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Alternatives to ROM. Magnetic vs. Electric

Discussion in 'Electronic Basics' started by Radium, May 12, 2007.

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  1. Bob Myers

    Bob Myers Guest

    Hmmmm....and here I was thinking he meant a PROM
    with fizzable links....

    Bob M.
     
  2. Alex Colvin

    Alex Colvin Guest

    In order to make disscrete logic
    You'd have liked plugboard programming.
     
  3. Radium

    Radium Guest

    What is "plugboard programming"? I googled it but didn't receive a
    clear definition.
     
  4. Oh, don't worry, mechanical is how all them ROM works, none of them
    nonsensical magnetic whatchamacallit you hate so much. You send
    specific amount of electron particles constituting a current moving
    through nuclear-mechanical paths, it makes other particles move in
    predetermined nuclear-mechanical pathways, makes holes so that actual
    particles can move around and such, and finally all these
    nuclear-mechanics causes specific amount of electrons constituting an
    output signal to be produced at the output end.
    In other words, you would like to effectively destroy the rest of the
    world just because they don't follow your preferences. That sounds
    like... your full name is really Osama Bin Radium, isn't it? :p
     
  5. With a philosophy like that, it should be Radium W. Cheney.

    Cheers!
    Rich
     

  6. Those are betweeen his ears and its sad to say but they are all
    blown. :(


    --
    Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
    prove it.
    Member of DAV #85.

    Michael A. Terrell
    Central Florida
     
  7. kony

    kony Guest

    Because you say so?
    Sorry, but you have to ignore all the posts by Radium and
    pretend a purpose before that would be true.



    Obviously you didn't read carefull, I never wrote it was
    solely _my_ time. It's not just my time, it's everyone's,
    including news server bandwidth.
    It wasn't a *horrible* problem by any stretch, but then
    people like yourself climb on board with opinions that don't
    consider Radium's history, the repetitve posting of same
    thing nor the conclusions.




    Really? I expect some did know about Radium's posting
    history but "every"? Doubtful.
    Yes, and it was worth my time to respond with the sane
    answer instead of senseless wastes of time to coddle a
    troll.
    Apparently you have a problem, since I was as entitled to
    point out Radiums' follies as it is a relevant context to
    the posts.

    See above, you obviously lack reading skills.
     
  8. krw

    krw Guest

    No, *YOU* have to ignore all such posts if *YOU* don't want to "waste
    your time" with him. You know, newsreaders have killfiles and
    scoring for a reason. Use them so you don't waste your precious
    time.
    Are you "everyone's" keeper? Why don't you let people make such
    decisions for themselves?
    I know Radium's history. I also know how to use killfiles and
    filters. Perhaps you should learn.
    They will make their own decisions.
    Perhaps I missed something. Have you been appointed group moderator?
    No, you want to silence him.
    No, you're just a wannabe netcop.
     
  9. Radium

    Radium Guest

    Alex Colvin, why would I like plugboard? It's not a digital computer
    and it has no silicon. I am a fan of real-time digital hardware.
    However, the plugboard is totally analog. Sure its hardware, but it
    isn't digital.
     
  10. MooseFET

    MooseFET Guest

    "Not exclusively" are magic words. I wasn't speaking of any specific
    processor except the one in the keyboard. I was trying to keep it
    simple to make my point.

    Some machines have "loadable control stores". We really don't want to
    start taking about them, do we.

    I don't think this is what happens. It is more likely that it is a
    structure like Flash memory. You really don't want to have to publish
    the fact that your processor contains such stuff unless you really
    need to.



    The OP wants there to be a physical mechanical difference. He doesn't
    like RAMs etc. Chances are he also doesn't like readheads.
     
  11. MooseFET

    MooseFET Guest

    Actually it can be digital. Plugboard is just a method for
    programming things it can be used for digital systems too.

    Many years back, I worked on a digital system that was programmed much
    like that. There was a card with a bunch of posts on it. You
    soldered wires between the posts to program the system as to what it
    was to do.

    It was all digital but the digital stuff largely predated TTL logic.

    One edge of the programming board had a row of pins that were asserted
    low one at a time in order. The other edge had a row of connections
    that caused things to happen.

    There were a couple of special pins that had special meanings. One of
    them marked the end of the program and causes the sequence to start
    over. The other was sort of like one layer of subroutine call. When
    it pulsed low another circuit would run through its steps before the
    next one on this card would be asserted. This allowed maybe a few
    hundred steps of programming.
     
  12. Radium

    Radium Guest

    Oh. The other type of ROM I like is analog ROM in the form of variable-
    density analog B&W monaural negative [no positive and no "reversal";
    just the negatives] film optical tracks. This is similar to the
    optical film audio tracks used in old B&W films.

    In this type of film, the audio signal, in the form of light changing
    its intensity in an analogous manner to the sound, is shined onto a
    negative film. The film is developed and playback is accomplished by
    shining light of a constant intensity onto the developed film. As the
    light goes through the film, the patterns on the film will change the
    intensity of the light that is received by a photoelectric cell. The
    change in light intensity results in a changing electric current which
    is sent into an amplifier and then to a loudspeaker.

    My favorite analog ROM uses a similar process, except it's for storing
    non-audio PC data [such as CPU instructions] in an analog form. Could
    be used as a replacement for current HDDs, though it's extremely
    impractical.

    It is only in this analog film version of ROM, that I don't mind - and
    actually prefer -- the moving parts.

    However, even in is this analog film ROM, I still prefer optical over
    magnetic. I still hate magnetic cassettes and wish optical tapes based
    on film-negatives were used instead.

    Last, but not least, the intensity-varying light shined onto the film
    [during recording] should intentionally be [by my choice] too dim. So
    the signal should be "amplified" within the film by using a stronger
    concentration of film-developing chemicals.

    In music, the audio characteristics of the film make my mouth-water.
    Yes, for some weird reason, the film's audio makes me hungry.

    Why not replace *Analog Magnetic Audio Tapes* with *Analog Optical
    Audio Tapes*??

    Analog optical audio is used in films and sound better than analog
    magnetic audio.

    Magnetic cassettes contain disgusting clicks whereas optical tape does
    not.

    Analog optical audio records and plays in the same manner as film
    does.

    The difference for me, is, I'd like to use only the negative film and
    no positive.

    Quotes from http://www.mtsu.edu/~smpte/twenties.html :

    "The Tri Ergon Process uses a technology known as variable density,
    which differed from a later process known as variable area. The Tri
    Ergon process had a patented flywheel mechanism on a sprocket which
    prevented variations in film speed. This flywheel helped prevent
    distortion of the audio. Tri Ergon relied on the use of a photo-
    electric cell to transduce mechanical sound vibrations into electrical
    waveforms and then convert the electrical waveforms into light waves.
    These light waves could then be optically recorded onto the edge of
    the film through a photographic process. Another photo-electric cell
    could then be used to transduce the waveform on the film into an
    electrical waveform during projection. This waveform could then be
    amplified and played to the audience in the Theater. The Fox Film
    Corporation acquired the rights to the Tri Ergon technology in 1927."

    Irrelevant but important notes: the only analogs that I like are the
    optical film and AM radio.
    Thanks for the explanation.
    No. I only want to effectively destroy the following scum of soundcard-
    based MIDI synths:

    A. Sample playback synths

    B. Softsynths

    C. Emulations

    D. Soundfonts

    I don't want to destroy soundcard-based MIDI synths other than A
    through D - A&D included. In addition, I don't want to destroy sample
    playback synths, softsynths, emulations, and soundfonts that are not
    based on soundcard MIDI.
     
  13. krw

    krw Guest

    Why not? ;-)
    It is.
    It is.. BIOS flash. You don't have flash on a CPU die. The
    processes are incompatible, by at *least* two generations.
    Since the FDIV, Intel really needs too. ;-) Others have done such
    things for a *long* time.
    Not like redheads! Who could possibly not like redheads?!!
     
  14. Radium

    Radium Guest

    Actually, I do like RAM, as long as it's in the form of a purely-
    electric silicon RAM chip. Now if it's a magnetic platter, then I
    don't like it. I long for the day when Flash RAM chips replace
    magnetic platters.

    The issue was ROM. As I said before, I prefer any digital ROM
    "storage" to be in form of chip circuits that freshly-generate
    electric signals of information.

    Now, if the ROM is analog, I prefer that it be stored in optical
    negative B&W film material much the like optical audio tracks of old
    B&W movies.
     
  15. krw

    krw Guest

    Eniac used a plugboard. It certainly was a digital computer.
    Depends. I used silicon (sand) to clean the plugboards on our analog
    computers. ;-)
    Eniac was a digital computer.
    Why not? Plug a wire or don't plug a wire. Sounds "binary" to me.
     
  16. krw

    krw Guest

    Your longing will be for a *LONG* time. Flash is expensive, compared
    to disk. Also note that flash has a fairly short life (100K - 1M
    write cycles).
    As has been pointed out before, you CANNOT "freshly generate"
    information. It must be stored somehow.
    No positive color film? Why would you want crude storage like that?
     
  17. Bob Myers

    Bob Myers Guest

    Of course the plugboard is digital - you put the plugs in with
    your fingers, don't you? What makes you think it's "analog"?

    Bob M.
     
  18. Well, a plugboard can be used also to program an _analog_
    computer. I had fun with those in college. Great at
    solving certain problems. Wonderfully smooth output curves.

    -- Robert
     
  19. Radium

    Radium Guest

     
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