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advantages of cable lacing?

T

Tim Wescott

Jan 1, 1970
0
cable lacing... a lost art.

Is there anything that a laced cable-bundle does better than a
tie-wrapped cable-bundle?
Feed through a round tube.

Look good.

Lacing is still alive and well, it's used for many harnesses in
aerospace equipment, although tie-wrap is being used as well.
 
J

John Kunkel

Jan 1, 1970
0
cable lacing... a lost art.

Is there anything that a laced cable-bundle does better than a
tie-wrapped cable-bundle?


I don't know about "does better" but it sure looks good.

My background is in aviation maintenance and I laced the wires in a street
rod years ago; very labor intensive but I got some comments on it from those
had never seen it done. IMO it looks better in bundles where the wire is all
the same color, the various colored wire commonly used in automotive
applications doesn't look as good laced.
 
M

Matt Whiting

Jan 1, 1970
0
cable lacing... a lost art.

Is there anything that a laced cable-bundle does better than a
tie-wrapped cable-bundle?

I think it looks nicer, but functionally I don't believe there is any
difference. Both methods keep the wires neat and organized.


Matt
 
C

CJT

Jan 1, 1970
0
cable lacing... a lost art.

Is there anything that a laced cable-bundle does better than a
tie-wrapped cable-bundle?

Lacing might contribute a little extra strength in the long direction.

Plus, as others have noted, it looks better.
 
W

w_tom

Jan 1, 1970
0
Lacing (if it really a nylon laced tube) protects wires from
failure due to constant vibration (ie automotive). Also the
lacing can hold cable together over long distances without
compressing insulation too tightly at the nylon ty wrapped.
Missing information is the environment for that cable. Looks
really have little to due with why things are done.
Furthermore, sometimes a better looking (cleaner) installation
can make things electrically worse.
 
P

Phil

Jan 1, 1970
0
w_tom said:
Lacing (if it really a nylon laced tube) protects wires from
failure due to constant vibration (ie automotive). Also the
lacing can hold cable together over long distances without
compressing insulation too tightly at the nylon ty wrapped.
Missing information is the environment for that cable. Looks
really have little to due with why things are done.
Furthermore, sometimes a better looking (cleaner) installation
can make things electrically worse.

Tie-wrapping can also turn a bundle of RF cables into a bundle of RF
filters!
 
C

CJT

Jan 1, 1970
0
Phil said:
Tie-wrapping can also turn a bundle of RF cables into a bundle of RF
filters!

.... and make crosstalk more of an issue.
 
N

NSM

Jan 1, 1970
0
| cable lacing... a lost art.
|
| Is there anything that a laced cable-bundle does better than a
| tie-wrapped cable-bundle?

Don't overlook spiral wrapping.

N
 
F

Floyd L. Davidson

Jan 1, 1970
0
Matt Whiting said:
I think it looks nicer, but functionally I don't believe there
is any difference. Both methods keep the wires neat and
organized.

That is true... *if* both are done correctly.

However, the usual poor job of lacing will have few if any
negative effects, while a poor job of using tie-wraps can
1) put crimps in the cables, 2) literally break wires, and
3) leave some very sharp edges that can slice up hands that
handle the bundle years into the future.

Hence, if the craftperson knows what they're doing... lacing is
pretty and tie-wrapping is easy. If they don't really know the
difference, lacing is safer.
 
B

Blueskies

Jan 1, 1970
0
cable lacing... a lost art.

Is there anything that a laced cable-bundle does better than a
tie-wrapped cable-bundle?

Less cut knuckles.

Less expensive?

Lighter?
 
M

Matt Whiting

Jan 1, 1970
0
Phil said:
Tie-wrapping can also turn a bundle of RF cables into a bundle of RF
filters!

How is tie wrapping any worse than lacing in this regard?

Matt
 
W

w_tom

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ty wrap, for example, a coaxial cable. Now wire's
characteristic impedance is changed where ty wrap pressure has
changed dimensions of cable.
 
P

Phil

Jan 1, 1970
0
w_tom said:
Ty wrap, for example, a coaxial cable. Now wire's
characteristic impedance is changed where ty wrap pressure has
changed dimensions of cable.

That is the answer indeed.



Applying tie wraps on a coaxial cable with a copper braid - even without
exaggerating the pressure - precisely every 20 cm or so over tens of meters
makes great filters.



I suppose lacing allows a milder treatment for RF cables.



Phil
 
S

Sam Goldwasser

Jan 1, 1970
0
CJT said:
Lacing might contribute a little extra strength in the long direction.

Plus, as others have noted, it looks better.

And, you don't get flesh wounds from the cut ends of nylon cable ties. :)

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G

Gregg

Jan 1, 1970
0
In the case of temprature extremes (outdoor applications, direct UV
exposure or vacuum tube chassis), I belive a laced bundle will outlive a
tie strapped bundle. Also more economical - have you seen the prices of
zip-ties that can handle the environmental extremes of good ol' lacing?
EEEK!
 
M

Matt Whiting

Jan 1, 1970
0
w_tom said:
Ty wrap, for example, a coaxial cable. Now wire's
characteristic impedance is changed where ty wrap pressure has
changed dimensions of cable.

You don't have to apply 50 lbs of tension to the tie wrap! :)

Matt
 
D

Dr. Anton T. Squeegee

Jan 1, 1970
0
I think it looks nicer, but functionally I don't believe there is any
difference. Both methods keep the wires neat and organized.

Indeed there is a difference, notably in the aviation world.

Look inside the avionics bay of a commercial jet sometime. Come to
think of it, look at the innards of any piece of older avionics gear
that uses point-to-point wiring instead of, or in addition to, a printed
circuit backplane. What you'll see is the absence of tie-wraps, and an
abundance of laced cable harnesses.

I used to work at Boeing, and I had some friends in the Wire
Design group. I asked about this very question once. I was told that
tie-wraps are not favored for two reasons.

(1) If the tension on the tie-wrap is too high, it can crush
fragile coaxial cables.

(2) It's much easier to damage wire insulation under tie-wraps in
a high-vibration environment. Lacing twine is nowhere near as sharp
along its edges, and thus does not nick or cut said insulation.

Keep the peace(es).


--
Dr. Anton T. Squeegee, Director, Dutch Surrealist Plumbing Institute.
(Known to some as Bruce Lane, ARS KC7GR,
kyrrin (a/t) bluefeathertech[d=o=t]calm -- www.bluefeathertech.com
"If Salvador Dali had owned a computer, would it have been equipped
with surreal ports?"
 
N

NSM

Jan 1, 1970
0
| > Matt Whiting wrote:
| >
| >>How is tie wrapping any worse than lacing in this regard?
| >>
| >>Matt
|
| You don't have to apply 50 lbs of tension to the tie wrap! :)
|
| Matt

I pull them up till they break then loosen them two clicks.
Or else I pull them up as tight as they'll go then add another 50 lbs.

N
 
P

Paul Hovnanian P.E.

Jan 1, 1970
0
Phil said:
That is the answer indeed.

Applying tie wraps on a coaxial cable with a copper braid - even without
exaggerating the pressure - precisely every 20 cm or so over tens of meters
makes great filters.

I suppose lacing allows a milder treatment for RF cables.

I think the advantage of lacing here is that the loops around the bundle
are held in place along the length of the bundle. With tie wraps, more
pressure is needed to keep them from slipping over time.
 
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