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A Question about Toyota Prius

P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
Mridul said:
Hey Hey guys cool it!

Why not do a simple viability test on this application.
Surely, the drag would increase; BUT how much? does it consumes more
than it can produce?

It has to. The laws of thermodynamics determine this.
Regarding the turbocharger, its benefit to loss ratio is more than one.

What do you mean ? A turbocharger deosn't provide enrgy directly. It increases
power output by increasing the air-fuel charge mass i.e. the engine no longer
works at atmospheric pressure but at a 'boosted' pressure.
Does the turbine on a vehicle have it so?

What turbine ?

Graham
 
D

Derek Broughton

Jan 1, 1970
0
Mridul said:
Hey Hey guys cool it!

Why not do a simple viability test on this application.
Surely, the drag would increase; BUT how much? does it consumes more
than it can produce?

That's the point. OF COURSE it consumes more power than it can produce
(unless you always drive _into_ the wind). Try looking up "Thermodynamics"
in Wikipedia.
Regarding the turbocharger, its benefit to loss ratio is more than one.

Does the turbine on a vehicle have it so?

No.
 
M

Me

Jan 1, 1970
0
lol.........Peoples like you (ASSHOLES) called idiot to Newton and other
great scientist but then what happened every one knows.

So you better stay that way as an ASSHOLEEEEEEEE

It would help if you could actually communicate in the "Kings English"
rather than some illiterate slang you learned hanging out in the Hood.
"Peoples" isn't the plural of "People"....and "called idiot to Newton"
doesn't make a whole lot of sense, either. Even if for you, English is
a second language, your grammer needs specific attention, for you to be
able to communicate with your "Betters".......

Me who occasionally replies to KnuckleDraggers like you.......
 
M

Me

Jan 1, 1970
0
So what rocket
science or complexity you see here ? Its a simple designe and can be
acheived. I don't see any additional drag on the vehicale. May be it added
another 10-20 lbs as turbine weight but on the other hand we can reduce the
number of batteries carryin on board cauz of additional power generation
capacity in the vehicale. A simple example is turbo charged engine, Its
turbine again that produces extra horse power in engine ?

It is a really good thing, that you aren't a Rocket Scientist, (what
ever that is, by definition) because your grasp of Basic Engineering is
lower than a Japanees GradeSchool Kid. You haven't even come close to
discribing the DRAG that the Turbine would cause, by the speed of the
vehical to which it is attached, pushing the turbine thru the air.
Some of that energy would be converted into the power you suggest my be
available for battery charging. However, a consideable amount of that
power produced by the DRAG of the turbine, would be lost in friction
with the air, friction in the mechanical elements that connect the
turbine to the generator, or alternator, as the case may be, power lost
to heat in the generator/alternator, power lost in the inefficencies of
battery charging, and the inherant inefficencies of the Turbine to air
interface itself. All of the above stated LOSSES, combined would
certainly make the recoverd battery charging efficeny lower than 20%, at
best. Hmmmmm, looks like 100% input in DRAG Power equals 20% input to
battery power and a LOSS of 80% of the power to outside enviorment.
Not really very good at all.......
What do you think? Are you looking good or what? KnuckleDragger......


Me
 
Y

You

Jan 1, 1970
0
Mridul said:
Surely, the drag would increase; BUT how much? does it consumes more
than it can produce?

Just poseing the question, puts your engineering skills in question....
Laws of ThermoDynamics!!! or don't you have to obey these Laws.......
 
A

Arnold Walker

Jan 1, 1970
0
You said:
Just poseing the question, puts your engineering skills in question....
Laws of ThermoDynamics!!! or don't you have to obey these Laws.......
Hell .....make it a sailing car.
Maybe drop in the jib sail on the long country run.
With the right tack and ballast ...you might out run a Prius.
At least ,the way I seen them drove.....maybe an out rigger to the get a
little more bite into the wind
with 9ft wide two seater.
 
B

Bob Adkins

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you read his other posts you can see he has no interest in learning or
possibly any ability to learn.

Typical idiot kid let loose with a PC. See his nick for example.

Graham, you wouldn't believe the number of people that would buy his wind
turbine idea. I bet you that 8 out of 10 educated people could be talked
into believing it was possible to get a net energy gain from the turbines.
That does not mean that 80% of the people are idiots or mental defectives.
It simply means they slept through their physics classes.

On the other hand, around 8 people out of 10 are very kind and forgiving of
other people when they make an honest mistake. That puts you in the
minority. ;)
 
P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bob said:
Graham, you wouldn't believe the number of people that would buy his wind
turbine idea. I bet you that 8 out of 10 educated people could be talked
into believing it was possible to get a net energy gain from the turbines.
That does not mean that 80% of the people are idiots or mental defectives.
It simply means they slept through their physics classes.

On the other hand, around 8 people out of 10 are very kind and forgiving of
other people when they make an honest mistake. That puts you in the
minority. ;)

Well...... I don't jump down everybody's throat at the first opportunity I can
assure you. However, having seen some of his other utterings, I wasn't minded to
pussy foot around in this instance.

If ppl are going to post here, the least one can expect is a modicum of
scientific knowledge.

Graham
 
D

Derek Broughton

Jan 1, 1970
0
Me said:
Even if for you, English is
a second language, your grammer needs specific attention,

Oh dear. One really should avoid spelling mistakes when flaming a poster's
English. "Grammar", my friend.
 
P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
BobG said:
The Harrier AV8A had a RAT (Ram Air Turbine) that popped out into the
airstream that would run the essential bus if the generator dropped
out. Now that was a couple of hundred mile an hour air stream....

Commercial airliners have them too.

A couple of Canadian jets are somewhat thankful for them. Air Canada ( the Gimli
Glider ) and more recently Air Transat in the Azores. Both suffered fuel
exhaustion.

Graham
 
Well...... I don't jump down everybody's throat at the first opportunity I
can
assure you. However, having seen some of his other utterings, I wasn't
minded to
pussy foot around in this instance.

If ppl are going to post here, the least one can expect is a modicum of
scientific knowledge.

Graham

News Group belongs to no one and neither it is a written rules any where
that you can post Phd class questions ....... every one can post any
thing..... if you don't like it or if it doesn't qualify your knowledge
criteria then simply shut up and you have no right to call people Idiot
here.

You are trying to claim in these news group that you are a fucking top
knowledgeable person, well most will agree that .....YOU ARE CERTIFIED
ASSHOLE .....cauz if you don't know the decency rule and how to talk with
other person then you are just one fucking MORON . So take all that fucking
knowledge shovel it in ya ass and be DIGNIFIED. If all that physics rules
you are trying to dictate here doesn't teach you one simple rule of respect
for others then you must belong to some shitt hole and its not your fault,
its their fault who brought you in this world and taught u nothing.

You started this shitt so be it that way, we don't mind humiliate you in
other thread cauz a person who has no respect for others deserve shitt and
thats what you are. So have fun faggot.........==>
 
P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
So take all that fucking knowledge shovel it in ya ass and be DIGNIFIED

I suppose you'd like us all to be dragged down to your level ?

If you talk shit expect to have it thrown right back at you.

Graham
 
Pooh Bear said:
Commercial airliners have them too.

A couple of Canadian jets are somewhat thankful for them. Air Canada ( the
Gimli
Glider ) and more recently Air Transat in the Azores. Both suffered fuel
exhaustion.

Graham

Suffererd fuel exhastion not cauz of tubine but cuaz of some Nasty Ass
Person like you who was piloting the aircraft and mis-calculated the fuel.
 
D

David Hunt

Jan 1, 1970
0
This is a good question.
It has two answers.
They are: Yes and No

No:
A wind turbine is designed to spin around and absorb all of the wind's
energy. Even though you can see through it, it basically spins so fast that
the 40mph wind hitting it in the front might only be 5-10mph after getting
through the turbine. In a way, the turbine acts just like a sail does. It
blocks the wind energy from going through it. A windturbine usually takes
this energy and runs a generator with the energy. (turbine, generator,
mechanical parts all have inefficiencies in them. This makes for a net loss
of energy taken from the wind being generated as electricity). In a
sailboat, the energy taken form the wind is transferred into propulsion for
the boat. When the wind is blowing, the sailboat goes with the wind by
tapping into this wind energy, but when they get downwind and want to
return, they can't turn around and start up a motor and push through the
wind -with the sail up- easily. It would take great horsepower to fight the
wind with the sail open.
Unfortunately placing a turbine up on the Prius is sort of like this. Yes
you will make some electrical power, but it will be much lower than the
amount of power you placed into it to push it through the air.

Yes.
1. If you were driving in the direction of the wind, and if the
tailwind was traveling faster than your car. Then the turbine would act as
a sail (with the resistance from the wind) and some electrical net gain
would be made (as well as propulsion energy from the turbine resistance in t
he wind). This energy, though, would come from mother nature's wind and
would only work with this fast tailwind. For it to, overall, provide you
with a net gain, you would have to take the turbine down whenever this
condition was not present.
2. One way a turbine would be productive on a car would be if you
could run it as an electric vehicle and lived -or worked- in a windy
location. If you had a windturbine installed on the vehicle that was able to
be raised and lowered you could keep it down while driving, but put it up
while the car was stopped to top off the batteries. This might work if you
parked -for instance- near sea breezes, or other places were a consistent
wind was reliably present. This could work! I suspect, though, that the idea
of spinning turbines in a beach parking area that was not actively being
monitored might cause a problem with the communities they were parked in.
Their noise and aesthetic view might bring fast local codes into action
against them as well. If these issues could be solved.... it might work!!

I hope this gives you some information on how this initial thought
(idea) might progress. Keep up the thinking part. Most of the educated and
intelligent people in this subject can only invent from a book. It is tough
to be perfect; thank God they are -and we aren't! You posted an idea, and
they only looked at the initial idea you asked about. Their insistence that
it will never work, does not mean slight deviations in design direction
might not come up with something that will work. That is how true inventions
evolve. Go with it !!

Dave
 
P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
Suffererd fuel exhastion not cauz of tubine

That would have been difficult seeing as how the RAT doesn't deploy until the
fuel's already exhausted.
but cuaz of some Nasty Ass
Person like you who was piloting the aircraft and mis-calculated the fuel.

In Air Transat's case because a fuel pipe ruptured due to improper maintenance
actually. In Air Canada's case a long string of misunderstandings and confusion
over regulations and methods originally caused by a defective fuel 'computer'.

Graham
 
P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
David said:
This is a good question.
It has two answers.
They are: Yes and No

No:
A wind turbine is designed to spin around and absorb all of the wind's
energy. Even though you can see through it, it basically spins so fast that
the 40mph wind hitting it in the front might only be 5-10mph after getting
through the turbine.

Of course the fact that the wind exits the turbine at 5-10 mph means that you
haven't actually extracted *all * the energy from it.

Yes.
1. If you were driving in the direction of the wind, and if the
tailwind was traveling faster than your car. Then the turbine would act as
a sail

Have you been watching Top Gear ?

" May's car (with its sailing mast) struggled with low objects, such as bridges
and trees "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Top_Gear_episodes

Graham
 
P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
soundhaspriority said:
Dave,
The patience and thoroughness with which you answered the question is
exemplary.

And probably entirely lost on Mr DIY turbine-on-the-roof .

Graham
 
D

David Hunt

Jan 1, 1970
0
Of course the fact that the wind exits the turbine at 5-10 mph means that you
haven't actually extracted *all * the energy from it.

How true my dear friend.
I realized that when I wrote it. Thanks for pointing it out though.
Other than a Sail or a stationary object (such as a building) do you know of
any turbines that have NO airflow through them?

Have you been watching Top Gear ?

I can't.
My transmission has a cover on it.
I imagine that might not be what you are talking about, but you need to
explain it better.
Have ever seen a Bluejay or a cardinal?

And, yes, I still think it would act as a sail !

" May's car (with its sailing mast) struggled with low objects, such as bridges
and trees "

Who the heck is May?
A little better direction please, and I'll check it out.

I am a little baffled that you felt compelled to say something about my
post.
Is it because it is all wrong.
Or that you wouldn't do it that way?
If it is all wrong... then it needs to be worked on.
If it is just because YOU wouldn't do it that way.. then shut up.
I suppose you will insist that I buy the same vehicle make as you do as
well.
Too bad... I like my choice already.
I also know your car maker has made quite a few lemons (lemons.. meaning
cars that are complete crap) in their time.

please reply.
a person with OCD (obsessive compulsive disorder) will have too.
So I expect to read your reply soon.

dave
 
Pooh Bear said:
I suppose you'd like us all to be dragged down to your level ?

If you talk shit expect to have it thrown right back at you.

Graham

What is your level by the way ? shitt and be shitt

I didn't see any other going to your level so far ? reason is simple, others
have self respect and knows how to respect others and thats what you are
missing Mr. Fucktard. Thats why I called you again and again "A CERTIFIED
ASSHOLE" in this news group.
 
P

Pooh Bear

Jan 1, 1970
0
David said:
How true my dear friend.
I realized that when I wrote it. Thanks for pointing it out though.

YW. :~)

Other than a Sail or a stationary object (such as a building) do you know of
any turbines that have NO airflow through them?

That would confound their objective ! ;~)

I can't.
My transmission has a cover on it.
I imagine that might not be what you are talking about, but you need to
explain it better.

Top Gear is a UK 'car show'.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/topgear/
http://www.topgear.com/
Have ever seen a Bluejay or a cardinal?

I haven't.

And, yes, I still think it would act as a sail !


Who the heck is May?
A little better direction please, and I'll check it out.

Mr May is a presenter on the TV porogramme Top Gear. He modified a car by adding
a sail ( amongst other things ) in order to sail across a lake !

I am a little baffled that you felt compelled to say something about my
post.
Is it because it is all wrong.

No. It was just the comment about *all* the energy that caught my attention.

Or that you wouldn't do it that way?
If it is all wrong... then it needs to be worked on.
If it is just because YOU wouldn't do it that way.. then shut up.
I suppose you will insist that I buy the same vehicle make as you do as
well.
Too bad... I like my choice already.
I also know your car maker has made quite a few lemons (lemons.. meaning
cars that are complete crap) in their time.

Saab ? Which ones don't you like ?

Graham
 
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