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Aircar on show - must be something in this.

N

News

Jan 1, 1970
0
Well the aircar is being shown in full public view. Those scepitcs can
travel to Spain to actually see it. BTW, this is not spam.

Dear Friend,

We have pleasure in inviting you to the first ¨live¨ presentation of the MDI
Air Car. As somebody interested in the pollution-free, innovative technology
of the air car, we would like you to join us at the show, which takes place
on 7th November 2003, at 10.30 am at the Juan Carlos I hotel in Barcelona.

We will have on show a range of prototypes, one of which will be
demonstrated running on the hotel´s helipad. Director General of MDI, Mr Guy
Nègre, with his Finance Director Mr Paul Durand, will be present to answer
all questions, both technological and economic, put forward by attendees.
For the opening, we expect the presence of a senior politician from the
Spanish government (to be confirmed). We are inviting exclusively investors
and the national and international media.

Although we have already made three presentations, this will be the first
time a working car will be shown and we will completely open our technology
to the public. The previous presentations took place in Barcelona two years
ago, where a prototype without an engine was displayed, in Sao Paulo,
Brazil, where 600 professionals from the automotive sector met and the
third in London some months ago, among those present being the British
Environment Minister, Mr Meacher.

Since the room at the Juan Carlos I has a maximum capacity of 300 people, we
urge you to confirm your and any companions´ attendance soon by calling 00
34 93 362 37 00, asking for Anna Massana.

We thank you for your attention and hope to see you at the presentation in
November.

Yours sincerely,

Miguel Celades Rex

MDI Official Representative for Spain, Portugal, Latin America, UK & Canada
(translation by Alex Planidin)

Reservations by e-mail: [email protected]

English: www.theaircar.com

Español: www.motordeaire.com

Português: www.motormdi.com

The new model to be presented in Barcelona: The MiniCat
http://www.theaircar.com/MiniCats.html

Engine genealogy:

http://www.theaircar.com/genealogy.html

Road trial of the first prototype: http://www.theaircar.com/tests.html

New applications: Public transport
http://www.theaircar.com/further_applications.html

Press dossier:

http://www.theaircar.com/media_articles.html

Investors dossier: http://www.theaircar.com/investors_contactform.html
 
V

Vaughn

Jan 1, 1970
0
News said:
Well the aircar is being shown in full public view. Those scepitcs can
travel to Spain to actually see it. BTW, this is not spam.

Dear Mr. News
As we have told you many times, the way to impress the world consumer
is for the Aircar people to submit their product to independent third
parties for evaluation. Seeing a prototype at a show will tell us nothing,
save the company's bodywork skills.
We will have on show a range of prototypes, one of which will be
demonstrated running on the hotel´s helipad.

Specifically, the world needs to be convinced that the range claims are
credible by demonstrating the product in the in the real world, with real
drivers on real roads. This is something easily proven with simple
third-party road tests; circling around a heliport is a useless stunt.
We are inviting exclusively investors and the national and international
media.

So it is NOT public.
... this will be the first time a working car will be shown

And you were telling us otherwise a few months ago, you said many
people rode it it. Parlor trick or lie?
and we will completely open our technology to the public.

This is a positive step. Why not take another step and allow the
automotive press a few hours alone with demonstrators, as is commonly done
in the automotive world?
Since the room at the Juan Carlos I has a maximum capacity of 300
people..

To reiterate...NOT public.

Sorry News, but I see no good news for your investment here.

Bye;
Vaughn
 
D

Dave Hinz

Jan 1, 1970
0
Well the aircar is being shown in full public view. Those scepitcs can
travel to Spain to actually see it. BTW, this is not spam.

Great, when does the independant analysis happen?
 
N

News

Jan 1, 1970
0
Vaughn said:
Dear Mr. News
As we have told you many times, the way to impress the world consumer
is for the Aircar people to submit their product to independent third
parties for evaluation. Seeing a prototype at a show will tell us nothing,
save the company's bodywork skills.

The car is to be run and people will see the works, etc, etc. A car ahead
of all others in the world is not likley to be given to others to peer
inside the works in detail. If they did they would be mad.

When it is available to the public then people can strip it down.
This is a positive step. Why not take another step and allow the
automotive press a few hours alone with demonstrators, as is commonly done
in the automotive world?

I see backing off from the total scam angle then? This is not a run of the
mill IC engine. This is "very" different. They are also after people's
suggestions for other uses, such as co-gen, etc.
Sorry News, but I see no good news for your investment here.

None of my money is in it. It is the technology that interests, hence in
this forum.
 
V

Vaughn

Jan 1, 1970
0
News said:
The car is to be run and people will see the works, etc, etc.

Then why not clear up this confusion over their range claims?
A car ahead
of all others in the world is not likley to be given to others to peer
inside the works in detail.

Apparently you did not read your own post which contained: "we will
completely open our technology
to the public". So I ask you again: Why not clear up this confusion over
their range claims?

When it is available to the public then people can strip it down.

I have never heard of an automotive journalist stripping a car down.
Do you have any documentation that this is truly a concern and the reason
why the Aircar people refuse to prove their range claims? Particularly when
they say: "we will completely open our technology to the public"?
I see backing off from the total scam angle then?

No, just being polite.
This is not a run of the mill IC engine. This is "very" different.

Exactly; it is an air-driven engine, something that is known to be very
thermodynamically inefficient.
None of my money is in it. It is the technology that interests, hence in
this forum.

So you say.

Vaughn
 
I

Ian Stirling

Jan 1, 1970
0
News said:
Well the aircar is being shown in full public view. Those scepitcs can
travel to Spain to actually see it. BTW, this is not spam.


Dear Friend,

We have pleasure in inviting you to the first ?live? presentation of the MDI
Air Car. As somebody interested in the pollution-free, innovative technology
of the air car, we would like you to join us at the show, which takes place
on 7th November 2003, at 10.30 am at the Juan Carlos I hotel in Barcelona.

We will have on show a range of prototypes, one of which will be
demonstrated running on the hotel?s helipad. Director General of MDI, Mr Guy

Running on, or running above untethered in control?
 
D

Dave Hinz

Jan 1, 1970
0
The car is to be run and people will see the works, etc, etc. A car ahead
of all others in the world is not likley to be given to others to peer
inside the works in detail. If they did they would be mad.
When it is available to the public then people can strip it down.

Until then, it's still nothing. I wasted enough time on you last time
around, so I'm going to save myself that effort and <***PLONK***> you
at this time; maybe others will dance for you.
 
S

Steve Spence

Jan 1, 1970
0
untethered? this is supposedly a land based vehicle that runs on air, not an
airborne virus, oops, I mean vehicle.

--
Steve Spence
www.green-trust.org
Ian Stirling said:
Guy

Running on, or running above untethered in control?
Greenbank
 
M

mark Ransley

Jan 1, 1970
0
Pollution free? haa, Run on a helliport in a circle, guess it cant
make it on a road , those little hidden nicad packs wear out fast.
Looking for " Investors " you mean Suckers.
 
F

Fred B. McGalliard

Jan 1, 1970
0
....
Exactly; it is an air-driven engine, something that is known to be very
thermodynamically inefficient.

Or, to be completely correct, known to be very very difficult to build in
such a way that it can achieve efficiency. (The only way I know of is a
large number of small stages with really good heat exchangers.)
 
N

News

Jan 1, 1970
0
Dave Hinz said:
Until then, it's still nothing. I wasted enough time on you last time
around, so I'm going to save myself that effort and <***PLONK***>

Thank you.
 
M

mark Ransley

Jan 1, 1970
0
It says to me there is no working motor or prototype.
 
W

William P.N. Smith

Jan 1, 1970
0
It says to me there is no working motor or prototype.

It is kinda confusing, isn't it:

/*
Actual tested prototype

Part 2 of the report analyzes the effective performances reached by
the actual prototype, named 34p01-1. Due to delay in the realization,
the actual tested prototype is not the complete 3-stage air engine but
only the last stage.
*/

So there _is_ a prototype, or a prototype of the third stage of a
three stage engine, though the forcasted efficiency of the car:
autonomy in between 117 to 146km (73 to 91miles)

is based on an engine with 85% efficiency (the prototype was 70-75%),
and 2% leakage (the prototype was 10% leaky), and:

/*
To move the project from the design stage to the manufacturing
process, a lot of development work is needed in order to reach the
level of efficiencies required for the forecasted autonomy.
*/

OTOH, it's not clear it was an actual independent test:

/*
MDI has performed various tests on their actual prototype and sent us
the available results (power, rotation speed, pressures, temperatures
and duration time for different running conditions). The analysis of
these results permits to evaluate the energy performances of the
actual prototype.
*/

And the conclusion:

/*
MDI has developed the global design of the 34p01-4 engine, which is
not running yet. A significant work for optimization and control is
still necessary to lead to an available prototype.
*/

[FWIW, we were kinda hoping for an independent test of the actual
working aircar, you know, where someone from a car magazine takes it
for a test drive, then refills it at the refuelling station, and
drives it again, while recording the kilowatthours required to refill
the filling station's tanks.] The 'someone' from the car magazine
could have a chaperone along to make sure they don't disassemble it on
the test drive, and the car magazine could station someone at the
refuelling compresor to make sure
 
S

Steve Spence

Jan 1, 1970
0
[FWIW, we were kinda hoping for an independent test of the actual
working aircar, you know, where someone from a car magazine takes it
for a test drive, then refills it at the refuelling station, and
drives it again, while recording the kilowatthours required to refill
the filling station's tanks.] The 'someone' from the car magazine
could have a chaperone along to make sure they don't disassemble it on
the test drive, and the car magazine could station someone at the
refuelling compresor to make sure

Fat chance .....
 
M

Michael Baugh

Jan 1, 1970
0
Well, I think it was a very good presentation, and that
it answered a lot of questions. Such as:does it exist beyond
design stage?

It says to me there is no working motor or prototype.

It is kinda confusing, isn't it:

/*
Actual tested prototype

Part 2 of the report analyzes the effective performances reached by
the actual prototype, named 34p01-1. Due to delay in the realization,
the actual tested prototype is not the complete 3-stage air engine but
only the last stage.
*/

So there _is_ a prototype, or a prototype of the third stage of a
three stage engine, though the forcasted efficiency of the car:
autonomy in between 117 to 146km (73 to 91miles)

is based on an engine with 85% efficiency (the prototype was 70-75%),
and 2% leakage (the prototype was 10% leaky), and:

/*
To move the project from the design stage to the manufacturing
process, a lot of development work is needed in order to reach the
level of efficiencies required for the forecasted autonomy.
*/

OTOH, it's not clear it was an actual independent test:

/*
MDI has performed various tests on their actual prototype and sent us
the available results (power, rotation speed, pressures, temperatures
and duration time for different running conditions). The analysis of
these results permits to evaluate the energy performances of the
actual prototype.
*/

And the conclusion:

/*
MDI has developed the global design of the 34p01-4 engine, which is
not running yet. A significant work for optimization and control is
still necessary to lead to an available prototype.
*/

[FWIW, we were kinda hoping for an independent test of the actual
working aircar, you know, where someone from a car magazine takes it
for a test drive, then refills it at the refuelling station, and
drives it again, while recording the kilowatthours required to refill
the filling station's tanks.] The 'someone' from the car magazine
could have a chaperone along to make sure they don't disassemble it on
the test drive, and the car magazine could station someone at the
refuelling compresor to make sure
 
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