Alarm Industry Union

[Jackcsg]

I know in previous posts I've stated that the industry needs to start taking
action on some of the issues within the Alarm Industry. We've countlessly
brought up standards, licensing, false alarms just to name a few. As I sit
here wondering how, where, when, to put, or organize a such an organization
together which could possibly best represent the Alarm Industry, I was
thinking about all the powerful organization that have gained credibility,
and how and where they started. I'm just throwing this out there, but, and
don't take this the wrong way. Unions are a strong point of American
Heritage. Traditionally they were started because workers, not owners, felt
discouragement, discrimination with being recognized, treated fairly, and
paid accordingly, and that their benefits to owners and corporations should
be recognized and had value. Typically a few, including myself, saw little
of no value of unions in today's many regulations regarding workers rights.
The states, and the Government have long changed the way workers are
treated. Not to carry on, but I can also see the power of people within
today's unions, outside just workers rights. The alarm industry has long
been the stepchild of an unknown industry. Everywhere, in almost every
State, we fall differently into the ranks of the organized, or the so called
organized. Unions are recognized by the Government, particularly the
"National Labor Relations Board", and protected by the US Constitution.

So my question is simple, and with a place to start. Exploring the rules and
regulations of the NLRB, it gives every right to any American to form a
Union. My thoughts are; has anyone ever explored the possibility of forming
such a Union. Researched any of the possibilities? I am interested in
forming a "research committee" to explore if any, the possibilities. Such as
the beginnings of a Charter that can, and will meet the requirements
dictated by the NLRB, establish rules and regulations, so on and so forth.
I'm serious. This has nothing to do with workers rights, or the rights of
employers. It has to do with the Industry at whole, and exploring the
options of forming such an organization.

Any thoughts are more than welcome, and if you which to be anonymous feel
free to email me personally.
[email protected]

Jack

 

[Aegis]

I know in previous posts I've stated that the industry needs to start taking
action on some of the issues within the Alarm Industry. We've countlessly
brought up standards, licensing, false alarms just to name a few. As I sit
here wondering how, where, when, to put, or organize a such an organization
together which could possibly best represent the Alarm Industry, I was
thinking about all the powerful organization that have gained credibility,
and how and where they started. I'm just throwing this out there, but, and
don't take this the wrong way. Unions are a strong point of American
Heritage. Traditionally they were started because workers, not owners, felt
discouragement, discrimination with being recognized, treated fairly, and
paid accordingly, and that their benefits to owners and corporations should
be recognized and had value. Typically a few, including myself, saw little
of no value of unions in today's many regulations regarding workers rights.
The states, and the Government have long changed the way workers are
treated. Not to carry on, but I can also see the power of people within
today's unions, outside just workers rights. The alarm industry has long
been the stepchild of an unknown industry. Everywhere, in almost every
State, we fall differently into the ranks of the organized, or the so called
organized. Unions are recognized by the Government, particularly the
"National Labor Relations Board", and protected by the US Constitution.

So my question is simple, and with a place to start. Exploring the rules and
regulations of the NLRB, it gives every right to any American to form a
Union. My thoughts are; has anyone ever explored the possibility of forming
such a Union. Researched any of the possibilities? I am interested in
forming a "research committee" to explore if any, the possibilities. Such as
the beginnings of a Charter that can, and will meet the requirements
dictated by the NLRB, establish rules and regulations, so on and so forth.
I'm serious. This has nothing to do with workers rights, or the rights of
employers. It has to do with the Industry at whole, and exploring the
options of forming such an organization.

Any thoughts are more than welcome, and if you which to be anonymous feel
free to email me personally.
[email protected]

Jack

This is one...

go to http://www.ibew.org/directory/
and Search by Classification (as) Alarm & Signal

I know alot of ADT branches are becoming Union, but I'm not sure if its this
one or not.

 

[Aegis]

This is one...

go to http://www.ibew.org/directory/
and Search by Classification (as) Alarm & Signal

I know alot of ADT branches are becoming Union, but I'm not sure if its this
one or not.

Ok... ADT branches that ARE union are in this one: http://www.cwa-union.org/

 

[Jackcsg]

Right. Away from that too. But endorsed. Alarm Industry Union.

Jack

 

[Jackcsg]

In a round about way...a little of both. But an emphasis on the later. As
with early unions, poor working conditions, pay, benefits, and more so
employer relations were the issues, and still a little today. It evolves
around all the issues really, and includes, I believe, both, with some to a
lesser degree, and others at a more important degree. I'm saying, the
research of outlining a charter which is instrumental to the industry at
whole.

Jack

 

[Mark Leuck]

No thanks, I've had my fill of unions

 

[Aegis]

Where do I sign?

The only reason we haven't gone union here is because there isn't a
dedicated body to do so. TCW might have a "division" for us, but their
primary goals will always be oriented towards phone people.

IBEW: Same thing; they mean well but they will always be oriented towards
electricians (I'm one of those who doesn't believe electricians, in general,
should be allowed in fire panels. Spent all day trying to figure out what
they did to one. ...and it was just a POWER SUPPLY! With 4 NAC circuits!)

 

[Jackcsg]

Right now it's in the R&D phase. First is to establish recognition, or
organization of compiling the necessary steps to achieve it. I think first
you can use a template of how a union is formed. Then Identify the issues,
and place it in a format that is "Real world" alarm industry issues. While
there are some aspects of a IBEW style union (as an example), when that
charter was started, obviously there were different issues at the time. What
are the current alarm industry issues? I would think an exploratory
committee of some kind would be a place to start, as to gather information,
to eventually form structure, and organization. Again I think the goal
overall is endorsement, and recognition. Definition and structure of the
Charter would be the first logical step. Input critical.

Jack

 

[Jackcsg]

That's fine Mark. I think there will be a lot misconstrued opinions about my
intentions, and the phrase Union, and it's meaning that we've all come to
learn about through experiences. While the structure I mentioned, or the
example I used, coined the phrase Union; I would imagine something far from
a Union by yesterdays standards, but the power of today's Unions. Stay tuned
and feel free to interject. Who knows...I'm curious to see any view points.
Good or bad. I'm not looking for an in or are you out, just simply to start
the ticker going.

Jack

 

[Mark Leuck]

That's fine Mark. I think there will be a lot misconstrued opinions about my
intentions, and the phrase Union, and it's meaning that we've all come to
learn about through experiences. While the structure I mentioned, or the
example I used, coined the phrase Union; I would imagine something far from
a Union by yesterdays standards, but the power of today's Unions. Stay tuned
and feel free to interject. Who knows...I'm curious to see any view points.
Good or bad. I'm not looking for an in or are you out, just simply to start
the ticker going.

Jack

Yesterdays or todays Union doesn't matter, I've had my fill of em

 

[Aegis]

Right now it's in the R&D phase. First is to establish recognition, or
organization of compiling the necessary steps to achieve it. I think first
you can use a template of how a union is formed. Then Identify the issues,
and place it in a format that is "Real world" alarm industry issues. While
there are some aspects of a IBEW style union (as an example), when that
charter was started, obviously there were different issues at the time. What
are the current alarm industry issues? I would think an exploratory
committee of some kind would be a place to start, as to gather information,
to eventually form structure, and organization. Again I think the goal
overall is endorsement, and recognition. Definition and structure of the
Charter would be the first logical step. Input critical.

Issue #1 nationwide is false alarm reduction (of course we can only slow or
stop the portion that our industry is responsible for).

Attacking that issue alone would get you endorsements from all over, I
think. With endorsements, at first, will come recognition.

 

[Jackcsg]

OK. So noted.

Jack

about

Yesterdays or todays Union doesn't matter, I've had my fill of em

 

[Aegis]

This is one...
go to http://www.ibew.org/directory/
and Search by Classification (as) Alarm & Signal

I know a lot of ADT branches are becoming Union, but I'm not sure if its this
one or not.

Mike Said;
I was a Journeyman with the IBEW local 3 for many years. They sold us down the
river when ADT closed 147 Central Stations. Money talks bullshit walks and who
don't love money? Get the drift.

Where is Jimmy Hoffa?

Of course, I had not heard of that happening. In what way did they "sell you
down the river"? By ceasing to be member of the IBEW? ...or some other way?

 

[Aegis]

Sounds like typical ADT strategy.

"We care!"
"We care!"
"You know we care, right!?"

"Who are you? Get out!"

 

[Frank Olson]

There is no way you're going to get an industry to "self regulate". Your
idea has merit (and I believe several State Alarm Associations are already
lobbying for it), but it will take State or Federal Governments to implement
"standards, training, certification, safety, licensing, etc."

 

[Jackcsg]

OK. Perhaps the coined phrase I made in reference to a "union" may be the
wrong verbiage. I fully understand what unions are today. I also understand
where they are today, is not how things started out originally. My reference
pertains to, such as the case of the "electrical" industry, that it was
through such an organization that the "industry" on a whole was transformed.
The is an Alarm Industry, but with no organized structure. No code book, no
rules, or regulations, nor a recognized charter. Instead we are pieces of
several other industries, and placed within existing ranks. In every State
Alarm Companies fall under someone's Jurisdiction. My point is more the
creating of a "Nationally" recognized organization for the purpose of a
structured industry. Such as, in the case I used, the IBEW. Not were that
organization is today, but the process and structure that started it, and
for much the same reason. How they became recognized by the AFL, and
eventually to the NLRB. An organization that will become endorsed by
existing organization as our own Industry.

Jack

 

[Jackcsg]

Yes Rob, that's my point. You have to look at it from the point of
endorsement, and not competition. Telephone workers back in the early days
were a division of the IBEW at one point. But they also managed to separate,
and established their own "union" recognized, and endorsed by the IBEW. We
need to look at all the issues, all the specialties within what would be
deemed an arm of the Alarm Industry. I mealy used the IBEW as a structured
organization example. One of which is approved by the NLRB. In today's
world, unlike unions of past, we need to define the worker issues, the
company owner issues, safety, standards, rules and regulations, Central
Station Issues, and especially a "National Alarm Code" for structuring a
Nationally recognized "Trade". My proposal was to form some kind of a
research committee to explore the possibility, identify the challenges, set
up structure, and achieve recognition (Long term). Has anyone ever looked at
it from this angle. I know it would be challenging.

Jack

 

[Jackcsg]

Mike you truly are what this industry actually represents. Have you ever
actually produced an intelligent thought? Seriously...after 33 years in the
trade have you learned nothing worth passing on? I have nothing personal
against you Mike, I just can't understand your motives here, besides your
snippy remarks, and constant love and dedication for Robert Bass, surely you
must have learned something in 33 years? I know your capable of intelligent
conversations.

Jack

 

[Mark Leuck]

Mike you truly are what this industry actually represents. Have you ever
actually produced an intelligent thought? Seriously...after 33 years in the
trade have you learned nothing worth passing on? I have nothing personal
against you Mike, I just can't understand your motives here, besides your
snippy remarks, and constant love and dedication for Robert Bass

My guess is he's bored

 

[Jackcsg]

There are lots of issues. However the industry needs National "Industry"
recognition first and primary. It should be broken down into "State" levels
as well. Much like the level of Government. As to the way a company chooses
to do business, your confused with individual company size as compared to
Industry size. The Nationals are not the majority of the industry. The
feeling of a need to fit in is an individual business practice, not a
standard. It's a Marketing scheme. The structure I'm speaking of first and
foremost pertains to organization of a charter to become recognized by the
NLRB. This charter would outline the structure of a lot of things, but
mainly it's purpose should be to form separation, and recognition. The alarm
industry; not the division of some established industry, such as electrical,
or communications or where other States would stick us. Like a States DOJ,
in some States, Electrical in others, and no where in a few. The issues in
which you speak of...all fall within; Rules and regulations, Technical
Structure (Technician levels), and most importantly a National Alarm Code,
which like the NEC, NFPA, would focus on minimum safety standards and
practices. I used the term "Union" which got a lot of people upset. But I
looked at the way a union was formed, and it's structure to make a
comparison. There are labor issue within the alarm industry. There are
safety concerns within the industry. Although a lot has changed in US Labor
Law Relations since the 40's, unions today have definitely changed their
ways. Mike referenced the Mafia, and to most, including me, it's the feeling
some have. I'm referring to their initial structure as a guideline for a
starting point.

Here stated:
``The objects of the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers are: to
organize all workers in the entire electrical industry in the United States
and Canada, including all those in public utilities and electrical
manufacturing, into local unions; to promote reasonable methods of work; to
cultivate feelings of friendship among those of our industry; to settle all
disputes between employers and employees by arbitration (if possible); to
assist each other in sickness or distress; to secure employment; to reduce
the hours of daily labor; to secure adequate pay for our work; to seek a
higher and higher standard of living; to seek security for the individual;
and by legal and proper means to elevate the moral, intellectual and social
conditions of our members, their families and dependents, in the interest of
a higher standard of citizenship."

I only use the early days of the IBEW as an example. But you should as well
read and understand where things started, not where they are.

Jack