputs and put out component video
outputs...

.... I really don't see the problem.....

If worse comes to worse, once can use an old VCR with a bad
transport to take in component video and put out channel 3 or 4.....
Bulky, but puts the old junk to good use...


Also, you can google " Digital TV encoder " , and find the
manufacturers
of the chips that do what you are talking about ---- taking analog
input
and making encoded DTV output...... I'm sure that those who make
the
chips have application circuits in their data sheets...

Andy in Eureka, Texas
 
G

Geoffrey S. Mendelson

Jan 1, 1970
0
Arfa said:
The reason I am looking for such an item is that I am about to buy a new LCD
TV for the kitchen that I've just done up. I currently have a UHF
distribution system running round the house, which is fed with off-air
signals from the roof antenna, as well as output from the Sky+ sat box /
recorder, and my TiVo box. I would like to be able to watch the Sky and TiVo
signals on that new set in the kitchen. Trouble is, most of the sets now
being sold in the UK, have a built in Freeview digital tuner, and no
analogue capability, so they would not respond to any of the analogue
signals being fed round the distribution system, including my Sky and TiVo.

I can't help you with what you want, but may be able to help you with
something that works.

Look up "WinFast TV Pro II Leadtek". It's one of many devices that are
designed to share a computer monitor with your video needs. It has
RF, S-Video and composite inputs and outputs VGA type RGB signals.

My guess is that it will be around 30 quid in the UK.

You just have to buy a TV that has a "VGA" type input.

Geoff.
 
A

Arfa Daily

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bit OT but following on from the interesting discussions we had on the 'End
of Analog TV', has anyone come across a commercial stand-alone converter,
that will take in analogue video, and output an RF DTV signal ? Sort of like
a standard UHF modulator, but producing a DTV compatible signal. I know that
such items have been put together by hams for digital ATV transmissions, but
as far as I know, it has all been homebrew stuff.

The reason I am looking for such an item is that I am about to buy a new LCD
TV for the kitchen that I've just done up. I currently have a UHF
distribution system running round the house, which is fed with off- air
signals from the roof antenna, as well as output from the Sky+ sat box /
recorder, and my TiVo box. I would like to be able to watch the Sky and TiVo
signals on that new set in the kitchen. Trouble is, most of the sets now
being sold in the UK, have a built in Freeview digital tuner, and no
analogue capability, so they would not respond to any of the analogue
signals being fed round the distribution system, including my Sky and TiVo.

Seems to me that this is going to be a problem in the future, as many people
feed analogue signals from recorders and sat receivers around their houses,
to watch on portables in the kitchen and bedrooms etc. As these sets get
replaced, even if you continue to feed DTV RF signals around the house, you
are not going to be able to get the additonal signals from your other kit,
that you previously did. That will mean that the only set that you can watch
your Sky signals on, will be the one that is directly video linked to the
box.

I am sure that many people just don't realise what facilities they are going
to lose in the weeks immediately following the closing down of their
analogue service. How many people realise that every portable TV, VCR, DVD
recorder, HDD recorder etc that they now have all around their houses, is
going to need a DTV STB ahead of it ?

Arfa

A DTV modulator is a good deal more complicated than a simple AM
transmitter used for analog video though I expect there may be some
down the road. With the interfacing to computers pretty simple for
many HDTVs, I suspect it will be more common to use the CAT 5 or 6
networking to watch video from a server computer. I've been doing this
for 4 years now. Gigabit is nice for moving files around the network
but it's perfectly fine to watch a file real time from another PC even
while IT is recording another HD show. 10-100 is more than adequate as
the US datasteam is 19 Mbits max. You don't need anything special to
do this as you can use the router / switch you probably have already.
USB 2.0 is adequate as well and those 500gig drives for $80 can hold
100-200 1 hour shows after the commercials are edited out.



Agreed that this would probably be the way to go if starting again from
scratch. Just seems a bloody nuisance to have to start running CAT 5 cable
around the house, and then to have to use the TV in its monitor mode to hang
on the end of a 'receiver' computer, when there is a perfectly good UHF
network running around the house, which has worked well for years, and
continues to carry the digital multiplexes well enough to be useable, just
about, and hopefully even better when they jack up the power levels on them
after the analogue closedown.

Arfa
 
A

Arfa Daily

Jan 1, 1970
0
Andy said:
Andy writes:

Most of the TV made in the last dozen years accept component
video signals as inputs, S-video , for example.

DTV converters put out Channel 3 analog and component video
analog....

VCRs accept component video inputs and put out component video
outputs...

... I really don't see the problem.....

If worse comes to worse, once can use an old VCR with a bad
transport to take in component video and put out channel 3 or 4.....
Bulky, but puts the old junk to good use...


Also, you can google " Digital TV encoder " , and find the
manufacturers
of the chips that do what you are talking about ---- taking analog
input
and making encoded DTV output...... I'm sure that those who make
the
chips have application circuits in their data sheets...

Andy in Eureka, Texas

That's fair enough Andy - given that we are UHF here in the UK rather than
VHF - but you miss the primary point of what I am saying. Already, LCD TV
sets are being sold, which have no facilities to receive analogue *RF*
signals. Yes, for sure, they can accept every other type of input known to
man, but not a simple, UHF, off-air analogue signal, as presumably, the
makers are thinking "no off-air analogue being broadcast, no need to be able
to receive any, then".

So yes, I could split the RGB or whatever output from the Sky box, and feed
it to more than one TV set, but with the best will in the world, it's not
going to be practical to feed it to many more TV sets. At the moment, the
output from my additional sources feeds into a trunked UHF distribution
system which I put in when I had the house built. There are at least 9
drop-offs in the main house that I can think of right now, plus a couple
more in my electronic repair shop area. My neighbour has a similar system,
and whilst that many drops on a trunked system is a bit unusual in a normal
house, I know many people who have three or four rooms fed from a multiway
UHF distribution amplifier located in their attic space, and fed, like my
system, with both off-air signals from their roof antenna, as well as output
from their Sky boxes and so on. I'm pretty sure that they probably don't
realise that when they replace any of the TV sets, they are not then going
to be able to 'receive' that additional content on the new TV.

So it's not a case of using the modulator in an old VCR. If it were that
easy, standalone modulators which take in AV and output a UHF PAL compatible
signal with sound, are readily available.

A number of ham ATV repeaters, both here and in the US, I believe, are now
running digital in tandem with analogue. Although many hams are using
ex-broadcast equipment to do the DTV signal construction from analogue
baseband inputs, I seem to recall reading that there are schematics around
for homebrew, presumably, as you say, using dedicated chips for the job. I
might try having a look down the homebrew route, and see what is around. In
the meantime, last night, I found what might be a suitable TV for my kitchen
which, as well as having the DTV receiver built in, along with every other
possible input also has - oh joy! - a bog standard UHF analogue tuner in it
....

Arfa
 
B

b

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bit OT but following on from the interesting discussions we had on the 'End
of Analog TV', has anyone come across a commercial stand-alone converter,
that will take in analogue video, and output an RF DTV signal ? Sort of like
a standard UHF modulator, but producing a DTV compatible signal. I know that
such items have been put together by hams for digital ATV transmissions, but
as far as I know, it has all been homebrew stuff.

The reason I am looking for such an item is that I am about to buy a new LCD
TV for the kitchen that I've just done up. I currently have a UHF
distribution system running round the house, which is fed with off-air
signals from the roof antenna, as well as output from the Sky+ sat box /
recorder, and my TiVo box. I would like to be able to watch the Sky and TiVo
signals on that new set in the kitchen. Trouble is, most of the sets now
being sold in the UK, have a built in Freeview digital tuner, and no
analogue capability, so they would not respond to any of the analogue
signals being fed round the distribution system, including my Sky and TiVo.

Seems to me that this is going to be a problem in the future, as many people
feed analogue signals from recorders and sat receivers around their houses,
to watch on portables in the kitchen and bedrooms etc. As these sets get
replaced, even if you continue to feed DTV RF signals around the house, you
are not going to be able to get the additonal signals from your other kit,
that you previously did. That will mean that the only set that you can watch
your Sky signals on, will be the one that is directly video linked to the
box.

I am sure that many people just don't realise what facilities they are going
to lose in the weeks immediately following the closing down of their
analogue service. How many people realise that every portable TV, VCR, DVD
recorder, HDD recorder etc that they now have all around their houses, is
going to need a DTV STB ahead of it ?

Arfa

there are plenty of tellies about, flat screens or otherwise, which
have UHF analogue tuners in. Just go for those models, and not a brand
new one . There will be plenty about for years to come on the second
hand market!

not ideal but that's the quick answer to your predicament!
-B
 
H

hr(bob) [email protected]

Jan 1, 1970
0
there are plenty of tellies about, flat screens or otherwise, which
have UHF analogue tuners in. Just go for those models, and not a brand
new one . There will be plenty about for years to come on the second
hand market!

not ideal but that's the quick answer to your predicament!
-B- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

But Arfa would like to be able to get a tv that accepts both types of
inputs
 
J

Jeff Layman

Jan 1, 1970
0
Arfa said:
Bit OT but following on from the interesting discussions we had on
the 'End of Analog TV', has anyone come across a commercial
stand-alone converter, that will take in analogue video, and output
an RF DTV signal ? Sort of like a standard UHF modulator, but
producing a DTV compatible signal. I know that such items have been
put together by hams for digital ATV transmissions, but as far as I
know, it has all been homebrew stuff.
(snip)

Don't know it it would help, but you could try reposting in
uk.tech.digital-tv.
 
G

Geoffrey S. Mendelson

Jan 1, 1970
0
Jeff said:
Don't know it it would help, but you could try reposting in
uk.tech.digital-tv.

Wouldn't that be uk.tech.analogue.tv?

Geoff.
 
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